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Messages - photofr

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31

With the above factors (as well as others in mind) it would seem logical that the SUP market would be seeing more Hollow UL boards sometime rather soon! After all, it would cater to heavier paddlers in a very nice way.
I don't see how. UL boards can't be raced in most events, downwinding is highly specialised arm of the market and hollow boards from the established brands would likely be ludicrously expensive. There is no market there. Hell, you'll be more likely to see an inflatable UL DW board first. Heavier recreational paddlers will be fine in the leisure class as things stand so much won't change there. Heavier elite paddlers will just be naturally selected out of the competitive sport though.

For the first time, the future of UL actually seems rather positive to me.
- We've all kind of agreed on the fact that more and more racers are "retiring" from racing (on 12'6 as well as on 14').
- Heavier paddlers are so much more at ease on UL boards - they are just not as penalised.

Perhaps the combination of older folks gaining weight (think BEER) with folks retiring from the racing scene will realise that there's a lot of fun to be had on ULs. This is obviously all speculation from my part, but you can't deny that it's possible.

32
Summer's coming - Price Drop.
Now 2050 euros, and still including fin.

33
Hmm...

Top racers moving away from racing...
More hollow boards on the market...
Current SUP boards are so very limited for efficiency (even in the 14' categories)...

With the above factors (as well as others in mind) it would seem logical that the SUP market would be seeing more Hollow UL boards sometime rather soon! After all, it would cater to heavier paddlers in a very nice way.

34
Photofr, Mahalos for info on Braca paddles. They have added a model in a teardrop shape which now goes down to very small sizes!

Bonus - US Distributor in Wayland MA USA!

No affiliation, but it is nice to actually be able to get some EURO gear if you want for a change!

Hey Mr. Big!
Welcome.
The Kahana model is in fact a tear drop model. It actually came out a year BEFORE the Maui model. I tried it in two sizes and paddled it for about 7 months. While it may suit other paddlers, I have to admit that I didn't like it. Here are my reasons:
- The blade was the second stiffest thing I have ever used in my life.
- The blade and shaft didn't have an harmonious behaviour regarding their flex.

The Kahana paddle couldn't be more opposite of the latest model: the Braca Maui.

Overall, it was unpleasant (for me) for long distance paddling - which is what I love the most.

Aloha -

35
I would not mind a performance/fast light touring board. A kind of Glide Light or Javelin de-tuned. Pretty much a SIC RS with a tad less volume but without the race moniker to it, so it becomes available on the second hand market :-)
And that is something that could work well with the hollow construction of Nelo. They just have to go wider and make some nicer, cleaner lines. Simple is best.

Pure physics limitations will make it extremely difficult to create a hollow board that's: light, strong - but also LOW VOLUME.

36
Well, I guess it will be another product that most of us will be we get to try, so you can say what you like about it. But I’m general a paddle like that would have a very sharp catch (which isn’t universally popular) and quite a few people don’t like soft shafts (I’m not sure why, within reason). But one of the things I don’t like about blades that blade shape that many people might not consider is that you can really do some damage to your board (or you) with it if you make a mistake (eg. changing hands, or scratching for a wave) - those sharp blade corners can do some real damage. I think this is one of the reasons that surf-oriented paddles have tended to have more rounded shapes than race ones. If you are paddling pure flat water of course this probably won’t matter because screw-ups are so rare. But in the hurly-burly of surf or downwind, (or even some congested race conditions) stuff happens.

I’ve seen quite a few people put holes in their boards in races with their paddles. But maybe if they were on Nelo boards that wouldn’t happen, eh? ;)

While this is true, I see the performance of the Braca paddle as "so worth it". Every time we go out, we do risk damaging our equipment (biking, skiing, kiting, SUP - all the same in that regards). The key is to weigh the pros and cons.

After all, why limit our performance because we think we may put a scratch or two on our boards?
Are we also saying that a sharp fins and / or foils shouldn't be used because it could put a hole in our skin or other boards?

37
There's something I wanted to say for a long time about the Braca paddle for SUP.
Braca has been my go-to paddle for my surfski - for many years.
I have been paddling the Braca Maui for nearly two years* - and haven't looked back since.

WHO ARE THEY?
Braca is Worldwide-renown for innovations as well as always placing well on a variety of podiums. Better yet, they make paddles that are super durable, ultra light, and very efficient. Sadly, no one is reporting on the brand (for SUP or for Surfski or Flat Water Paddling). Their motto is to simply let their innovation win and sell itself (and that's about the only thing I don't agree with from Braca).

DISCLAIMER:
As a reminder, I no longer represent Braca in France, and I am not at all affiliated with Braca at this time.

FEEDBACK
Here are some simple facts & feedbacks on how I see this "Braca paddle for SUP" - specifically, after using the Maui blade & Soft shaft for nearly two years*. 
1. Very efficient
2. One of the lightest on the market
3. Fantastic grip in the water - without blowing a shoulder

WEIRD
The thing that I find weird about this paddle is that Bruno has decided to go with what seems to be the largest size for a blade. I went with the smallest one of them all (which really helps with stability, amongst other things).

THE BEST?
Is there a better paddle out there?
There's only one other paddle in the World that I would vouch for with my eyes closed: QB (but for almost twice the money).

PHOTO
No, the Braca Maui paddle has nothing to do with the archaic paddles that some people refer to in this forum. Here's a photo that may explain why this paddle grabs water so well... (sort of a different point of view from a camera).



(*) CORRECTION
- I have used the Braca Maui paddle since Dec 2017 (so not quite 2 years yet)

38
Well Bruno won his first race on the board (in Israel). Soft opposition for him but at least he’s come out swinging.

He took both technical and distance on what seems to be a Black Signature 2 14x22 but interestingly lost in the sprints to a local guy on a Mistral
Interesting. So much for weight being the most critical factor in short sprints. But Bruno is a distance guy really, isn’t he?

But I’d far rather be on a planing hull design like the Mistral Equinox than a convex hull design like the Signature 2.0 in a short sprint.

Kind of a far fetched statement, no?
While board weight plays a big part in short sprints, I don't think that anyone would ever stretch that to be the most critical factor - EVER.

There are 1/2 a dozen other factors that may have contributed to Bruno not getting first place in the sprints:
1. Sprints may or may not be his thing. Bruno didn't place so well at the Lost Mills Sprints, against some of the best in the World.
2. He's still on what I would consider "a new board for him".
3. First race on a new board, I would have played it "cool" on the somewhat meaningless sprints - in light of the bigger race coming up.
4. He may just not be "feeling it" on that day.

So when someone says that board weight is pretty important and should never be ignored - some people see this as:
"weight being the most critical factor in short sprints". Wow, I mean WOW!

39
The Signature 2.0 (14x23) isn't for everyone, but it's a great contender for the current race formats that I am seeing in France, as well as many other parts in the World.

I can totally see this board excel on the next Morbihan Paddle Trophy (usually taking place on a 20k course, with tides and wind at your back - and countless needs to sprint.)

Quick note:
Perhaps when I provided the list below, I should have written DOWNBREEZE instead of SMALL DOWNWIND, but the idea remains the same for those who read it until the end
.
Flat water: 9/10 (higher if it had less rocker)
Sprints: 9.9/10 (it's just a blast)
General Ocean Paddling: 9.5/10 (because it's got just the right amount of rocker to make it really fun)
Upwind: 9/10
Small downwind: 8/10
Messy conditions: 7.5/10 (higher score if the paddler is more competent than I)
Bigger downwind: doable, but not necessarily aimed at bigger conditions.
 
When working for Nelo, I did notice that they marketing / communication department is lacking fundamentals. I don't always agree with their strategies... Clearly, we all feel that there should be more images.

Here's to paddling in the Gorges du Verdon (in Winter).


40
Indeed, expressing disagreements isn’t always easy, but unfounded claims can be upsetting.
Here’s somewhat of a logical deduction: Maybe I am just tired of people claiming things that they know nothing about.

There are 100’s of people reading this thread, and so I can’t just sit back and let 7 individuals make unsounded claims like:
1) ”the Signature 2.0 is a flat water board, designed for inland paddlers.” It was even mentioned that it wouldn’t do well as an all around board in the Ocean.
2) “I know how to spot a tippy board when I see one” – without ever seeing one in this case. 
3) “I believe that round boards cannot DW well, or surf well” – but then has the poster even looked at NSP boards, Molokai Channel crossings, Travis, or simply the sport of surfskis?

All 3 statements above are unfounded, and do not represent the Signature 2.0

The latest, people pointing out how the Signature 2.0 can't handle hefty conditions with ease.

Do you not see how ridiculous this is, and the irony of it all?????
It's black: no, it's white.
It's a fast board: no, it's too tippy (look at the video).
it can surf: no, it can't (I have never tried one, but I know that it cannot possibly surf).
It's versatile: no, it can't handle 20-foot swells (look at the average speed).
It's super light: no, it will sink.


Remember: Seemingly, there are only 10 people commenting here.
1 of the 10 has publically admitted that he wasn’t ready for his purchase.
2 others have tried the board (including myself).
That leaves about 7 people who have made so many claims about the Nelo Signature, without so much as seeing one.






41
Disclaimer:
I have not seen the original video - but I would love to.

I am a bit surprised though. A few days ago, many of you were automatically assuming that the Signature 2.0 was a flat water board, designed (supposedly) for inland paddling like super calm lakes and such. Claims (by people who haven't tried the board) went on about how it was really only aimed at inland paddlers. Then you see the same board on a hefty Downwind and jumped ship… but you still haven’t seen the board in real life, let alone paddled a Signature 2.0 (14x23).

You should know that:
1. The 2.0 (14x23) has more of a rounded hull than the Sprint 14x23 – that helps with speed.
2. The 2.0 (14x23) has more rocker than the Sprint 14x23 – that helps with making it more versatile, in a variety of conditions.
3. The 2.0 (14x23) is way lighter than the Sprint 14x23 – that helps with super fast starts, sprint races, and makes catching smaller bumps that much easier.
4. The 2.0 (14x23) has many attributes, but isn’t a DW specific board by any stretch of the imagination – even if it can handle way bigger Ocean conditions than the Sprint 14x23. 

** RECAP ** WHAT IS THE SIGNATURE AIMED AT
To simplify, here's how I would rate the Signature 2.0 (14x23) in a hurry:
Flat water: 9/10 (higher if it had less rocker)
Sprints: 9.9/10 (it's just a blast)
General Ocean Paddling: 9.5/10 (because it's got just the right amount of rocker to make it really fun)
Upwind: 9/10
Small downwind: 8/10
Messy conditions: 7.5/10 (higher score if the paddler is more competent than I)
Bigger downwind: doable, but not necessarily aimed at bigger conditions.

42
Absolutely no doubt that "everything else being totally equal" a dugout board will be more stable - just as soon as your brain gets accustomed to the "opposites" effects. Keep in mind that some people have spent many years paddling ON TOP of a board and only on top. For them, a dugout will feel very different to them, especially during the first few minutes on the board (again, because of the opposites effects). Some people will "never" get used to that... but only because they are content with what they got.

Another point probably worth noting about dugout boards:
Paddle size!

Using my Allstar (14x25) required me to purchase a new paddle, for all my boards were dugouts and therefore too short. I have to admit though, having a shorter paddle is not only lighter and easier to swing around, but it just feel so much better all around.

But hey: let me now turn the page over to all of those who will hate dugout boards, hollow boards, UL, and/or anything light and super reactive (come on... it's a joke... LAUGH!)

43
@ LUC:
No, not necessarily an increasing impression - instead, I feel that the brain is getting the exact opposite reaction from one board to the other, like a mirror impression. But don't worry, I think it will be made simpler below...

--------------------------

Sorry guys... it's been a really LONG day.
Please allow me to simplify things, and so as to make the scenario much clearer.

To address what I believe to be true from personal experience:
- The side to side motion of a board is perceived very differently by our brains, depending on weather you are standing ON TOP of a board or INSIDE A DUGOUT board.

NOTE
In this example, both boards will tilt right 15 degrees.
Everything is completely exaggerated, but only to demonstrate what happens in a clearer manner.

IMPORTANT RESULTS
1.Foot placement doesn't change on the board.
2. The direction of each foot relative to the axis is exactly the OPPOSITE (from Standing ON TOP of a board to Standing INSIDE A DUGOUT board).
3. Keep your eyes on the right foot in the top 2 sketches below: you will notice that when the board lays flat, the right foot moves AWAY from the axis when you are PADDLING ON TOP (see the difference between 2 & 4).
4. Keep your eyes on the right foot in the bottom 2 sketches below: you will notice that when the board lays flat, the right foot moves CLOSER to the axis when you are PADDLING INSIDE A DUGOUT (see the difference between 6 & 8).





44
The following image should clarify that:
- WHEN STANDING ON TOP: the board tilts, green becomes red (the right foot moves +20 units away from the axis point)
- WHEN INSIDE A DUGOUT: the board tilts, blue becomes yellow (the right foot moves -5 units closer to the axis point).

***
The reason many people feel that a board is tippier than it should be is because the brain sometimes misinterprets tilts on dugout boards; the brain thinks the right foot should be moving away from the axis when in fact it's moving closer to the axis - or vise/versa depending on which board your come from.
***


45
It’s actually easy to demonstrate.
Pictures to follow when I have more time.

Imagine paddling ON TOP of a 14 footer, and your board tilts to the right. When this happens your feet will be to the right of the board’s axis.

Now imagine paddling INSIDE of a 14 footer, and same thing: your board tilts right. When this happens your feet will be to the LEFT of your board’s axis.

This is why people’s brains play tricks on the feeling of tippiness regarding dugout boards... when you are not used to them.
I’m going to need a diagram or two to understand your point, I’m afraid. Could you please just jot down what you mean?

Here's a RAW diagram.
The most important things to note:





ON TOP, the right green square goes FURTHER AWAY from the axis (as the board goes from flat to tilting right) – see the red result.

ON THE DUGOUT, the right green square GETS CLOSER to the axis (as the board goes from flat to tilting right) – see the yellow result.



EASIER:
For those paddling ON TOP of a board, your brain will get used to (say) a gain BUT will be completely out of whack when exactly the opposite happens with a DUGOUT board.

In attempt to explain it a little better (gees, it's so much easier to demonstrate in person) - I revamped the explanation. Let me know if it now makes sense:

ON TOP, the right green square goes FURTHER AWAY from the axis (as the board goes from flat to tilting right) – see the red result.

ON THE DUGOUT, the right green square GETS CLOSER to the axis (as the board goes from flat to tilting right) – see the yellow result.


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