Round the Rock dilemma: Naish Javelin 14 vs Bark Competitor

[Blue crab]

Hi everyone,

New to posting on this blog.  However, based on many great insights by paddlers near & far (http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=19851.15 for example), I just picked up a 14' 2011 Naish Javelin carbon.  My quiver also includes a Naish Glide 2011 carbon for DW. Prior to picking up the Jav, I would race (& get smoked) in flat water on my wife's Bark Competitor (a nice 12'6" board). My weight is 180 lbs. Been SUPing < 1 year but have taken on the sport fairly aggressively as I have good access to Puget Sound & have made a couple of trips to Hood River. Would describe my balance as "improving" which is part of the justification for the new board. Fitness level is good.

Round the Rock is approaching and I am on the fence about which board to use. Not the Glide for sure as I find it slow in upwind and flat conditions. Been on the Jav twice.  I had a great deal of fun paddling it upwind in Hood River to the Hatchery and then back downwind a couple of times. Balance was a challenge DW but things went far better than I would have expected. Yesterday, I perhaps foolishly took the Jav out for a late training run on the Sound, after already having taken a fairly strenuous bike ride. My legs were tired even at the start, and though conditions were mild, I ended up struggling with balance.

I am on the fence about which board to chose: the safer but slower and shorter Competitor, or the incredibly fun (but riskier) Jav. I am a bit concerned that if I bonk at mile 10, there will be no end to the race, particularly if there is side chop.

Appreciate any thoughts!

[JillRide45]

That is a tough call, but here is my 2 cents.

Ride the Javelin.  You bought it, go out there and race it.  You are probably not going to win so just use this as a learning experience.  If the Javelin is so unstalbe for you that you cannot paddle it, why have it. 

I would also have to say that any race say over 8 miles is much much nicer on a 14' board.  Remember to try and pace yourself.  Take Gu and water and force yourself to eat and drink at least every half hour even at the beginning. 

Have fun, Jill

[PonoBill]

Round the Rock can be a hideous race, if you were on the Javellin last year you would have suffered greatly. It all depends on what the wind is doing at the end of the race and which direction the organizers choose. For this race I'd always choose the board I'm most comfortable with. I've done it on an F18, a Bark Dominator, and my Starboard 12'2". Last year it was the Bark, and I was glad I was on it. The last leg was straight into the wind with nasty knee-high side chop. If that sounds like Jav conditions to you then have at it.

[pdxmike]

Blue Crab--perfect timing for your post. 

I have a Javelin, a Glide, and a 14' Bark.  Javelin was really beyond my competence when I got it, which is why I did, and has since become my favorite board.  But I'm faster on the Glide if conditions aren't perfect, and I'm on a calm river where they're pretty tame.  I often use the Javelin even when I'd be faster on the Glide, though, and that's paid off greatly for balance.  I've even used it in races for the same reason--best way to learn is to use it.

But Round the Rock is different--too long and too risky for conditions.  I was thinking even if conditions are perfect (like 2 years ago) I'm worried that the extra effort for my legs to balance would catch up to me the last few miles, and that would counteract the Javelin's speed advantage.   I'd pretty much convinced myself I'd use the Glide, since I've been paddling it quite a bit this summer and love it. It's almost as fast as the Javelin even for flatwater, and seems like an overachiever for speed--not a perfect flatwater racing shape, but narrower than the Bark, and easier in chop than the Bark is some ways, since the nose doesn't get pushed around as much.

Then I took the Bark out last night for the first time in months last night.  It felt completely stable, but like it was sticking to the water--less glide than the others.  But my time was surprisingly fast.  So I'd been convinced I was bringing the Glide to Seattle, but now thinking maybe the Bark.  I  struggled last year the last 3 miles even on the Bark.  Glide would have been worse, and Javelin a joke for me.

I think it's a bit tougher choice for you, since your Bark is 12-6.  I agree with Jill in general about using the Javelin for racing, and she's usually right about everything.  But if conditions are half as bad as last year, and you're not an expert, you won't really be racing the Javelin, you'll be surviving.  Anyone not familiar with RTR--last year my last 3 miles took as long or longer than my first 9 or 10.  In my case I'm leaning towards PonoBill's advice--go for comfort.  For me, I think saving my legs will make up for quite a bit of speed compromise, esp. if it saves me from a couple falls, which can start to get exhausting.

It really is a gamble with the weather.  Two years ago was glassy the whole way.  Last year was awful, but I kayaked there the next day in sunny, glassy weather. 

[covesurfer]

I showed up with only my 2011 Jav to RtR last year. As I drove into the parking lot, I just couldn't believe I was going to have to paddle it. But there was no choice at that point - run what cha ya brung!

I only weigh 150 so that was an advantage. Still, last year, I did not have a lot of confidence on the Jav. Ended up being very happy that I raced it. Going into the heinous wind and chop from hell, the Jav cut through everything. It would just slice through the waves. One thing was that there was little side chop, which can be difficult with the tall boxy rails. Most of the worst was dead into the conditions, which actually helped quite a bit.

The Jav is a fast 14, even when up against the new 'improved' Jav LE (@ north of $4k). At 26+ inches, it is competitive with most of the other production race boards available. It holds onto a draft really well due to it's bow design. I love the board so much, I bought a new 2011 that was left over in the warehouse, just a few weeks ago.

Where you stand is important, don't be afraid to be in front of the handle - paddle with a friend and have them observe the board trim as you position yourself. You'd be surprised at how far forward you can stand.

You may fall in using the Jav but on a 12'6", you are gonna have a real long paddle. 13.1 miles at least goes by faster on a 14, even if you get a little wet. BTW, I fell off mine 2X during the race last year and was able, both times, to paddle really hard and catch the draft train I was on.

Lastly, I was so convinced the Javelin was da kine board for racing that I rode it almost exclusively this year in the Gorge. Even on 30+ windy downwinders. I had about 3 weeks of real challenge and then things began to click. I rode it in the Paddle Challenge downwinder as well as the course race and did well in both. I still fell, but not that much (only once in the d/w and twice in the course race). I would encourage you to paddle it for the rest of the time before RtR and use it. Of course, your mileage may vary    Good luck in the race, I'm sorry I'll miss it this year!

[pdxmike]

Maybe the solution is to start out on the Javelin, but stash your Bark in the bushes at the north tip of Mercer Island, so you can swap boards for the last 3 miles.  Just don't grab my Bark by mistake.

[TN_SUP]

Or have sponsons wired to CO2 cartridges ready to deploy...

[PonoBill]

I didn't notice the 12'6" part. Oh...Never mind.

If you weigh as much as my left leg, like covesurfer does, then you might do fine on the Jav. He's a lot better than he claims though, and spent a zillion hours in tough conditions on the Columbia. I've done the RTR on a 12' surfboard, and I can tell you for certain that's not likely to happen again. I'm racing cars in Wisconsin next week so I won't be there, and given the grueling end last year I don't feel too bad about that.

[Blue crab]

Awesome advice people.  I suspect that the answer will be the Jav unless the winds are totally out of hand: my 8 year old just informed me that he wants the competitor for the kids' race! It is not open ocean so the worst that can happen is my wife will have to come pick me up from Bill Gate's front yard.... she has become used to this sort of thing. Perhaps I'll also stash a 6 pack of a local IPA at the north end of Mercer, just in case I can't find the Bark.

My limited experience on the Jav was that it handled upwind far batter than any board I have tried, with surprising stability. I couldn't believe the progress I made upwind (downstream) at HR despite 15-20 knots.  It also was really fun going downwind.  

The side chop is another story. I find the Jav quite challenging in these conditions.  Side chop is where I truly love the Naish glide: I find that I am able to get decent glides by dipping down the back side of swells, without much side to side rocking.  I actually seek out side chop when training on the Glide.

My other observation on the Jav is that things go well provided that my concentration level is unfalteringly high. If my mind drifts for even a second, regardless of conditions, then this is a recipe for getting wet.  I am hoping that this feature will ultimately be great for my paddling technique... just not sure that I can focus that intensely for 13 miles.

[JillRide45]

Sounds like you really need to be on a Bark dominator instead of the Jav.

I have to say the races I remember the most are the ones that were not as planned.  Wind picked up, swell picked up, what ever.  These are the races you sit around and talk about how you made it through it.  Nothing wrong with getting a little wet, if you relax about it you will be better off.  Sometimes it might help you just to jump in at the beginning and get it over with. 

Whatever you decide to use, wrap you head around how it will work for you.  Make a mental plan to attack the race.  Have fun.

Jill

[Blue crab]

Thanks Jill,  Regardless of the board, will definitely have fun out there. No doubt about it.

 

[pdxmike]

If it's like last year, you'll have to repeat that over and over to yourself the last three miles-"I'm having fun, I'm having fun..."

Now that Blue Crab has decided, would anyone think I'd be crazy to use my Glide instead of my 14' Bark?  I'm pretty sure I'm using the Bark.

[corlot]

Why not bring all three? Game time choice?
I plan on bringing both my 14s.

[greatdane]

Almost impossible to predict what would work best... Had the course been run clock-wise last year, it would have been a completely different event.  This time last year, the weather report was what it is now... calm and sunny... then each day the prediction got worse and worse until race day morning... yuk. Like Corlot said, if you can; bring as many options as you can. 

It's too bad your Competitor isn't a Dominator.  Every time I've GPS'd one, they turn out to be much faster than they feel. Still one of the best all-around boards out there.

[PonoBill]

Yeah, if you trim them right the Dominators are surprisingly fast. As I posted previously, I tested a bunch of 14's back-to-back over a fixed course, and for me the Dominator was the fastest. There were some I just couldn't trim properly, like the M&M. Regardless of the issues, at my weight the Dominator is still the fastest 14' I've tried except for Foote Malikos on a downwinder.

One other tip--bring some warm stuff. I was able to buy a Quicksilver paddling jacket on sale at the event and it saved my ass. I would have frozen otherwise, and I usually roast. Some events I can barely stand to wear a rashguard, but the wind off the sound can freeze you right to the bone.