State Parks' Reasoning for the SUS restrictions at Sano and Doho

[PonoBill]

Jay--Gracious isn't a great word when you're talking about regulating a public resource, but I suspect you are right. To do this well and be effective, I believe you need an organized group and a specific plan. Regulators don't pay much attention to politicians unless there's something they want, which is actually a good thing. Politicians care about money and votes--I doubt SUP advocates would have a huge block of either. But regulators need to pay special attention to the rights of minorities.

If you have a plan--say, to extend the current permitted zone another X yards north, that plan could be consistently pushed forward. You could build a platform around it. Document the numbers of SUP surfers vs. surfers. Show the light usage by surfers of the target area. Photograph the differential crowding and parking. Petition politicians, keep the pressure up.

Once they cave you have a precedent for the decision. If SUP usage grows beyond prone usage there's a reason to press for more. If it doesn't, then it's not much of a problem. Personally I'd hate to see SUP beginners mixing it up in the rest of SO. It's ugly enough as it is.

I would try get Cal Boating to change their characterization of SUPs as vessels to follow the CG regulation. Takes a leg out of the stool.

Sano--your post popped up when I was finishing mine. I have the same nightmare.

[SUP surf chick]

I don't know the answer, or if there even needs to be one, as I was more or less just thinking out loud as to some possible concerns of the "be careful what you wish for" nature.

Just saying.....

I think we all know who you're talking about,  the guy on the butt board, and yeah, he's a real drag.

And I agree that we have a lot to think about here. How far do we take the fight,  and at what point  do we shoot ourselves in the proverbial foot by pushing? I'd like to hear from a few more folks (Alan, where are you?).

I think that if nothing else,  this communication with SP really clears things up, especially knowing that they can't call us out from anywhere as long as we are 100 feet from bathers. That means we could  actually be at middles or churches or old man's as long as it's that "safe" distance (and let's face it, it's pretty damn hard to tell what 100 feet is when you're in the water). The lifeguards are definitely not all on the same page about this. So if push comes to shove and an actual confrontation with a lifeguard ensues, we actually know the details about  the codes and can then challenge them on the spot.

With winter coming there will be less people in the water and it's possible to get old man's or upper Dogpatch with hardly anybody else there. so yeah,  I think we do need to weigh our options as far as how far to push.

[SUP surf chick]

Jay--Gracious isn't a great word when you're talking about regulating a public resource, but I suspect you are right. To do this well and be effective, I believe you need an organized group and a specific plan. Regulators don't pay much attention to politicians unless there's something they want, which is actually a good thing. Politicians care about money and votes--I doubt SUP advocates would have a huge block of either. But regulators need to pay special attention to the rights of minorities.

If you have a plan--say, to extend the current permitted zone another X yards north, that plan could be consistently pushed forward. You could build a platform around it. Document the numbers of SUP surfers vs. surfers. Show the light usage by surfers of the target area. Photograph the differential crowding and parking. Petition politicians, keep the pressure up.

Once they cave you have a precedent for the decision. If SUP usage grows beyond prone usage there's a reason to press for more. If it doesn't, then it's not much of a problem. Personally I'd hate to see SUP beginners mixing it up in the rest of SO. It's ugly enough as it is.

I would try get Cal Boating to change their characterization of SUPs as vessels to follow the CG regulation. Takes a leg out of the stool.

Sano--your post popped up when I was finishing mine. I have the same nightmare.

This all makes a lot of sense to me. Incremental change. This is how we do things in the context of international human rights.

[supsurf-tw]

It's good to get responses to the issues at hand. There are a lot of very valid points being made in my opinion.

[supdiscobay]

So, do they classify a surfer on a prone board as a "bather"?

[SUP surf chick]

So, do they classify a surfer on a prone board as a "bather"?

Yes, as I understand it.

[PonoBill]

That's an interesting bit of bureaucratic flimflam. Hard to call a surfer a bather and then have blackballs that boot them out when conditions threaten "bathers". The different nomenclature separates powered craft from unpowered, and by calling SUPs vessels they get to lump them in that category. It's a scam, there's no practical operational difference between a SUP and a surfboard, especially today with intermediate/expert SUP surfers being on smaller boards than longboarders ride.

[SanCKid]

 [*1]   SECTION 1. Section 651.1 is added to the Harbors and Navigation Code, to read:
   § 651.1.
   As used in this chapter, unless the context clearly requires a different meaning, "bather" or "bathing" means a person floating, swimming, wading, or bodysurfing, with or without the use of a flotation device, including, but not limited to, floating upon or with the aid of a surfboard, paddle board, surfmat, innertube, life preserver, or air mattress, except a flotation device which is designed to be propelled by sail, mechanical means, power, oars, or paddle.

[Califoilia]

Here's the whole H&N Code.....in case anyone might need the code in its entirety for some reason(s), and not just post individual section (Chapter 5, Article 1 has the section(s) in question).

[1tuberider]

Looks like the paddle is excluding sup from bathing areas.

This will require a rule change or exception to surf on the excluded bathing areas. For now you may have to leave the paddle on the beach or change the way you sup.

Not to change subjects but "assault rifles" are legal with bullet buttons instead of the mag release.

Is there not a way to change the nature of a paddle to an aid for surfing without calling it a paddle? Just tinkling
out loud.

[all~wet]

I can't help but note a bit of irony in this "dispute" and the search for a resolution.

Really, at the crux of it all is the singular issue of perception.  Is there a significant difference between surfing with a paddle in ones hand and without?  The following may seem a small detail, but I think it is one that ought not be ignored: The very first step in changing/promoting the perception of the general public and in turn, a government entity that there is NOT a significant difference between the two, is for those who choose to surf with a paddle in hand to actually believe it and act accordingly themselves. 

The times I swing by The Zone, I can't help but note that the the theme of a large number of posts on this site and a general tone in many other conversations that perpetuate the perception of a separation.... contain language of US vs them.... the use of "proner" as a pejorative.  To be honest, I am put off by it. I would suggest that it is a much more constructive approach to present an image, utilize language and behavior that is inclusive rather than divisive. Rather than highlight a separation at the onset, emphasize common interest- there is plenty! The one factor that ultimately prevailed recently in Hawaii is a cultural perception that the ocean is a playground that is inherently free and meant to be enjoyed in a variety of ways... it generally is by those who grow up there. As someone who resists restrictive labels, being put in a box... is not a SUPer or a Proner, but chooses to play in the ocean in any way I possibly can... I would respectfully suggest that rather than viewing this as a matter of "SUP Persecution" and/or "SUP Rights", it is a matter of equal access to a precious resource... keeping government out of the line-up. Something more along the lines of "People for a Free Ocean"an"Ocean Ohana" with a message that encourages participation from all who enjoy the water and promotes equal access and education toward preserving, sharing and safety in the ocean and lineups.  Other than the disproportionately vocal minority A-hole, the greater amount of people in the water are potential allies with much more in common than not, with whom this sort of message might resonate.

Just my 2cents.

[TallDude]

all~wet, You're right about the proner vs. SUP'r labeling. I'm continually using those terms myself and yet I'm both. I think with our local surf restrictions, it's really the club member's protecting what they feel is theirs exclusively. Specifically, the San Onofre Surf Club, and the Doheny Surf Club. They are the ones who went to the state and got them to enforce the bans, to protect 'their' breaks. Their members and the State Lifeguards are there to serve and protect their breaks. It's an exclusive Ohana. The cities don't care. You can SUP, or surf on any city beaches. The state parks are a different story, they are bedfellows with the surf clubs. It's been that way since day one.

You want to see how deep?   http://www.sanonofreparksfoundation.org/site/heritage/surfing-history

Notice how hard it is to differentiate between weather this website is run by the state or the surf club?       

[PonoBill]

I do agree about the "proner" or "prone surfer" label. Sounds silly to me. People who surf prone are surfers. People who surf standing up with a paddle are stand up paddle surfers. It's like water skiers calling people who ski in the snow "snow Skiers". They aren't, they're skiers.

Unfortunately TallDude is quite right about the rest of it. It isn't SUP surfers creating the separation.

[Socalsupper70]

great post TD-so true-how ironic is their mission statement!
"To promote and enhance ALL aspects of surfing"
 

[supthecreek]

I am grateful for the work you folks are doing in California, and the successful result in Hawaii.

I agree with all~wet.... we are all simply surfers, each using the equipment best suited to them.

With my rotator cuffs dysfunctional, I can not push up to my feet on my surfboards any longer.....
should I be banned from surfing, just because I need to paddle into a wave, already standing up? Not in my world.
I see no difference... just enjoying the ride as I have on all manner of boards for the past 40 years.

I feel good about promoting the fact that we are all just surfers. Easier, safer than pointing out differences. Harder to regulate negligible differences. Safer to pursue.

That is something that could be successfully conveyed through a simple video documentary. I am sure that most people making these regulations would be hard pressed to see a need to micro-manage nuance. A surfer, once up and riding is exactly the same as a paddler on a wave. Shortboard, longboard, funboard, Paddleboard, all slightly different, all surfing. Negligible variations . Period.