Author Topic: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"  (Read 74434 times)

balance_fit

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #45 on: January 06, 2012, 07:49:19 PM »
Hi 1paddle2paddle and PT Woody
From Jonathan's pictures at the beginning of the thread it seems the drains sit a couple inches above the sharp edge of the ACE's bottom, when looking at the side rail. From the inside of the cockpit the drains look flush with the footwells. I can guesstimate that when underway, the footwells are a good inch above water and the drains another inch above.
When paddling, with the natural side to side dipping of the rails, and chop, the drains got to be submerged many times. Water doesn't backflow into the footwells !! ...after watching Jonathan's videos, the footwells look dry.
I remember my surfski and oc1 days. With a single footwell, my V10 would take several seconds to drain through the single drain...bummer ! The oc1 had twin bulleted drains, one for each footwell. Those things sucked water like a pump ! The ACE's drains do the job very well, it seems.
I look forward to your reviews on this excellent board !
I appreciate it very much, may all be well
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1paddle2paddle

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2012, 07:34:01 AM »
I actually don't know how well the drains work on the ACE.  It seems to be an entirely different situation than a surfski where the boat has to create a vacuum to draw the water out of the bottom of the footwell since that area is below the waterline.

I guess a test would be to take the ACE out through small waves and let a wave come over the boat and fill the sunken deck with water, and see how long it takes to drain, and whether the board needs to be moving forward to drain (or if that even helps).

balance_fit

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2012, 02:49:51 PM »
This test will surely dispell any remaining fears regarding drainage of the cockpit. Watching the videos laid to rest most of my concerns in this aspect.
I am quite close to the point of deciding it's going to be my next sup. The stability concerns still assault me, but I'm almost convinced that for under 1 meter seas downwind, 15 knot of wind and, mixed chop up to 1 foot, this is the board.
Waiting for PT Woody's reviews !
May all be well
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1paddle2paddle

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2012, 03:33:20 PM »
Hey BF,

If you can demo one, obviously do that before pulling the trigger.  I never paddled an ACE 14' x 25" before purchase, but I paddled a 12'6 x 27" version.  It took me one good flatwater session on that 12'6 to realize it was a special shape, but I wanted to go even more extreme so went for the longer and narrower board.  I'm probably on the heavy side of what works on that board, but in flat water it just flies and I like how it "tests" my balance even inside the marina in fairly flat water (chop normally 6" or less).  But my wife really enjoys it, so for lighter riders it must be very comfortable.

I have taken it on one downwind run, and the conditions were close to the max of what I could handle on it (and would be no problem on a dedicated downwind board).  Before you purchase an ACE for downwind, you should realize that you cannot step back and turn the ACE like you can do on other boards; stepping back merely sinks the tail more and does not pull the nose up.  So what ends up happening is that you catch the bump and then try to use the paddle to "body english" the board, but you don't have a ton of control and mostly go where the board wants to go (straight ahead). 

Aloha,
Scott

balance_fit

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #49 on: January 07, 2012, 05:10:36 PM »
I got to tell you all how grateful i am for you reviews, comments, pictures and recommendations. It is through this info that i can make an informed decision since...there are no starbies here to demo!

I currently paddle a 14 x 27 3/4 " LK and it's very comfy in my usual conditions....even so, it's not an ACE. My sup is also pintail, although not as narrow, it's maneuverability on the runs is quite limited too. I tend to prefer prone paddle board inspired designs such as my LK and SB. I prefer concave bottom, pintails and broad bows on my boards. I feel they perform better in our mixed waters.

At 160 lb, i might be feeling similar on the ACE to those +/- 15 lbs. Videos have been a great resource to see how the board performs in similar conditions to the ones i face. Head and stern mounted shots are excellent resources !

But, none substitute demo'ing....

Thanks guys !
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Kaihoe

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #50 on: January 08, 2012, 05:57:01 PM »
I actually don't know how well the drains work on the ACE.  It seems to be an entirely different situation than a surfski where the boat has to create a vacuum to draw the water out of the bottom of the footwell since that area is below the waterline.

I guess a test would be to take the ACE out through small waves and let a wave come over the boat and fill the sunken deck with water, and see how long it takes to drain, and whether the board needs to be moving forward to drain (or if that even helps).

They work quite well as long as your moving.  I managed to get them full to the brim when its wild, as long as you stay moving they drain quickly. Ohh and don't kneel it seems to screw up the drains

You can get swamped on downwinders though especially cross chop from behind. That really sucks cause the board just stops

Kaihoe

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #51 on: January 08, 2012, 05:59:19 PM »
Hey BF,

If you can demo one, obviously do that before pulling the trigger.  I never paddled an ACE 14' x 25" before purchase, but I paddled a 12'6 x 27" version.  It took me one good flatwater session on that 12'6 to realize it was a special shape, but I wanted to go even more extreme so went for the longer and narrower board.  I'm probably on the heavy side of what works on that board, but in flat water it just flies and I like how it "tests" my balance even inside the marina in fairly flat water (chop normally 6" or less).  But my wife really enjoys it, so for lighter riders it must be very comfortable.

I have taken it on one downwind run, and the conditions were close to the max of what I could handle on it (and would be no problem on a dedicated downwind board).  Before you purchase an ACE for downwind, you should realize that you cannot step back and turn the ACE like you can do on other boards; stepping back merely sinks the tail more and does not pull the nose up.  So what ends up happening is that you catch the bump and then try to use the paddle to "body english" the board, but you don't have a ton of control and mostly go where the board wants to go (straight ahead). 

Aloha,
Scott

And once you get too side on to the wave your in >:( (or at least I am)

Still a great board though

balance_fit

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #52 on: January 09, 2012, 06:02:45 AM »
Hey BF,

If you can demo one, obviously do that before pulling the trigger....  So what ends up happening is that you catch the bump and then try to use the paddle to "body english" the board, but you don't have a ton of control and mostly go where the board wants to go (straight ahead). 

And once you get too side on to the wave your in >:( (or at least I am)

Still a great board though
Mmm...interesting remarks about the ACE's handling. I currently paddle a LK 14 and have experienced similar behavior, i suspect, because of a similar outline (concave bottom, high rails, pintail), on runners and beam waves.
On the LK 14 i maneuver in between runs by countersteering in midstance when not planing and can still maneuver a bit with same side foot pressure after stepping back when on bigger runs. Side swells i try to handle by keeping a relaxed stance, or swim...
I feel the ACE handles similarly as per your comments.
What i feel is very attractive about the ACE is it's reported speed, ease of catching small bumps as seen on vids, plus how the bow handles close together windswell downwinds.
These are exactly my conditions here !
Again, thanks to all and be well !
Bic Wing 11' x 29"
Bark Commander 12' x 20" 
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balance_fit

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #53 on: January 09, 2012, 07:12:12 AM »

You can get swamped on downwinders though especially cross chop from behind. That really sucks cause the board just stops
Hi Kaihoe
Sorry for missing your comments ! When and if you get swamped under these conditions, how long does it take for the water to drain so that you can resume paddling?
I suspect this happens under 20knot plus winds, true?
My appreciation for your comments, be well
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Bark Commander 12' x 20" 
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1paddle2paddle

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #54 on: January 09, 2012, 12:54:21 PM »
Aloha BF,

To test the drains on the ACE, I paddled through a small wave which broke over the bow and dumped a bunch of water in the cockpit(?) - whatever you call the sunken area on the ACE.  I could definitely notice the extra weight, and there was probably 2" of water at the deepest point.  It drained the majority of the water within 10 seconds with me paddling forward, and wasn't an issue for me after that.

Since you are familiar with surf skis, I can say that getting "swamped" in the ACE is not as significant as getting swamped in the Fenn XT, where the boat could take about 5 gallons of water in one wave and just totally bog.

Scott

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #55 on: January 09, 2012, 04:57:12 PM »
Aloha BF,

To test the drains on the ACE, I paddled through a small wave which broke over the bow and dumped a bunch of water in the cockpit(?) - whatever you call the sunken area on the ACE.  I could definitely notice the extra weight, and there was probably 2" of water at the deepest point.  It drained the majority of the water within 10 seconds with me paddling forward, and wasn't an issue for me after that.

Since you are familiar with surf skis, I can say that getting "swamped" in the ACE is not as significant as getting swamped in the Fenn XT, where the boat could take about 5 gallons of water in one wave and just totally bog.

Scott

Hi Scott

I see that the swamping issue is no more. 10 seconds of paddling to clear the .... cockpit ... isn't a serious concern. Besides, i don't go against waves that often ! Mly biggest worries were from side swell or rear waves coming in. Now i rest assured.
I got truly swamped by waves both on the XT, the V10 and the OC1. The feeling was exactlly as you describe, sunk and bog-ed. I'm very glad to know that the ACE is way less prone to 'swamping' than the skis.

I thank you very much for taking the time to go test and report your findings. I went today and talked to the owner of our local sup shop. He is going to bring a container with several starboard shapes, among which, ... guess what, is an ACE 14 x 25" ! I'll be able to demo !

I truly look forward to this demo and will keep you all updated, you've all been very helpful in schooling me !



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1paddle2paddle

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #56 on: January 15, 2012, 10:07:00 PM »
Aloha BF,

One thing I failed to mention is that side winds with some bump is a challenge (for me at least) on that board.  I was paddling today in some slop and I had forgotten how much it can roll when getting bumps from 90 degrees.  Definitely challenging my balance.

Scott

Mitchell

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #57 on: January 16, 2012, 10:45:24 AM »
So is this board faster in in flat water compared to regular displacement boards, choppy waters, or both?

From a starboard rider I heard its designed for a little rougher kinda california westcoast waters that are choppy with some swell.

But it sounds like once chops appears its hard to balance on it and the fact that the nose just rolls over the swell instead of penetrates it really goes out the window when you are in the water.

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #58 on: January 16, 2012, 07:43:29 PM »
Mitchell,

I believe the board is mostly designed as a flat water board.  I think the best way to describe the feel of it in flat water is "efficient" - like it does not require as much effort to keep it gliding, and it does not feel like it is "pushing" water.  This attribute sticks with the board from plate glass through small chop (up to 6" or perhaps more).  Once the water gets "sporty" (as I saw someone else on this board describe water with some texture to it, and this will vary according to rider weight and skill), balancing on the board becomes an issue and once that occurs, the board probably loses the advantage it has over more stable boards.

While its clearly not designed as a "downwind" board, it can be used as such in light wind conditions (again, depending on rider weight and skill), and it can really be fun in small wave downwind conditions.

Scott

Argosi

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Re: Starboard Ace 14' x 25"
« Reply #59 on: January 17, 2012, 11:01:48 AM »
I have the older version of the Ace, which was called the NEW.

I'd say the 25" Ace is a great downwind board in light to moderate conditions - assuming you have decent balance and weigh somewhere around 175lbs or less. By light to moderate, I mean up to about 20 mph (25mph if you have better than average balance). My board goes downwind in those conditions better than any other I've tried.

Although it was originally designed as a race board, I don't think it's as fast in flat water as some other dedicated displacement style race boards. My 25.5" wide custom Bark is faster, for example.

If I want to get around a race course handling multiple directions (upwind, downwind, side wind) in flat water to light chop, the Bark is faster than my Starboard. If I want to have fun catching small downwind runners, I'll take the Starboard. The Starboard is not as good going upwind as a displacement board with a piercing nose like the Bark, but for me, it's worth working a bit harder going upwind with the Starboard to have a lot more fun going downwind after turning around.

The Ace will feel more tippy initially because of its rounded bottom, but it's actually pretty good when it comes to secondary stability. You can rock it sideways quite a bit without falling off once you get used to it. It'll take you several sessions in choppy water to get used to the initial tippyness, but once you do, it should feel pretty stable. I'm guessing that the rounded bottom helps me"feel" the downwind runners better and react faster than a more squared off rail design like the Bark.

In really flat water, I prefer something that doesn't push as much water in the nose as the Ace. The Ace has a round nose that does push more water than boards with piercing noses. A different Starboard like the Ace Pro would be faster in flat water. However, I don't think the Ace Pro would be nearly as much fun as the Ace when the wind picks up to 13-25mph.

The Ace does have a pin tail which makes the water release at the tail much smoother than most boards. The Ace Pro has both a piercing nose and a pin tail - a no compromise design for flat water speed, but more tippy as a result.

 


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