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Messages - SURFFOILS

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31
Foil SUP / Re: Fanatic Aero 1500 Foil
« on: September 21, 2018, 02:19:45 AM »
Hi SCB, it’s a great testament to the foil industry that they are willing to search for innovation that progresses the riders experience.
 Here’s my version of the swept single from 2009.
 Lift comes from both the ‘foil of the foil’ and the surface area , it’s a sliding scale depending on speed, AOA and wave shape.
 I’m on FB with constant innovation and new ideas for foils.
 No products to sell but I am happy to give away my knowledge.
 

32
Foil SUP / Re: Fanatic Aero 1500 Foil
« on: September 19, 2018, 11:14:56 PM »
Piros, I’m stoked to see the Fanatic foil, I’m familiar with how design affects speed and lift, a flatter foil won’t have the exponential lift at higher speeds like the standard foils and with more lift coming from the foils AOA it’s a more stable ride. The swept tips will give more lift during turns than a straight foil, the sweep will also reduce ventilation.
If surfers can give up the Pump, a much shorter mast gives a more responsive and surfboard feel. I’m riding about 8” so the hull is just 4 or 5 off the water.
 

33
Foil SUP / Re: Fanatic Aero 1500 Foil
« on: September 19, 2018, 01:11:16 PM »
Thanks for that Piros. What a great job testing foils !
Looking forward to new designs like everyone.
I can see from the design that with the swept tips are going to make it slower turning from side to side becuase the further you sweep them back the more stable they are but you can alter that by bringing the overall width in.

34
Foil SUP / Re: Fanatic Aero 1500 Foil
« on: September 19, 2018, 05:47:05 AM »
Piros, you’re  never going to get the same ‘glide’ from a flatter foil but the physical dimensions of the swept foil would show it to be not twitchy, if anything it’s going to be slower to react and therefore more stable. Have you contacted the manufacturers to say that that their advertising is wrong  about it being more stable ? I can’t believe anyone would make a foil thats very twitchy and harder to ride....?
The greater thickness of an old style foil creates lift out of nothing but also makes it very jumpy when sharp lift and power is tapped, as shown is many videos.
 Th advantage of a swept/ low aspect foil is that it doesn’t have the same wide range of lift but it’s more reliable in more stable energy positions on a wave. I think the Fanatic has found the balance but makers will progress the design to find even more stable designs to bring in a wider market for their products.

35
Foil SUP / Re: Fanatic Aero 1500 Foil
« on: September 18, 2018, 07:22:00 PM »
I feel vindicated that my foil ideas of using thin and low aspect foils are now being manufactured and that they are faster and easier to ride.
  ‘More manouverable and higher top speed.’
 Just as I said a few years ago.
 The other manufacturers will have to follow this design if they haven’t got something similar in the lab already.
 

36
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 15, 2018, 02:05:52 PM »
SSS, I do agree that the skill of the rider has a great factor in speed so I don’t think prone Vs SUP is possible to choose who’s faster.
The highest speeds are going to be found going down the wave and not up the wave and I think that if you’re only able to measure in horizontal movement then you’re not including the constant of gravity that would be a large component. So the speeds recorded are being miscalculated.
A larger wave travels faster in horizontal movement so the same surfer on a larger wave will go faster according to a GPS.

I’ve been through this on another forum and the speeds themselves are certainly questionable, is the speed momentary or sustained ? And for how long ? Momentary speeds could be attributed to swinging your arm forward so it registers a very high but brief speed,  like throwing a ball out of a moving car. Or the refresh rate of the GPS itself. There’s a lot of variables that could create extraordinary momentary GPS speeds that aren’t correct like the 46 mph you mentioned.

On another forum a guy said he was travelling on a beach wave at a Sustained speed of 60 mph for 30 seconds but ignored that at such a high speed he would have travelled a distance that placed him up the beach and into the car park !
Theres so many variables that a top surf speed is going to be momentary.

 But the winner on that forum was a guys GPS that registered on a weeks surfing in Hawaii a top speed of 980 kph while on the 747 getting there. 😀

 Searching for a sustained top surf speed is something completely different.


37
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 15, 2018, 05:48:32 AM »
Adding more data points improves analysis, that’s what analysis thrives on.....Data. Doesn’t it ?

Oh hang on... I get it...you  guys are trolling me to avoid basic science.
 Well done, I get the joke.  Sorry I didn’t get it sooner !!!

 Sure, surfing is done on a flat 2-D plane and vertical dimension is not measureable in the real world. Ha ha .
 You had me believing you were seriously denying the third dimension.

38
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 14, 2018, 11:05:54 PM »
On an OH wave I would drop about about 3 metres vertically but even at 2 metres or 6 feet thats a speed of 22kph or 14 mph. i know thats a freefall number but thats not an unusual feeling talking off on a prone/shortboard.
 At somewhere like Mavericks i would guess theyre dropping 6 metres + but that vertical component is invisible to a GPS.
 Its like saying a pilot in a vertical dive has no speed because theres no lat or long difference,the drop is where the greatest acceleration happens.

39
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 14, 2018, 01:44:22 PM »
The easiest way to explain is that when you drop on takeoff, there’s a massive vertical acceleration,and the bigger the wave the greater the speed as you drop.
The greater the vertical drop the less likely a GPS will register it, so the 2D speed will say that you’re standing still which is not true.
 I think we’ve all experienced waves that barrel furiously but are almost a standing wave because of the movement of water. But a GPS would say that your speed is almost nil.
 I get that the GPS is a general positioning system and probably the most familiar system to use but because there’s such a 3 dimensional aspect to surfing you can’t accurately measure speed without measuring the speed through the water.

 I think Beashos results would definately be higher with a flow gauge and GPS.

40
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 13, 2018, 10:52:02 PM »
So it’s quite likely that it’s not recording the correct highest speed due to the vertical component of riding larger waves.
 Bottom line, On larger waves you’re more likely to be going faster than the GPS asesses.

41
Foil SUP / Re: Do prone foil surfers go faster than their SUP brothers?
« on: September 13, 2018, 07:54:42 PM »
Beasho, this Trace product does GPS ‘speed over land’ rather than speed through water right ?

42
Random / Re: Pro Tennis Needs to make some changes.......
« on: September 12, 2018, 03:10:42 AM »
Being from Australia I can tell you that it is indeed and certainly a racist, sexist country.  Our national anthem is Advance Australia FAIR. We have major discrimination against female, aged, the disabled and the indigenous population. It’s just considered normal here. We’re a country of folk wits.
 Not that it’s something I personally condone and the government has all the PC policies and procedures to make it look good but that’s bullshite in reality.
 However the cartoon and don’t forget it’s just a cartoon, is meant to be insulting as cartoons are, is not unprovoked. Serena knew what she was saying and doing and her coach admitted to the cheating, so there’s little moral ground to stand on except to go back to the Im black and a Woman and therefore it’s discrimination.
 Sometimes , you’re better off not cheating and then trying to scream your way out of it.
 If she’d just got on with the match it would be forgotten by now.

43
SUP General / Re: Foil vs. Surfboard Drag - It's Half
« on: September 10, 2018, 03:37:21 AM »
That’s a very simple method and the results are not surprising at all. Well done.

44
Foil SUP / Re: Stingray Decoy
« on: September 02, 2018, 05:01:16 AM »
Initially the “thrashing” in the water would have me clenching in many areas because you never know what’s about to happen.
 But then seeing the Rays kook about with the foil, obviously saying “ Hey dude, wassup ?” Would have been fun.

45
Foil SUP / Re: Fly the Wing - Take off the Stabilizer
« on: August 31, 2018, 01:34:42 PM »
Yes it can , due to the length of the chord it can have a longer, more stable wing profile of greater NACA foil, or be completely flat or both.

Or a Combination as I’ve done on this foil prototype where the body has a long glider wing NACA profile for slow speed lift and the wingtips are flat like a surfboard fin for speed on the steep face. I should have faired the 2 profiles together but that’s for another prototype.
 Note 50/50 rounded leading edge for wider AOA, and chord apex moved back for less drag/higher speeds

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