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Messages - obxDave

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31
Yeah, I recall sessions last winter in hood gloves and booties definitely being shorter than summer sessions, and that’s at 55 deg water and 50 deg air in a 4/3. I cringe at the thought of going harsher than that. My knees are also usually the first thing to complain but it’s mostly from aggressive upwind transitions. I call it upwind twist-turn stress. I’ll go for a 1 hour winter riding time goal. Another good test for the watch.

For me it is crappy case of progressive MS.  In the last 5 years it has taken my windsurfing, SUP Downwind, surfing, snowboarding, skateboarding, running, now walking for more 10 minutes, etc.  I can still ride my bike fine, swim OK and wing, but not with any rise in body temp.  My prep is getting stupid.  2 hours of ice etc. to be reasonably functional.  I have to be cold when I get to the beach or it is pointless.  I am in a whiny mood right now because I had my MRI's last week.  This F'n thing is not going to let up on me.  I feel like my winging is improving while my body is trying to quit. 

Enough of that.

Ok, that totally sucks.....I don’t know the first thing about MS, but it sounds crazy. Kuudoo’s for fighting it head on,...you have my total respect!

32
Dawn patrol has a mind of it's own as to what it considers one "wave”

So what do you think a “wave” is considered for a downwinder like that?  I would love an app that record every direction change of say more than 110 deg to count transitions. Of course it would be really cool if you could input wind direction and dominate foot stance so that it could then record your exact type of transition. ::)

Admin would have a better idea. We started sneaking into the water in early april and went consistently until a few weeks ago.

I think that 2 hours was about our normal.  I loved that!  I can advance like that.  Maybe not quickly, but I can get it done.  When I can wear a shorty and stay cool my coordination can still be good enough.  This sport is pretty forgiving and fortunately it doesn't require full coordination.  My first 15 minutes are usually shit until I get water cooled.  Then I can wing until I'm spent.  I suck in a steamer and booties, especially when it is sunny out.  There is just no way to stay cool, even with all my usual pre-cooling stuff.  With no coordination getting off my knees is brutal, even in smooth water, and I cant pump the board at all.  My sessions in the steamer have been 45 minutes to an hour and it has just been cruising.  I had two sessions last week that were a joke.  I was rolling off my board like a turd.  I had one cold and cloudy day that was awesome though :).  That one was 90 minutes.

We are heading down to Baja Jan-Spring so we will see how it goes in shorts.

Yeah, I recall sessions last winter in hood gloves and booties definitely being shorter than summer sessions, and that’s at 55 deg water and 50 deg air in a 4/3. I cringe at the thought of going harsher than that. My knees are also usually the first thing to complain but it’s mostly from aggressive upwind transitions. I call it upwind twist-turn stress. I’ll go for a 1 hour winter riding time goal. Another good test for the watch.

33
The watch was really a great investment (Apple 5 / Dawn Patrol).
Sessions were between 75-120 minutes, 14-22 miles. 95% were downwinders of at least 8 miles as the crow flies. Never intended to launch and land at the same location with this sport as I really just wanted to use a paddle. Have to admit though, it was fun on occasion and the wing gives you the option to do the good parts of a downwinder twice. Unfortunately the darn thing was hopelessly in the way most of the time.

I'm suspicious of your watch's heart rate readings Dave or you're in much better shape than me. My average heart rate was 125-135 during most downwinders and that's just from riding waves :o I'm not sheeted in or using the wing 85+% of the time. Nothing like the same runs paddling sup or surfski. The same watch then says 160-170 average, that can't be good for a human in the long run. My legs definitely get wobbly towards the end of a run and I'm generally happy to just sail in. I've also noticed that too much coffee can make the ultra short fuselage a handful ;D
Your probably right about the heart rate thing. Only other time I measured it was using a chest heart rate monitor linked to my IPhone in a waterproof pouch while kitefoiling. 112 bpm average with a 137 bpm max, but who knows how kite foiling compares to winging. Maybe I can link my chest monitor to the Garmin watch but not sure if that’s possible. I do swim and bike a fair amount so maybe that helps a wee bit.  Looking forward to using the watch for a downwinder. I think I could go 2 hours like you without too much “pain”. It’s fun just to monitor this stuff...


34
Never rinse anything but always make hand wings and kites are dry and any sand brushed off before I pack them up

35
I rarely feel tired during a session though I start to get sloppy.

Yeah, I guess I should say that I don’t get winded, but when the legs get worn down, anything beyond basic riding and jibing gets harder. Falling in on otherwise easy knee starts is a good fatigue indicator for me.  I definitely don’t have as much fun when fatigue sets in.  The wirst heart monitor in the watch said I averaged 101 bpm for the long session with a max rate of 127 bpm. No idea how accurate it really is. It would be cool if I could export the garmin gps data to another program but not sure I can.

36
Finally got a Garmin Instinct GPS watch to wear while riding. I’m curious how everyone else’s riding sessions compare. I seem to be good for about 1 1/2 hours max of straight riding time before fatigue really starts to set in, but even an hour seems plenty. What’s strange for me is that my legs get wobbly and fatigued before my arms/shoulders do, which I wouldn’t expect since I never use a harness.  I think I could maybe go two hours or slightly more on a downwinder if I wasn’t turning so frequently and falling while working on challenging moves.  My GPS top speed said 16.9 knots but I’m too chicken sh#t to push any harder! Once I finally come in I’m generally ready to pack up for the day rather than rest and go for another session, especially as the weather gets cooler and required neoprene increases. Maybe that’s an over 60 thing

I recall Beasho posting a GPS log of a 17 mile session


Yesterday I tried some more extended backwinded riding where I actually rode about 25 ft and finished the 360 successfully (off foil but I’ll take it) on a couple of try’s. Plenty of energy draining spills in between.  I’ve watched a couple of recent Patrice clips riding backwinded and I really want to orient the wing to spill wind off the clew like he does.  It’s what I do with a windsurfer but I’m just not getting it yet with a wing.



37
Classifieds / Moses W1100 front wing & Moses 450 stabilizer
« on: October 28, 2020, 12:12:35 PM »
Moses W1100 foil.  $350. Purchased new last spring and used about 5 times. Small section of one wing tip (topside only) and a 1” section of leading edge did receive some damage during shipping. Immediately repaired with West System G/flex 650 epoxy. No detrimental effect on wing performance at all.

Moses 450 stabilizer.  $200. Also used about 5 times since purchased last spring. No damage other than typical scuff marks.

Plenty of great wing foiling reviews on this wing. I decided to stick with the Gong Veloce XXL as my large foil for wing foiling. Need to thin the heard.....




38
Classifieds / Gong Pro XL hydrofoil full setup
« on: October 28, 2020, 11:45:04 AM »
$440.00     PayPal.     Shipping not included.

Pro XL (1900 sq cm) original construction purchased new in Sept 2019. 45cm surf stabilizer. 80 cm and 65 cm aluminum masts. Amazing first foil for wing foiling progression (I’ve ridden several Moses and Axis foils for winging, and the Pro XL is just a great all around learning foil, from my first jibes to 360’s and behind-the-back-tacks).  Very good condition. No damage other than expected scuff marks.

Selling because I traded up to the new Veloce foil wing.

39
One other really cheap (but next to impossible for many of us older types) way to gain some instant performance improvement without a bunch of expensive techie gear;......loose weight!  My knees suck. Only way I can keep riding/playing on the water was to shed the pounds...

40
Has anyone ridden both the Armstrong HS1850 and the Gong Curve XL foils (previously called the Pro)? It would be great to hear first hand experience on the differences. The sizing appears similar. The price difference is enormous, is the Armstrong really that much better to ride?


Take just about any gear intensive sport and this becomes a common question.  Is that expensive gear going to suddenly improve your riding skills over less expensive gear? Nope, not at all. These forums get caught up in “gear minutia” by participants (myself included) many of whom are older with sufficient play funds and limited (and declining!) physical abilities. “This carbon mast is amazing,..it’s a game changer!” ..... Sure......

I learned everything on the original Pro XL. Heavy, wobbly aluminum masts, loose foil-to-fuselage connection that I had to tighten, no half dozen options for fuselage or rear wings. I got all my transitions on that setup. Tried more expensive stuff from Moses and Axis. Did it suddenly make me a better rider?  Nope, not at all.  I just try and practice as much as possible in decent conditions and I constantly practice my current/new transitions all the time instead of riding in endless straight lines. Some days barely powered on my 6m, others overpowered on my 3.3m. Patrice was doing everything (and then some) on that same gear a year ago.

I’ve never ridden any Armstrong gear. One of our locals just purchased a full Armstrong setup of everything; foils, masts, handwings and board. I’m sure I’ll get the chance to ride it at some point. It looks like very well made gear. I’ll bet the 1850 is similar in performance to the carve XL. Neither setup will be as important as the conditions you ride in, getting dialed into what you already own, how often you ride, and how you “train yourself”.

41
Hmmm,...twitchy, heavy boom, and sinking tail.

Twitchyness: To me this wing is rock solid through a massive wind range.

Heavy boom: I’m sure the mod to a fixed carbon boom would be nice but I’m not loosing sleep over needing to do this mod right away. Maybe over the winter. As long as there is enough wind to get me up on foil, that same wind holds the wing up nicely (I never use a harness). It would be nice to reduce weight for flinging the wing quickly around on tacks, and schlogging around in very light wind off-foil

The sinking tail: Never spent time thinking about it till it was mentioned here. Guess it never really bothered me. A boom wing is all I ever really use so I guess I’ve gotten OK at dealing with it in the water.

I’ll reiterate a few pluses. I hated the extra inflate/deflate time of the the center strut (and this from someone who’s kiteboarded with 5 strut kites for 20 yrs)

This is mostly freestyle stuff.
Not only is one handed riding easy, you can easily twist (point) the leading edge up and down single handed to deal with gusts. Doubt that would work quite as well with handles. 

When it comes to trickier moves like 360’s where the wing is briefly pushing back on you while backwinded you don’t get any slop in the wing response at all. I tried 360’s on my Naish S25,...it was not a pretty site :o

Of course regrabs on upwind transitions are always easier with a boom. I’ve gotten to the point where I do more upwind tacks during a session than I do jibes. The regrab on heel to toeside tacks and behind-the-backs has to be pretty quick, at least for my slow moving brain. I’m just too spastic to pull it off with handles 

42
I'm thinking of purchasing these two products which would allow me to use both surf wings (1100) and kite wings (W1000 and W800) with the same setup (mast and fuselage).

https://www.mackiteboarding.com/custom-moses-super-fuse-surf-fuselage/

https://www.mackiteboarding.com/moses-fuselage-to-wing-adapter-plate/

My original goal was the same as yours,..overlap my Moses kite rig with my wing foiling rig.  Only problem was that I found other foil wings (Veloce XL/XXL) that I liked better for winging than my W1100 and 790. Really just comes down to personal preference. Mr Stringfellow just sent me a fuselage to adapt my Gong wings to my Moses 72/82 cm carbon masts, so I guess it sort of achieves the same goal. He is also the producer of those custom fuselages for MACkiteboarding you linked to, and an awesome resource if you need custom machine work done

(Gonna List my W1100 wing and full Pro XL rig for sale if anyone is interested)

43
Have not been to the OBX. Maybe some North Easters are close to steady but for me it is mostly gusting with holes when I am windsurfing.
My feeble advice is that it’s totally worth it to travel to an easy launch with a long fetch for the most steady unobstructed wind. That location in your picture looks way tougher to me. But hats off for trying to make it work ;)

44
Fishman, Stay away from the Florida Keys if yopu are looking for steady wind!
Is that just the fall you’re referring too?  I always felt the winter months gave pretty steady pre and post frontal winds, at least compared to the OBX. The launches were always pretty sketchy but I discovered Cocoa Plum beach in Marathon this last trip. Have you tried it? Pretty decent side-on E-SE wind for mid March. I kite foiled and wing foiled there and it was great. Easy beach and a bit more room to work with before having to turn. They had just closed the beach while we were there and I had to launch from the boat towards the end


45
Wingsurfing, Windfoiling, Wingfoiling, Wing SUP / Re: wing leash
« on: October 10, 2020, 12:20:34 AM »
Left handed here. Ride regular stance but switch all the time. Always a coil leash, always on the right hand. Just started that way for no particular reason and stayed with it ever since.

Only time I completely change the wing leash is when I add a 3 ft extension and attach the wrist cuff to my board leash waist belt instead of my right hand. Required for behind-the-back tacks, .....which I might start up again since the fingers are doing pretty well.
Was wondering how the behind-the-back tack worked - I was inspired to try one the other day and thankfully tried on land first with my normal wrist leash. Glad it was on land first, as the leash wrap-around bondage salad made me realise a wrist leash would never work unless you made it extra long and pre-wrapped your leash prior to attempt.
Even when you attach the wing leash to your waist belt, you still need to make sure it’s wrapped around your back so that when you pass the wing behind your back the leash is “unraveling” instead of creating an extra wrap. That extra wrap would result in insufficient leash slack when I went to regrab.  Same bondage result!  However smooth and fast you need to be for a plain vanilla tack, multiply it by 2 for behind-the-backs......

https://youtu.be/9Qm8k7S9gwU

Side note: It’s not a wing leash setup I would normally choose if I wasn’t planning on doing any behind-the-back-tacks. It can sometimes be a tangly mess to sort out after a crash

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