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Topics - marvinhecht

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1
Foil SUP / Do 4-in-1 foil boards have too many compromises?
« on: December 17, 2020, 07:07:18 PM »
Hi guys,

There may be some "classic" threads on this already, if so please point me in the right direction. I love SUP surfing and I've decided that instead of going from a 10"6 to a 9"1 (or 155L to 130L)  I'd rather just get a foil. I SUP surf on the great lakes and it seems like getting a foil would be ideal for the temperamental, mushy, weak windswell we get, and make more rideable days of the year.  Two friends have bought foils, and the one friend is close enough that he will let me try his in spring. He bought a 3-in-1 Slingshot Shred Sled with Neilpryde foil, and is going to use it mostly to do windsurf foiling and wingfoiling. He is not really into SUP surfing (yet) but he wants to eventually try his foil in the surf after learning using the windsurf foiling (he calls it WWF and he is a fan of Reef Warrior). So my friend bought this 3-in-1 board for the purposes that suit him. He wants to get me into the windsurf foiling to - but to be honest other than learning to get up on a foil my main interest is in SUP surfing a foil, and I really like the idea of a 4-in-1, e.g. the Starboard 4-in-1 Hypernut. Reason: I'd love to take just the board and use it as a SUP surf on big days- because I've never had a small surf SUP before.

Here is the problem though, we had in intense discussion. It seems like 3-in-1 boards are shaped VERY boxy, are very fat and thick, and the rear end has that shape that rises up (like the back bottom of an airplane) - is it called the "channel", and are designed to minimize problems in splashdown, and maximize performance on the foil, since the board is out of the water most of the time. However, once you try and make a board that will also serve as a surf sup, it's gotta look a bit more like a traditional surf sup or shortboard - egg shape or pointier nose (at least slightly), hard thinned rails, and to make the trailer quad fins be were they normally are, you can only have that "channel" in the center portion of the board, like the Hypernut.

So my question is: do 4-in-1 boards have TOO many compromises? Are they jack-of-all-trades and master of none? Or.. not having actually foiled yet on anything, am I splitting hairs and starting an academic discussion about something that really doesn't matter.  A slightly separate question is - are 4-in-1 boards harder or easier to learn than 3-in-1 or 2-in-1 foils?

2
Hey, I am curious if y'all think SUP technology is still advancing with every year. My SUP knowledge is kind of stuck right around 2012-2016 when I lived in Hawaii and had been SUP surfing a lot. Brought my board back to Canada but didn't realize I could surf here until this year,  so I was out of the scene. I am starting to think of "downsizing" to a smaller board (or is that "upsizing" since you need more skill ?) and I was thinking something like a Naish Hokua, didn't really care about which year. I am a Laird fan (and nearly got his board instead of the Lopez) and I recently came across a Laird Surrator on eBay. Then I found a shop which may still have my "dream board" in stock: a 2016 Laird Hybrid Surfer - the one that is the Pearson Arrow Laird shape, but with a pointy nose and multiple colors on the board (looks less boring, more cool).

Except, I am beginning to realize SUP technology has changed, and/or is changing -- still. From reading other posts I just found out that most boards don't need rail tape anymore. A friend has a 2019 Starboard Pro, and I started watching review of various Starboard boards for 2021 - seems like the construction materials are getting lighter but also stronger. Seems like they are figuring out new and different ways to make "channels" in the back of the board, ways to make even thinner rails (or Infinity SUP - the Blurr has stepped rails). Then companies I don't remember have popped up - e.g. Sunova - they seem to be based out of Thailand, but have some famous engineers from the US? On their boards seems like they have various "steps" near the end of the tail - in the old days only surfboards had that - SUP were just "normal" shaped. Carbon or carbon areas seems to be a lot more prevalent in boards - it used to cost a LOT more and was limited to top end models. I am seeing various decks in SUPs now (domed vs flat). I did think (or hope?) that many or most boards would also start coming with a box to attach a foil so you could sup surf it or foil it.. that doesn't seem to have happened except for isolated models like the Hypernut. I have paid even less attention to racing SUP technology, but it seems like there is a trend to put more weight in the nose so they look like a torpedo, and then hollow out an area where the person stands that is lower than the rails etc. Some companies like Naish have focused more on foiling, free wings (new invention), and windsurf foiling (it seems) and some companies have become less prominent (e.g. LairdSup is out of stock and not sure if new models will come out). Then there are other companies I haven't hear of like SMIK, L41.. they seem to be new. Tom Carroll now has a whole line of boards not just one...

Let me know what I might have missed, what's coming, and/or which companies I should look into for my next board, and whether you think SUP technology is really changing, or if these are gimmicks (old wine in new shoes). Oh even the people doing SUP reviews have changed. It used to be "realboardsports" doing a lot of youtube videos, now it's "Sup Boarder" Oh i also forgot to mention the trend toward inflatible has continued to the point that it seems to be hard finding new hard boards to buy (sorry for the pun).  I did try a friend's inflatible and these new ones with more psi are bit better, but sorry, in the middle of surfing a wave I could feel the air shifting around and didn't like it, arghghg

3
Hi,

In other posts I entertained buying a smaller board but I have yet to really make full use of my own board, a 2014 Surftech Gerry Lopez Big Darling (Purple). It is a longboard-style surf SUP and it
The problem is not that I can't turn at all.  I can usually turn slightly left or right, and turn onto a wave, and do large arching turns, but I can't just whip it around 180 degrees to quickly catch a wave like I want to especially in the mushy windswell I now surf in (moved from Hawaii to Ontario, surfing in Lake Huron & Erie). I tell people it sort of feels  like I am "turning an oil tanker." Even in Hawaii on big waves, I never was able to actually do a bottom turn.

I will fully 100% admit that I am guilty as charged of not staying low enough on the board, not putting my weight or foot on the back of the board, and of not (yet) hiking the nose up to do a bouy-turn in the surf (I can do it fine in the flatwater). In another recent thread about a 2017 Naish board I had thought of buying I even posted several clips and you can see these issues in the videos.

However, while working on my form, I'd like to optimize my chances of being able to turn this board quicker. In the 6 years I've owned this board, I've always used it with quads. I had read or heard that quads were "better for performance" and just stuck with that. When I lost one of my quad GL1s in the ocean I bought a set of Quad GL2s. Then I lost one of those in the ocean, so for 3 years my default setup has been the GL2's up front and the GL1s in back (see pic). I am trying to individual replacement fins from Futures.com but having trouble. My first question is - given that the GL2s are a little smaller overall, and having the GL2s in the front and GL1s in the back makes the front fins not as big as they should be - should I replace the front quads with the white Futures T1 fins shown in the other pics? I've never used the white fins, they were cheap fins I bought for another board I was repairing - but they certainly are big!

Secondly, I am now learning that a thruster setup may in fact allow for easier turning especially for someone who is bad at stepping back more? Or perhaps it is better for me while I am learning to step back? So I think I'll be trying out the thruster setup soon. The only question is: for this thruster, I'll use the GL1 center fin, but do I want the bigger white T1 fins as my side fins? Or stick with the GL2s as side fins. They are smaller and would make it slightly more like a very mild 2+1 vs pure thruster (all fins equal size). Thanks for your help.

OK I've uploaded all the pics:
A) my default quad config (black GL2s front, honeycomb GL1s rear)
B) thruster  (honeycomb GL1 Center fin, black GL2 side bites
C) thruster  (honeycomb GL1 Center fin, white T1 side bites)
D) quad  (white T1s front, honeycomb GL1s rear)

One other option: While testing this board surftech put a set of V2F4 quads on it to "Liven it up", I can buy a 5-fin set for $99 right now. V2F4 fins are rated a 7.0 but not sure that what means.

4
Gear Talk / What is a 2017 Naish Mad Dog Bare Bones 8"1 x 29 SUP worth?
« on: November 13, 2020, 05:09:48 PM »
Hi,

I am looking for SUP that is smaller than my 10"6 x 29" Gerry Lopez Big Darling, so I can advance my SUP surfing and turn quicker in windswell on the Great Lakes. I am 5"9 and 195 lbs and dieting to get to 185 lbs.

I have a chance to buy a brand new, never used, never-touched-the-water 2017 Naish Mad Dog SUP in "Bare Bones" configuration. It is 8"1 x 29 and it does not come with any fins (because it is "Bare Bones" LOL, so I  would need to buy a set of 5 FCS II fins (I only have Futures fins). I find it very odd, but this person in 2020 bought this new-in-the-box 2017 SUP from an auction, interesting. I saw from the review I would have to put wax on it to use, or buy a deckpad, as it only has a rear kickpad (talk about bare bones!). The asking price of this individual is $1,067 in US ($1400 Canadian Dollars). Pics below.

I have seen the SUP Boarder video review on Youtube of the 8"6:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DnQ2FUAnAM
It's mostly positive but they do point out a number of weaknesses.

Money is tight plus I have to convince my wife to allow me to buy a second board- so really curious what you'all think it is worth, and/or what I should offer. The owner never got a chance to try out the board but is moving cross-country and is selling it. I even explained to them just get a board bag and pay the fee to take it on the plane as luggage, but lucky for me they don't want to do that.

I was trying to compare prices to current Naish Boards. Seems like Naish themselves have some really good sales.. the price of 2020 Mad Dog 8"1 may not be that far off from my price after buying the fins - except I have no clue how much taxes and duties would be slapped on by Canada, not to mention any issues with it being delivered to another country with covid.

https://naishusa.com/collections/sup-sale
2019 Hokua GTW 8"6    $ 1,238 (30% off list)
2020 Hokua GTW 8"1    $ 1,415  (20% off list)
2019 Mad Dog Carbon 8"11 $ 1,497 (30% off list)
2020 Mad Dog 8"1    $ 1,260  (20% off list)
2021 S25 Hokua GTW 8"6   $ 1,819
2021 S25 Mad Dog S-Glass 8"1 Sandwich $ 1,649

I am pretty excited, but not wedded to this board. Not sure I could balance on it right off. I like the heavy rocker of the Mad Dog on the nose and tail - I could have used that a few times lately to stop pearling when having to take waves steeply because they are mushy. I am also considering the Tom Caroll / Blane Chambers Loose Leaf in say 8"8 (there is a dealer up here). I'd love to get a LairdSup Arrow Suf surp but looks like they are sold out and not even available (there was an 8"8 Surrator on Ebay but it's gone now).

Thanks for any advice/tips/thoughts on the price! Marv

5
Hi- my wife and have our 25th anniversary Dec 27 and I can get that week off work. I am a dual US & Canadian citizen and I currently live near Toronto in Canada (and I've SUP surfed 3 great lakes now). Before covid, she said we can go anywhere in the world where you can SUP surf and I can have all inclusive (mostly for the drinks). So I was looking into Mexico (Mexican Pipeline?), somewhere in the Caribbean (shorter flight), Hawaii (but we lived there, so would not be new), California (have friends there), and I was even dreaming of flying us to French Polynesia / Bora Bora or Tahiti.  Now that COVID happened, and I am worried about getting it (esp the long-term effects) and right now our plans are to stay home and postpone the celebration. However, I think our new credit card offers some type of 2-week health insurance to cover COVID, and I am thinking.. MAYBE there is some place tropical we could still go - with a low likelihood of getting COVID, but decent hospitals in case we did? I've sort of ruled out Florida, Hawaii (with the recent re-opening I am worried), California, Nicaragua (I was told too dangerous due to the recent coop), Costa Rica (a friend's surf camp shut down, cases seem to be building), Brazil. I was thinking about Cuba, but it looks like it's hard to get or find gear to rent. I was thinking maybe of Europe such as Spain or Portugal, but now Canadians are going to be banned from travelling to Europe too. Any ideas?

6
Hi,

I own a 10"2 x 29in Gerry Lopez Big Darlin' Surftech Surf SUP, with his signature on the board. It is awesome, but I need a smaller board - I can now ride 9"3s, plus I have lost weight. I also moved from Hawaii to Canada - and at least so far, these wind swell generated waves seem to come quickly and so I need something more maneuverable to turn around quickly!

If I want to stick with Lopez, what are my options? I know that Gerry left Surftech for Naish in 2013. I know for sure he was shaping Naish's surfboards- did he shape any surf SUPs? I think the Hokua and Mad Dog are Naish's surf sups. Someone told me that Naish is different than Surftech - the surf sup "line" and board name remains the same, but different shapers are in charge over time and may "fine-tune" or "adjust" the form or rocker slightly. So therefore it is hard to tell which model (s) of surf sup Gerry worked on, for which years? For example did he work on the 2013, 2014, 2015 etc Hokua ?

It also appears Gerry may have left Naish - because I see a new line of Gerry Lopez surf boards by Surftech (but I do not see a line of surf sups by him). if so, would the 2018 , 2019, or 2020 model be the "last" versions of the Hokua that Gerry shaped?

Thanks! Marvin


7
Technique / What does "catching a rail" mean?
« on: December 03, 2014, 11:56:08 PM »
What does "catching a rail" mean? I know that it leads to a wipeout - but I don't understand. Thanks.

8

I am starting to do some downwinders (Hawaii Kai to Kahala in Oahu). I have enough credit built up with Surftech to get a surf SUP - but I've also thought of using that credit for a DW board. Does anyone here have actual experience DW'ing one of these boards..

Gerry Lopez 14'0 Kaiwi-Kai (Yellow Leapard) by Surftech
Gerry Lopez 12'6 Manu-Kai  (Blue Leapard) by Surftech
Bark Expedition 14'0 (Yellow and White - Planing hull) by Surftech
Bark Downwinder 14'0 (Upcoming 2015 model -if anyone here has demoe'd it, that would be cool)

.. and how do they compare to the following?

SIC Bullet 14" (EPS)
Blue Planet Bump Rider

- I had a brief ride on a SIC 14" Bullet but had to abort the DW run - it sure seemed to glide well on the open ocean. From everything I read and hear, the SIC's are the Ferrari's of DW boards...
- I did do a DW on the Bump Rider and that board was really nice - keeps you high and dry out there and I could start to get that surf/bump gliding feeling on the bumps even just the first time I rode it..

Thanks for any thoughts/ feedback

9
SUP General / Can't decide - Laird or Lopez for a surf SUP in Waikiki
« on: November 20, 2014, 07:56:26 PM »
I have enough credit to get a new (or relatively new) SUP board from SURFTECH. I need help deciding betweeen these models:

11" x 29ish Laird Pearson / Arrow SURFTECH  with 4+1 fin boxes
9.6" x 29ish Laird Pearson / Arrow SURFTECH  with 2+1 fin boxes
10"6 x 29ish Gerry Lopez Purple "Big Darling" SUP with 4+1 fin boxes. Or it may be possible to get one ofthe other Gerry's:
 2014 10"6 x 32 Blue Big Darling (nice, little wide)
 2014 Gerry Lopez Big Darling (widended for the last year) 11"2 x 32 (orange)
    - this last one seems nearly perfect, but I am worried I will grow out of
      it too soon.

Background:

I am living in Honolulu and have been SUP sufing for about 1.5 years now. My "home" breaks are Canoes, Pops, Paradise, and Three's (in that order). I've been on 2 downwinders and 1 race, but I like SUP surging the best. Also learning regular surfing but not as fond of it. I am 5"9. currently 220 lbs, but have been as low as 170 lbs (and dieting to get back down to that). I like the looseness of
quads so I would want to run quads in either case.

Skill: I can catch a wave fine, walk forward on the board to get more speed and get the last little bit of the wave, and my paddling form has improved recently. My balance is pretty good too - I can balance on my 12 x 26 sup-converted-to-windsurfer just fine.

What I am working on: Riding waves > 3/4 feet (face), entering at a steep wave at an angle (so as to not to summersault), I can turn on a wave *some* of the time to follow the curl. I can put my paddle out as a brace (Alma). I have not done a bottom turn yet, nor can I consistently  turn to follow the curl and go down the "trough". I have been riding mostly boards 11-12" but lately I am stable on 9.7" and 10" boards about 29" wide.

Goals: eventually be able to zig zag up and down the face, maybe do some tricks
(helicopter).

For those of you who have surfed both these boards - what are their characteristics and how would that help or hinder my getting to my goals?

In my experience the Laird allows me to do some things really well: I can step back and do a buoy turn / 360 really easily on the laird. I can glide really well on the laird. On the lopez's I can surf  a little better (i think). I didn't mention it above but I've also tried the surf music at pops and with quads it really rocked. But the surf music is so wide it feels like paddling a turtle!   

BTW - both Laird and Lopez have ended their relationship with Surftech - Laird now has his own company, and Lopez is with Naish. I am bummed out about that. The only surf sup shapers that surftech still has are Robert August and Al Merrick. I have only tried an Al Merrick 9.7 (a long time ago - and I was falling)...but I could also get a 2015 Al Merrick Caddi 10" but it is in AST not tuflite (and I am tough on things).  And I don't think a quad is available in the Merrick's.

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