Standup Zone Forum

The Foil Zone => Foil SUP => Topic started by: FOIL STOKE on October 07, 2022, 11:03:04 AM

Title: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 07, 2022, 11:03:04 AM
Hello SUZ! ;D

I am stoked beyond measure to have the chance to ramp up in this crazy beautiful sport. I am curious about a number of things and thus I had to reach out to you all. A little about me first. I am a surfer, mountain biker, snowboarder, kiter, TwinTip, Surfboard and kitefoiler etc etc. Ive been an athlete all my life. Two years ago I picked up a carbon surfski (Huki S1-X Special) and learned over the pandemic. At the beginning of my surfski ramp up, (all though having some decent paddle experience) I literally couldn't sit in the boat, fell everywhere and was lucky to have 100m paddled before climbing out of the sea, knackered and seriously humbled. Now I can crush any boat wake, tidal swell or wind swell, in 20kilometer chunks. Surfing the ski has been an amazing experience, being on the water is, as we all know, straight medicine. I mention it because this experience mirrors my SUP FOIL intro to the T. I am 210pounds 43 years old, pretty fit these days. My SUP Foil set up is the 6'3" Fanatic SKY SUP with a 2140 Naish front wing and 310 stab. QuickBlade Paddle UV88. I have two SUP Foil sessions under my belt and I knew this was going to hard but Holy s*&@ did I underestimate the difficulty - which is amazing. If I've learned anything in my 43 years is that the harder a thing is, the sweeter the victory. I felt like a bear trying to balance on a ball in the circus. I looked hilarious and was jeered at from the beach. lol. All amazing. After two - hour long sessions though I went from barely being able to stand on the board to getting four or five paddles in before bailing. Crawling out of the water both times, crushed and very happy. Ive broken in enough boards to know what I am going through is partly getting to know the balance signature -finding the sweet spot -> strengthening core muscles groups in order to achieve a natural balance point & getting use to the foil counterbalance point all while managing the paddle. Not to mention the paddle and its hydro dynamic signature. Its just different. Ive checked out the youtube universe (Jeremy Riggs in particular) and have my goals set out for the next few sessions. Drills like the sea saw drill, squat and forward thrust etc. 

Im curious though for those of you who have already done this ramp up what would you do differently? Any advice for me? Its intimidating to see legit watermen struggle, but when I look closely I see them persevere, breakthrough and then say its the hardest thing they've done to date followed closely by it was worth every single ounce of effort.  Im curious to know what is your experience?

I am also curious about the kind of swell that is fun to play in. What  I mean is I live by the sea (all though its sheltered from direct pacific swell) we have tidal swell, wind swell and boat wakes to play in. While on my surfski I often revel in immense amount of power in just tidal movements which on the surface can be uber micro but when you have a reference point beneath the water you can see how fast the water is moving against the sand. On super small days this is what I usually surf on my ski. The slower I go the harder it is, which is super fun. My thesis is this: Ill train to get on foil - without any waves or swell.. essentially flat water foil training. Im really curious about the possibilities in micro tidal swell, boat wakes, and micro downwind runs. When things get windy Im getting on my kites. I know what 8 knots looks like locally and this is perfect for the what Im thinking on my foil. At my local spot there is a re-bound wave that runs eastward off a pier which carries a lot of power. In days that have a westward wind I can run out on the ski and catch this hidden wave going east and then run back using the wind swept swell. Im wondering if this makes sense to anyone, what can I expect from the perspective of the foil?

In any case a this new challenge is just simply awesome. I love throwing myself into the deep end and wow have I found the pinnacle of difficult ramp ups. I suspect (and sincerely hope) Im on track for some serious fun. Love to hear from you guys.  8)

Cheers, DP
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: jondrums on October 09, 2022, 06:01:17 AM
I think you're going to be in for a tough time if you are planning to learn by doing flatwater or weak swell starts.  What you really want to learn with are slow rolling mushy waves that are just crumbling at the top.  If you can't find that, then go for steeper waves but try to find a spot that comes through on the slower side so its easier to catch.  I think even boat wake will be very difficult to catch while you are learning - you will want some power to learn how to get going and bring the board out of the water slowly.  To catch the small stuff you have to get the board out of the water quickly and just at the right moment.  You want something with more time so you can catch the wave with the board "surfing" in the water and feel the foil engage.  Then little by little let the board lift off the water just a little bit until you have the feel of the foil. 

I would suggest you commit to getting in the water a dozen times no matter what.  You will likely not start feeling like this will be fun until around that many sessions.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: Hdip on October 09, 2022, 09:14:23 AM
All kinds of swell are fun to play in. You just have to match your foil to the swell.

If you really have no breaking waves with no white water, you will need a very large foil. You will also need a board that is long and narrow to build board speed and get off the water.

Gear that works. Dave Kalama Barracuda. One of the huge GoFoil foils. One of the huge AXIS foils (1310 maybe). Ono Ava paddle. Go watch "Jeremy Riggs" instagram and youtube stuff. Learn all you can about proper SUP paddle technique. It'll all be paddle technique in those kinds of conditions.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 09, 2022, 09:24:17 AM
Thanks guys yes. I agreed the conditions I have locally are really challenging. I was out yesterday on my kitefoil for 2.5 hours.. I’m really starting to get my foil confidence up. Hip angles.. adapting while foiling.. being able to relax and sink back into foil.. pumping while powering the kite up etc.. I’m less worried about the foil on my SuP setup and more focused on my take off. @jondrums you’re bang on what I’m starting is really putting my paddle strength to the test. But in 3 short sessions I’ve come a long way. It’s a different ball game but I did get the foil to start rising enough to feel the power of my foil start to kick in on axis wind section. I’m s baby steps for me at the moment. I just need to up my paddle power which is slowly coming. A dozen paddles is a great goal. I’m happy with my 2140 naish wing and SUP sky setup. Just need more paddle power! Haha Thanks for the reply guys!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 12, 2022, 02:12:00 PM
One thing I have noticed is that the stock strap setup for my front foot is too far back for the forward setting of my foil. I read somewhere that in setting up a SUP FOIL board you mount the foil up towards the nose. If I were to mount the foil on the board then pick it up by the front wing, the board will sit level. That has put the sweet spot (center) of the board further up and it has make it so that the foil acts as a brake when my foot is in the strap. Good for resistance/paddle training, bad for trying to get on foil. Ive removed the strap to let my front foot find its equilibrium. I think I should be setting everything up for max glide.. including no tail wing shim. Am I close to right?

I am going to be out on the water today so we will see how that goes.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 17, 2022, 12:34:32 PM
Just thought I would touch base guys.. I'm 7 sessions in and wow.. SUPFOIL paddling is no joke. I have leveled up my power output several times and see now I have lots of room to go. I am astonished at how difficult this is but I am loving the steep ramp up. I'm up to half the time on my feet, half either paddling surf style or on my knees. I had one run on my feet last session that was my longest - about 100 seconds... starting to get the paddle power up to the point where I can bounce the board and foil together and was starting to feel the foil lift. All though my weight distribution is too far back. The timing is tricky and I feel like a fish out of water with everything going on. The various tidal movements/and boat wakes are giving me something to paddle into/with but I'm really just learning the positioning of the foil in the water related to the movement of the water. The counterbalancing is slowly coming.. Im just starting to be able to lean into the board and foil when its getting powered up. Most of all I'm just physically getting ramped up. My shoulders are on fire and my core is getting a blast like no other. I've taught myself how to kite (don't recommend), surf, kitefoil, & surfski but this takes the cake. SO rad. Ive had 3 people stop and ask me if I ok post session,. lol. AM I doing it right!? haha Im going to keep at it as I can see 6 months down the road physically being able to pull myself into sections of water/waves and being to put it together so that I can get on foil with regularity. We shall see:)

I'm currently thinking about mast positioning.. I played around with it being mid or closer to the front and what I've found is that the mid point has a longer slower foil initiation. When the mast is towards the front of the board I can get the nose up earlier in my paddle stroke. Ill keep at it and report back. @jondrums - I think you were bang on about the dozen sessions I can see now the work/fun ratio improving slowly.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: jondrums on October 17, 2022, 03:13:34 PM
Is this on your 6'3" fanatic board?  Congratulations on getting that board out of the water on boat wake and paddle power alone.  That's a huge accomplishment, and I'm pretty sure I couldn't do it.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 17, 2022, 04:13:13 PM
@jondrums Im just starting to feel the board lift with paddle power. Im not on foil yet. Added with the swell or wave energy, thats where Im getting the most lift. I did ping someone today who is mostly focused on flat water starts and he said its critical that the mast is placed at the back of the track. I have been mounting forward so I will see how that goes. It makes a lot of sense to me that you would want to trim for the least drag. I feel as though I was plowing a field paddling in the water having it trimmed like it was.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 31, 2022, 01:06:30 PM
Hey guys.. Just thought I post a video showing session 14. My timing is still off. (love to know if you guys have any advice on the pump timing). I think Im not putting enough front foot pressure down on my sprints. The oscillation required to gain lift on the foil is not happening ... Im too worried about the nose being buried. Anyways having waaay more fun now. Im starting to feel the power of the foil 8)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4PXN1i0xCk

Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: jondrums on October 31, 2022, 02:57:18 PM
I'm no expert  From what I see, I think you are giving up / backing off too early.  It can take a lot more paddling strokes to get fully up to speed - it seems like you are just getting going when you quit.  See if you can get twice as many strokes even if you don't feel it happening yet.  I can't see your stance, but bend your legs and get them involved - you want to be scooching the board forward with each stroke.  That little extra board speed may be all you need. 
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on October 31, 2022, 04:03:00 PM
@jondrums thank you mate. That makes total sense to me. I will make those adjustments!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: Hdip on October 31, 2022, 04:45:35 PM
Are you trying to paddle up in bumps? Looks like you're trying to time the little bumps What foil are you using? It'll have to be pretty big as those bumps seem quite small. I do realize the GoPro angle makes them look smaller.

I don't do that sport, but I'll repeat what I've heard smarter people than me say. Try to get your catch further forward if possible. Get your paddle in the water at or in front of the nose of your board. Get the paddle out of the water by your front foot and for sure out before it get's to your back foot.

I'll agree with Jondrums. Take double the amount of strokes. More slow ones first to build speed, then build speed even more, then start using your legs.

Sounds like you're progressing though and will get there pretty soon though. Nice job.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: pafoil on October 31, 2022, 10:40:27 PM
Hey guys.. Just thought I post a video showing session 14. My timing is still off. (love to know if you guys have any advice on the pump timing). I think Im not putting enough front foot pressure down on my sprints. The oscillation required to gain lift on the foil is not happening ... Im too worried about the nose being buried. Anyways having waaay more fun now. Im starting to feel the power of the foil 8)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4PXN1i0xCk

What you are trying is possible but hard. The equipment selection is not ideal for flat starts or catching small bumps. The board is heavy and the foil, perhaps small for your weight. I believe it has been said that you should go first to look for some small rolling waves.
I you still want to catch the waves saw in the video, then I would suggest a longer, lighter and narrower board; a bigger foil and a bigger paddle. 

This is the speed feeling you get per stroke on a narrow board (board 6,9 by 20 , foil GT2200 for 175 lb weight, paddle vdrive 101)

https://www.instagram.com/p/Chwpy06obJu/


Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on November 01, 2022, 09:22:16 AM
Thanks for the comments guys much appreciated.

@Hdip The foil Im running is the Naish 2140 Jet HA with 310 stab. Just last night Ive trimmed up the rear stab for more lift. Even though Im 210lbs I do think Im able to get the paddle power needed. The 106litres is just buoyant enough for me, all though I have to say the learning curve was STEEEEP, lol. Just staying on the board in any swell is a rad workout. What Im telling myself is that with some small adjustments in my technique (more weight forward during catch, more paddles strokes & timing of the bounce and unweighting of the board etc) I should be able to get up. Ive just started to subscribe to Casey and the modules he has is helping - massive.

I believe with very little to zero foil oscillation Ive been able to get the board up to speed and been able to feel the stability of the foil. Especially when I time the unweighting of the board. My aim is to be more accurate with the paddle pump/driving of the front foot and unweighting so I can get the board & foil to start that sine wave. Im hoping with some small timing and technique adjustments, Ill be off and foiling - Hopefully:).

@pafoil Possible but hard - seriously just what I needed to hear! Possible is what I was looking for! I surf/kitefoil as well and I know with the help of a wave it would be much easier. I dont have that locally, just the wind and tidal/wake swell you see in the videos. Thanks for the insta link. The board looks stellar. The more I think about it the game is to start of the board oscillation/pumping in small wavelengths to build up the power and speed without burying the nose and killing the speed. You are bang on with a board that is longer narrower I would be able to do that easier. Ill give it a go on my current setup for now.. but thanks for the heads up as I think you are bang on.

Thank you again for the comments! Cheers!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: pafoil on November 01, 2022, 09:51:22 AM
Thanks for the comments guys much appreciated.

@Hdip The foil Im running is the Naish 2140 Jet HA with 310 stab. Just last night Ive trimmed up the rear stab for more lift. Even though Im 210lbs I do think Im able to get the paddle power needed. The 106litres is just buoyant enough for me, all though I have to say the learning curve was STEEEEP, lol. Just staying on the board in any swell is a rad workout. What Im telling myself is that with some small adjustments in my technique (more weight forward during catch, more paddles strokes & timing of the bounce and unweighting of the board etc) I should be able to get up. Ive just started to subscribe to Casey and the modules he has is helping - massive.

I believe with very little to zero foil oscillation Ive been able to get the board up to speed and been able to feel the stability of the foil. Especially when I time the unweighting of the board. My aim is to be more accurate with the paddle pump/driving of the front foot and unweighting so I can get the board & foil to start that sine wave. Im hoping with some small timing and technique adjustments, Ill be off and foiling - Hopefully:).

@pafoil Possible but hard - seriously just what I needed to hear! Possible is what I was looking for! I surf/kitefoil as well and I know with the help of a wave it would be much easier. I dont have that locally, just the wind and tidal/wake swell you see in the videos. Thanks for the insta link. The board looks stellar. The more I think about it the game is to start of the board oscillation/pumping in small wavelengths to build up the power and speed without burying the nose and killing the speed. You are bang on with a board that is longer narrower I would be able to do that easier. Ill give it a go on my current setup for now.. but thanks for the heads up as I think you are bang on.

Thank you again for the comments! Cheers!

I started with the same board. Good luck!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on December 01, 2022, 09:49:03 AM
After lots of paddling/experimenting and additional reading/asking around and considering what you guys have said in this forum + winging my Fanatic 6'3" and feeling what kind power is needed to get my current setup out of the water I have come to the conclusion that I need to get a different board. This is of course what HDIP PAFOIL and others are saying. Thank you gents for the nudge in the right direction. Of course finances and good old stubbornness play their parts. I have very much enjoyed the time spent paddling my Fanatic setup as it was not only good training in general but great cross training for winging and for a base for what I am seeking to do which is to foil these micro bumps we have locally quite consistently. That being said I am looking to purchase a board that will be dedicated to SUPFOIL and I want to ping you guys on the right purchase.

Option 1. Harpoon. Most expensive route (custom shaped) but damn that board looks amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpg7SMx5jfY

Option 2. Sunova Aviator Elite

https://sunovasurfboards.com/en/legends/casey/aviator-downwind-elite

I am leaning towards this for a few reasons, one the price. But two - Casey/Sunova- has developed this board, I believe, with this discipline in mind. Really he lists this board as not a stable board but the easiest possible paddle up board in flattish conditions. They list this as: Elite; you need to have good balance for these boards. Generally it should be your second or third downwind SUP foilboard, not your first. If you like to throw yourself in the deep end and suffer a little this could be for you too.

Ill put myself in the category of -  throw yourself in the deep end and suffer a little, lol.

My question to you guys is the literage as the shape is bang on. Knowing what I know now the more the better really. The 106l I have needs a good deal of energy to even start to plain. The 7'6" is 137 litres which I think is perfect. Had to ping you guys though. What do you think?




Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: SUS4Life on December 01, 2022, 10:46:18 AM
I would demo both if possible.  im about 180lb and find my kalama E3(5'10x22.5 100L) pretty stable but I have 10 yrs of sup surfing experience. I think you want a board volume that your feet just at water level or 1/2" high when you standing on it.  I found board to be more unstable when it have too much volume and your center of gravity increase.  But too low of volume you will have to dig yourself out when catching a wave and also trying not to sink the nose at the same time.
You probably will catch more of the mirco bumps with the bigger board and have a lot more fun compare to Sunova unless they make a slight higher volume one.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on December 01, 2022, 11:53:18 AM
@SUS4Life yes.. this makes sense to me. You're on a 100l board at 81kgs.. Im 95kgs on a 106l board and looking to go to a 137..maaaybe the 7'3 would be the best cross over (at 128litres) but that ratio makes sense to me. My 106l is basically a good trainer for SUPFOIL but a beginner/light wind WING FOIL board which is right where I am at the moment. I think I would take buoyancy (instability) over a smaller board because of the light conditions I am trying to get up in.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: PonoBill on December 01, 2022, 09:34:03 PM
I'm not even trying to paddle up in anything resembling flatwater. I'm a heavy (220#), clumsy geezer. I need either waves or a wing to foil. but I see all the folks around me who are doing it, both in Hood River and in Maui. It's a big deal in both places. And all of them are on Kalama boards. As in 100 percent. They might start off with something else, but when they start to see some success and start to improve, they get onto a Kalama board as quickly as they can. Most start there.

As I say, that doesn't reflect any kind of experience, but most of the people pioneering this stuff are here and Hood River. Jeremy Riggs, Dave Kalama, Austin Kalama, and most of the other folks working on changing the way SUP and prone foiling is done are longtime friends. At the very best, most of the other boards I see are copies of Kalama boards with the board shapers' own ideas tossed in. That's great, and if Dave wasn't developing this stuff every day I'd say he's likely to be overshadowed, but right now he's running fairly strong, far ahead of the pack. You can ask him to design and build you a board that suits you exactly based on what he knows--which is one hell of a lot. If I were doing what you're attempting, I wouldn't consider anything else.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on December 02, 2022, 09:43:18 AM
Thanks PonoBill, that resonates. I think I've watched that Jeremy Riggs video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTCu1hG-ioc) about 1,000 times. Im still trying to get my mind wrapped around the idea that either the speed is needed to get up on foil or the technique. Probably both. Jeremy's 72Kg to board ratio is about .68. (72kg/105l) mine would be .73 (95kg/130l) so Im sitting deeper in the water. That why I suppose I was leaning towards a board that had length and volume. That 6'5 X 27 from kalama sounds killer though. Food for thought PonoBill thank you!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: PonoBill on December 02, 2022, 10:29:59 AM
Dave is on Facebook, you could message him and ask what he'd recommend for you. As everyone knows who has spent any time with him, he's a very approachable guy and a straight talker.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on December 02, 2022, 01:36:57 PM
Awesome thank you! I will take you up on that as I would love the input.

Cheers!
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: pafoil on December 09, 2022, 06:17:29 PM
@SUS4Life yes.. this makes sense to me. You're on a 100l board at 81kgs.. Im 95kgs on a 106l board and looking to go to a 137..maaaybe the 7'3 would be the best cross over (at 128litres) but that ratio makes sense to me. My 106l is basically a good trainer for SUPFOIL but a beginner/light wind WING FOIL board which is right where I am at the moment. I think I would take buoyancy (instability) over a smaller board because of the light conditions I am trying to get up in.

Thanks for the credit. I have a lot of people now asking about getting into the wave earlier and longer skinnier boards; which I highly recommend and use for downwind bay runs.
But then these guys see me using my 5,0 Kalama in the waves they freak out. Just to be clear, for small waves (1m), it is always more fun to use a smaller, more agile board. Getting into waves early is fun but requires paddling and consumes a lot of energy.  Getting into a wave at the right moment requires almost no energy.
Anyway, follow your path, and good luck.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on January 12, 2023, 01:05:52 PM
Hi All,

After careful consideration (and saving up) I have pulled the trigger on a custom carbon deck. DIMS - 8 X 21 X 6 @ 131L

I looked hard at the Sunova Aviator Elite and the Kalama offering. In the end the idea of supporting my local shaper (who is a beauty) and being able to have a full carbon deck sealed the deal. I will follow up with pics and a review when I can. Im OBV stoked to see what I can do once I get my hand on her. The pursuit continues..

 8)
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 01, 2023, 05:00:07 PM
Fellow frothers...

I took receipt of my DW Carbon sled last night. Had to share in the pre-stoke as Ive yet to have her in the water yet. That comes this weekend. Jay from Inouye Customs in Deep Cove killed this build. Im stoked beyond measure and cant wait to ramp on her. Ill post after I get some water time. Im in no rush really.. just stoked bloody stoked. Since commissioning this build Ive seen many been able to get up on flatwater using simular DIM'd boards. Ill have to earn my flights.. Im stoked boys.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: PonoBill on March 03, 2023, 08:39:50 PM
Very pretty, and it's a great idea to get something more robust to start with. The Kalama custom boards use carbon patches top and bottom, a little uni carbon on the rail, and the rest is light glass. I don't know what the schedule is, but from pressing my fingers on them I'd say not more than two layers of 6oz. The only thing holding me back from getting one for light wind winging (and maybe someday if I have a bunch of liposuction done, I might be able to SUP downwind one) is that I'd destroy it in a week. I'm heavy and clumsy. Not a good combo.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 06, 2023, 09:53:00 PM
Very pretty, and it's a great idea to get something more robust to start with. The Kalama custom boards use carbon patches top and bottom, a little uni carbon on the rail, and the rest is light glass. I don't know what the schedule is, but from pressing my fingers on them I'd say not more than two layers of 6oz. The only thing holding me back from getting one for light wind winging (and maybe someday if I have a bunch of liposuction done, I might be able to SUP downwind one) is that I'd destroy it in a week. I'm heavy and clumsy. Not a good combo.

thank you Pono!

Sharpening the angle of attack on the catch is my new mission. Lower, quieter and more snap. Im still struggling to visualize the foil turning over WITH the power stroke, still not in the right body position, Im making progress though. What is stuck in my head at the moment is the Jeremy Riggs idea of your paddle being quicker at the end of the stroke than the beginning. I have limited paddle experience so perhaps its common place but this simple idea changed the way I am thinking about my paddle stroke. Powering in more of a half oval motion. My shoulders and back loved this very much,.

Here she is in the water.. better than I could have hoped for. Im all set for 6 months speed/paddle training @ 3 times a week. 2 hour per sessions. I figure by Sept Ill have the paddle power to get up to foil. We shall see! :P

https://youtu.be/kZqrmTUS8-I?t=22
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: Badger on March 07, 2023, 04:20:23 AM
I'm curious. How did you determine where to put the foil in the tracks? Did you wing foil it first?

-
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 07, 2023, 05:50:09 AM
I'm curious. How did you determine where to put the foil in the tracks? Did you wing foil it first?

-

Hey Badger, no I havent yet, but I will when the winds up. Im just experimenting at the moment but def forward of center. This session was about an 2inches back from the front. Im going try a pinch more forward on the weekend.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 14, 2023, 02:03:18 PM
https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxVmjPGjovf8AKtdaw33Zo7E77UDK9haCl

I think my back foot pressure and timing can be improved. Its great conditioning but my gut tells me to focus on the timing and efficiency.

Baby steps baby.. the stoke is growing!!

Any pointers from the frothers crew would be amazing. Not many paddle foilers out my way..

Im off to study the Riggs videos in particular the Casey catch up with Jeremy Riggs DW series #13 on youtube.  8)
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: Badger on March 14, 2023, 04:15:36 PM
https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxVmjPGjovf8AKtdaw33Zo7E77UDK9haCl

I think my back foot pressure and timing can be improved. Its great conditioning but my gut tells me to focus on the timing and efficiency.

Baby steps baby.. the stoke is growing!!

Any pointers from the frothers crew would be amazing. Not many paddle foilers out my way..

Im off to study the Riggs videos in particular the Casey catch up with Jeremy Riggs DW series #13 on youtube.  8)

Hard to tell in the video. Are you attempting flatwater pop-ups or is there a small swell running?


Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: yugi on March 15, 2023, 07:19:12 AM
I'm curious. How did you determine where to put the foil in the tracks? Did you wing foil it first?

-

hi

Curious... Is there a rule of thumb for placement in the tracks for flat water standup paddling up with respect to where it works well for wingdinging?
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 15, 2023, 12:02:59 PM
Hi Badger, what you're seeing in the video is largely a receding tidal current plus some small wakes. Im amazed at how my foil will power up with these water movements though. Its surprising me.. and catching me off guard. One side of the foil wing will power up in this swell .. pretty neat. Just have to dial in my attack angle. Im 3 sessions in but I think I will dial that in fairly quickly. Just knowing about it is unreal. I knew it would be a lot of fun, but its surpassed my expectations. Its wicked fun just trying to be out there playing the wave/tidal energy. The foil when she is spoiling up has way more power than I thought there would be. Sooo fun just trying to get a grip on her..

Yugi:) The foil track mount position is a bit of a choose your own adventure situation IMHO. I found that when I have the foil mounted at the front of the track I am able to get some lift from the nose of the board but really its a pivot point that feel right to me. Now I need to get more elevation (which I believe to be from the lack of back foot pressure) off the power stroke. The angle of incidence is lacking and I dont get the board rising enough to gain the space necessary to drive the foil forward and down. Something Im keying in on now. Daswusup said it best.. working the board while still creates a map of the balance point of the board and foil. I suspect that balance point is unique to each board and foil combo. Dialling in the correct board pressure, and ultimately the correct foil action is what we are after. The mast position is just a piece of the equation. If I put the mast position further back it would create a different position for my back foot to work with on the power stroke. At the moment I need more positive angle and therefore it will stay on the front of the track. I may dial it back at some point but not before I am getting on FOIL reliably. If I took her winging im sure I could dial it back as i would have the power needed in the wing (hand held) to put the right attack angle in the FOIL.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on March 23, 2023, 10:16:59 AM
I finally felt the proper lifting action from accurate paddling and foil action.

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxRVkvRC9KTlMerin5AyL_kgSKmZ3_Epva

I honestly wasnt sure what do to when I felt the lift.. like a kid caught with his hand in the cookie jar.. haha. Now that Ive felt that Im on a mission to get more accurate, efficient and be able to build on this progress. I can see super clearly the work im putting in now is the foundation for what is to come.
Title: Re: My SUP FOIL Journey Begins!
Post by: FOIL STOKE on April 02, 2023, 08:45:41 PM
First time up, and it was glorious..

https://youtu.be/SFIp-Mi5tK0

Im STOOOOKED for the next 6 months. As what I saw today we do get in tidal swells often. Im pretty blown away at the FOIL and the angles that it powers up in. Ill pull across the board in a J stroke and at a certain angle the FOIL will start to power up down the line of the receding tidal water line. Its addicting and I am all in!!! Ill close this thread out. Massive thanks to you guys in the SUZ! PonoBill, PAfoil, Badger, Jondrums, Hdip, Sus4life,  8)

Ill be doing my Jeremy Riggs training drills with hopes to keep progressing. Building on the trajectory of the last month is best case scenario for me boys.

Peace!

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