Standup Zone Forum
General => Random => Topic started by: Tom on March 07, 2021, 03:50:49 PM
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My wife and I got our 2nd Covid shot yesterday and we've been talking about what a weird year we've been through. Getting the shot makes the light at the end of the tunnel very close and much brighter. That got me to thinking about where we were one year ago and I've been looking at some of the interesting posts on this forum from a year ago. Remember the good old days (3/17/2020) when we were concerned because there were 3,502 cases and 39 deaths in the US and there were 168,926 cases and 1,564 deaths world wide.
https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35836.0.html
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Hi Tom
You are fortunate to have access to vaccination. I live in Canada and we are perhaps two to three months behind the US in vaccine rollout. It appears we will try to give everyone the opportunity to receive a single vaccination by the end of June followed by a 2nd dose 16 weeks later. The modelling suggests that this is a reasonable strategy with limited resources. I took my 101 year old mother to have her first dose today. My niece stayed up all night to book the appointment two weeks ago with the website overwhelmed. We may never return to the numbers you quoted from a year ago. We will be in this tunnel for the foreseeable future. Mutations and a large pool of anti vaccinations will keep it cycling. While the vaccine will prevent many if not most hospitalization and deaths it appears that it will not prevent infection and transmission completely. The new normal is going to look quite different than that of 18 months ago.
Bob
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I did my part for Herd Immunity. I got it, wife got it, son got it, mother in law got it most friends got it. The 92 year old mother in law recovered from that but died of what appeared to be natural causes with a possible stroke about a month afterward, and she'd been knocking on the pearly gates for 2 years.
The family debate now is "do I still need the vaccine? I say no. The whole point of a vaccine is to give you antibodies with which your body can fight off an infection. I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that I have those antibodies at the same rate as a vaccinated person. Also my understanding of travel restrictions currently are freedom of movement for those vaccinated and those who've recovered from the virus with a medical record as such, and quarantines for those who haven't been, or haven't contracted. I hope this sensible plan is implemented. I've heard horror stories first hand from a neighbor that got vaccinated after having it. I'm so completely done with this lockdown and it's way better here than in other places.
By the way, it was similar in severity to a normal flu. Stats: 58yo, Heart attack 6 years ago, a fair bit out of shape but put in a 3 hour session last Sunday. in 3-5' surf, no breathing issues.
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One pro-vaccine thought SJ - it might protect you against other variants.
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Just because you got it doesn't mean you won't get it again. It's not like the mumps or chicken pox. If you had it you should still get the vaccine.
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Bean may have politely led you somewhere... This is worth a listen or read
https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19/91567?xid=nl_marty_2021-03-10&eun=g1282527d0r
Somewhat off the the immediate post, but I do not think anti-vaxers or anti-mask'ers should get the vaccine. Sadly, the effects of plagues are often foisted upon the truly poor and igorant, whereas the 'proudly ignorant' often suffer little. Even stupid politics enter into this; I imagine Trump not wanting to look like a Lefty wuss to his herd ...hiding the fact that he got his vaccine in January.
Jim
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I rarely wear a mask, get scolded less and less frequently lately.
I have the vaccine. Got it yesterday. Left shoulder. Left arm has been tingling since last night, now I have a sore throat, headache in the back of my neck, ears ringing and fever. Had to cancel a tee time for this afternoon. Haven't been this sick since Jan 2020.
Fuck you vaccine.
I should not have this vaccine per the "vaccine phases", I lift weights, surf, run, golf and have no comorbidities (except 20 extra Lbs that comes and goes). I have been called no less than 5X by my local pharmacy when someone did not show up for their scheduled vax, yesterday I was in my office that is only 1/2 block from one of the pharmacy branches and so I got the vaccine.
Each time I said, "Isn't there someone who is older, fatter or more needy." They always said "Yes, but getting to those people who are not on cell phones or can't drive is really hard, we need to have these shots used up by 5pm." You know why I got priority, because they knew I could be counted on to show up and have an insurance card in my hand - low hanging fruit gets picked first. Big Pharma wins again.
I regret it now, I am going to waste this Friday being sick when I should be playing. There is basically no spread of cv-19 in my local community currently, and my chances of a bad outcome from the disease are extremely low.
I don't know what I was thinking agreeing to it. Although I guess now I will unabashedly throw my dirty old masks away, so that is an upside. I also think we may have to get cv tests to travel, which should be avoidable with the vaxx I am really going to try and figure out when to get my 2nd shot. Probably schedule some continuing education webinars for the day after.
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Moderna 1 followed by Moderna 2. No issues. Glad I did It. Might even go to Philly and harass my daughter, grandson, and son-in-law..
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Pfizer 1 yesterday at Javits Center NYC.
Awesome efficient setup filled with young Army, Staties, Natl Guard. All cheerful, and helpful. 100's of shot stations. Heartening, impressive public effort. I was in and out in 6 minutes (snuck out of the 15 min observation area lest my car get towed).
Side effects nil. Surfed Rockaway at dusk today. Fun sesh. Hoping to visit daughter/surf Bodega Bay in 6 weeks, when vaccine in full force.
Psyched to be vaccinated, but no layup. These variants are awful. They are already prevalent in the US. And we have our very own NYC variant, featured in 65% of new cases in Manhattan. We are nearly certain to have a bad 4th wave bc of variants. Gotta vax everyone fast as possible--then stay masked distant and careful. Our only hope to not have many more deaths, and ruined hospital staff.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1373070181774295040.html
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Pfizer 1 two days ago. Sore arm for about 24 hrs. Other the the third arm growing out of my back, I haven't notice any side affects... Love Bill Gates! ;D
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Update, I felt better after the above episode and then had dinner - to bed. Once I laid down my fingers and toes were on fire, felt like getting tapped in the funny bone for hours straight. Could not get any sleep. Fine now.
I played basketball last night and talked to our local basketball coach/P.E. Teacher. She basically lifts weights and runs like a border collie, probably hasn't had candy bar in 15 years. I would say her body fat percentage is basically zero. She got the same vaccine and passed completely out the next day. Had to get on an EKG machine, etc.
I wonder if people who metabolize better have rougher outcomes with the vaccine?
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Sorry you were laid up sup leave, I also had some symptoms after pfizer 1 (arm sore, mild headache, fatigue), I understand it is not unusual for a couple of days. The symptoms show your immune system is reacting to the vaccine which is good, you are making anti-bodies. Its possible healthier people might respond more. This is way better than the effects of even a week or 2 of non-hospital covid, and to be able to travel with more confidence or gather un-masked with others who are vaccinated (as per CDC guidelines) is well worth it.
Please everyone do your part to stop the spread and get your shot before the next wave or variants.
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Pfizer 1 shot Friday, no side effects at all . Looking forward to shot 2 in a few weeks.
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I played basketball last night and talked to our local basketball coach/P.E. Teacher. She basically lifts weights and runs like a border collie, probably hasn't had candy bar in 15 years. I would say her body fat percentage is basically zero. She got the same vaccine and passed completely out the next day. Had to get on an EKG machine, etc.
I wonder if people who metabolize better have rougher outcomes with the vaccine?
What was her age?
I work with a guy who is a fit 30 year old. Plays hockey regularly and was an aspiring near pro level player (10 years ago). He got the 1 shot J&J Vaccine on Weds. He was knocked OUT the following day. 24 hours of flu-like symptoms down for the count. Couldn't even e-mail.
The theory is it hits the younger harder (truth or not). I would suggest that if older people are NOT impacted as much its because their systems have seen the offender before, in some related form.
The overarching evidence is that this virus doesn't kill 90% to 99% of the people it infects because our immune systems know how to deal with it. The only way to get to 99.99% survival however is to get the darn vaccine. I am amazed by the 'older' people that are rebelling against vaccination.
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I signed up for a double blind study with the J & J vaccine in October. No reaction at all so I figured I got the placebo. They told me if I could get an appointment for an approved vaccine they would unblind me. In February I called to get unblinded and they told me I had the real vaccine. FWIW, I am 75 so that theory may have some merit.
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I played basketball last night and talked to our local basketball coach/P.E. Teacher. She basically lifts weights and runs like a border collie, probably hasn't had candy bar in 15 years. I would say her body fat percentage is basically zero. She got the same vaccine and passed completely out the next day. Had to get on an EKG machine, etc.
I wonder if people who metabolize better have rougher outcomes with the vaccine?
What was her age?
I work with a guy who is a fit 30 year old. Plays hockey regularly and was an aspiring near pro level player (10 years ago). He got the 1 shot J&J Vaccine on Weds. He was knocked OUT the following day. 24 hours of flu-like symptoms down for the count. Couldn't even e-mail.
The theory is it hits the younger harder (truth or not). I would suggest that if older people are NOT impacted as much its because their systems have seen the offender before, in some related form.
The overarching evidence is that this virus doesn't kill 90% to 99% of the people it infects because our immune systems know how to deal with it. The only way to get to 99.99% survival however is to get the darn vaccine. I am amazed by the 'older' people that are rebelling against vaccination.
She is early 30s, was a D1 basketball player and if you have to guard her would swear she still is.
I ran into my pharmacist in the bar on Saturday night and gave him a bitch slap for how sick it made me. He had 2 theories, the one above about younger peoples immune system being more active with a new virus introduced and the other being that I already had CV-19 and somehow that caused it. He told me anecdotally, that he heard more reaction to the first shot from people who had the virus before. He bought be a couple rounds for pain an sufferin'.
Anyone see that Krispy Kreme will give you a donut every day for a year if you show your vaccine card? https://www.krispykreme.com/promos/vaccineoffer
Big Pharma and Big Donut are teaming up to make sure Americans never get off sugar and pills.
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It's starting to look like people who have actually HAD Covid who get the vaccine may, in about 2-3% of the cases, have a strong immune reaction to the vaccine. The bad news--you'll be sick for a day or two. the good news, you probably won't have it again for quite a while--maybe never. The early data is exactly that--early. Most docs think the strong reaction is a good thing unless you are already weak to start with. Most people with a weaker immune system don't get very sick. I guess my immune system is somewhere in the middle--a little tiredness and malaise, and I thought someone else was renting my arm, but not super sick.
Diane had no major response to the first shot, sick as a dog from the second. My youngest daughter, who has the immune system of a goat, was sick as hell from both shots. My oldest daughter, who is equally tough, had no reaction at all other than a red spot on her arm.
Pretty much the ultimate in YMMV (Your milage may vary).
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It's starting to look like people who have actually HAD Covid who get the vaccine may, in about 2-3% of the cases, have a strong immune reaction to the vaccine. The bad news--you'll be sick for a day or two. the good news, you probably won't have it again for quite a while--maybe never. The early data is exactly that--early. Most docs think the strong reaction is a good thing unless you are already weak to start with. Most people with a weaker immune system don't get very sick. I guess my immune system is somewhere in the middle--a little tiredness and malaise, and I thought someone else was renting my arm, but not super sick.
Diane had no major response to the first shot, sick as a dog from the second. My youngest daughter, who has the immune system of a goat, was sick as hell from both shots. My oldest daughter, who is equally tough, had no reaction at all other than a red spot on her arm.
Pretty much the ultimate in YMMV (Your milage may vary).
I get my 2nd the day after you get here, on the april fools day. My 78 old sister got her 2nd yesterday, 101 fever, voice was dragging on the phone, didn't want to talk. All who I've talk to say, after the 2nd shot, you rebound in 24 hrs.
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For Jacky, myself, and all the other windsurfers at our beach, we all felt slightly “off” for 24-36 hours after the 2nd shot. Sick-ish, but not sick. We all got Moderna.
We could have winged the day after the shot, but decided to rest that day.
All retired people.
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It's so worthwhile being vaccinated, even if you still mask up to be around other people it seems more like a courtesy than something you need to do to not get a potentially lethal infection or take a chance on bringing that home to your family. Diane and I have had a few restaurant meals. It feels like the beginning of normal.
I wear a respirator at my shop a lot of the time anyway, there's a lot of things I do that demand it unless you aren't that fond of breathing. Several times I've forgotten I had the damned thing on and took a run to the hardware store. At least I won't look like an idiot or a bandit doing that anymore.
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J an J yesterday. Little prick (hold it) and no issues. Digging the one step option.
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22 year old neighbor's kid. Last year of college. Got one vaccine shot (of 2).
He goes on a ski trip with 3 others 2 weeks ago. Western US - Utah, Jackson Hole . . . 3 of the 4 catch Covid. He does NOT catch Covid.
He was the only person half vaccinated. One shot and he escaped. Law of small averages - YES - but encouraging data point.
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I know your wife is Irish, but I didn't know that was enough to confer Irishness to your nether parts.
After reading summaries of the studies of the vaccine efficacy and how both the companies making them and medical authorities explaining them talk about the vaccines I came to the conclusion that anti-marketing is the only flavor permitted.
Focusing on the percent of efficacy is completely misleading unless a full explanation of the methodology can be somehow transferred to the most thickheaded audience--that's unlikely.
If I were marketing these "products" the story would be something like "If you get one shot you almost certainly won't get or spread Covid, in the unlikely event you do it will be mild, get the second shot and your life can get back to normal".
The efficacy of all the vaccines is far better than anyone could have hoped. The J&J vaccine is viewed as inferior because of the way its test results are reported when in reality it is just as good and superior in many ways. Get any of them and you won't be hospitalized or die from Covid. You might be sick for two days, but no worse than a bad cold. And then you get your life back.
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The J&J vaccine was in trials while the Great Britain and South African variants were present. If the Moderna and Pfizer were tested while those variants were present, they might have similar efficacy as the J&J.
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Here's the problem with a vaccine efficacy number--it relates only to the trial, not real-world outcomes. It's the difference in infection rate between test vs. placebo group--that's all. There's no attempt to manage how much exposure to COVID occurs--no one is spraying virus in the test group's throat. Most importantly the efficacy number doesn't report the outcome of the infections that do occur. It's just the percentage difference in infections between test and placebo groups.
For Moderna, Pfizer, and J&J the hospitalization and death rate for the vaccinated group was essentially zero. The placebo group hospitalization and death rate mirrored the general population.
You might wonder "why two shots". It's not completely clear from my reading, but it looks like the biggest concern is the fragility of the mRNA shots and the short window for effective doses once the vaccine is thawed. Two shots dramatically reduce the chance you got a less effective dose. The primary reason J&J is a single shot seems to be that the vaccine requires less special treatment.
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That’s about as good an explanation as I’ve heard on the second dose PB.
We seem to be lagging a little here in NJ, but I finally aged into a vaccine appointment for tomorrow morning. Most likely Moderna, but would welcome any of the options at this point.
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Just had my 2nd Pfizer shot yesterday afternoon. Had the chills and my joints ached all night. Still have the aches, fogged brain and my left arm still hurts at the shot point. I'm up and around kinda... Wouldn't do anything physical though.
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Got my 2nd Moderna on the first. Yes a few hrs of chills and aches/fever 100. Then it broke and I was fine. Below is my take on whether or not to get a vaccines.
I remember one is those 1950s WWII movies. An Italian/American guy pulls his hair through his slicked back hair by his locker on a ship about to send soldiers ashore for an amphibious landing. A nervous shipmate asks him, “Hey, Angelo, you nervous? You think we’re gonna make it?” And Angelo brushes it off, “They can’t kill me, I’m from New Jersey.” That guy’s line, brimming with such a huge reservoir of confidence, always stuck with me. Of course in the movie, just like reality, he ‘got it’ first. And I’m all for confidence but when it comes to whether or not to vaccinate yourself some of you might be thinking, man, I don’t want to put that crap in my body. I’m going to make myself strong and jack my immunity up, because I’m from ’New Jersey’ (or wherever) where they made us tough. I admire that kind of bravado but for me, I know I haven’t been a monk during my life. My lungs especially. I’ve probably smoked more than Cheech and Chong. I eat sugar. Active but still, slightly overweight. Genetically, I know I’m no ‘wunderkind’. I allowed all those vaccines to be shot in me during my youth, like polio, which took Salk two and a half years to develop. Hilleman was credited with creating the first measles and mumps vaccine in two years. So is this one ‘rushed’ having been developed in a year? It’s been 50-60 years since those vaccines were made. I think it’s reasonable that the developmental process has been cut in half during the last half century. What about down the line? I hear that and again, we didn’t know what would happen with those vaccines we took as kids. I know I have a hefty scar from my smallpox, so my modeling career is down the tubes. But I know the amount of people who will change their minds is zero from anything I write here but the anti-vax thing is insanity.
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Got my 2nd Moderna on the first. Yes a few hrs of chills and aches/fever 100. Then it broke and I was fine. Below is my take on whether or not to get a vaccines.
I remember one is those 1950s WWII movies. An Italian/American guy pulls his hair through his slicked back hair by his locker on a ship about to send soldiers ashore for an amphibious landing. A nervous shipmate asks him, “Hey, Angelo, you nervous? You think we’re gonna make it?” And Angelo brushes it off, “They can’t kill me, I’m from New Jersey.” That guy’s line, brimming with such a huge reservoir of confidence, always stuck with me. Of course in the movie, just like reality, he ‘got it’ first. And I’m all for confidence but when it comes to whether or not to vaccinate yourself some of you might be thinking, man, I don’t want to put that crap in my body. I’m going to make myself strong and jack my immunity up, because I’m from ’New Jersey’ (or wherever) where they made us tough. I admire that kind of bravado but for me, I know I haven’t been a monk during my life. My lungs especially. I’ve probably smoked more than Cheech and Chong. I eat sugar. Active but still, slightly overweight. Genetically, I know I’m no ‘wunderkind’. I allowed all those vaccines to be shot in me during my youth, like polio, which took Salk two and a half years to develop. Hilleman was credited with creating the first measles and mumps vaccine in two years. So is this one ‘rushed’ having been developed in a year? It’s been 50-60 years since those vaccines were made. I think it’s reasonable that the developmental process has been cut in half during the last half century. What about down the line? I hear that and again, we didn’t know what would happen with those vaccines we took as kids. I know I have a hefty scar from my smallpox, so my modeling career is down the tubes. But I know the amount of people who will change their minds is zero from anything I write here but the anti-vax thing is insanity.
Agreed. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Now that everyone is eligible, it is selfish and reckless to obstain just to protect one person. We are on the brink of wave 4 and it blows my mind that I talk to people who are “just not sure” about getting the vaccine. Do your part. Get it and wear your effing mask in public and this will pass.
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Got my 2nd Moderna on the first. . . . But I know the amount of people who will change their minds is zero from anything I write here but the anti-vax thing is insanity.
We are on the brink of wave 4 and it blows my mind that I talk to people who are “just not sure” about getting the vaccine. Do your part. Get it and wear your effing mask in public and this will pass.
To quote my latest favorite book: The Demon Haunted World
"Whenever our ethnic or national prejudices are aroused, in times of scarcity, during challenges to national self-esteem or nerve, when we agonize about our diminished cosmic place and purpose, or when fanaticism is bubbling up around us - then, habits of thought familiar from ages past reach for the controls.
The candle flame gutters. Its little pool of light trembles. Darkness gathers. The demons begin to stir." - Carl Sagan
Demons demons everywhere.
After I got my first shot one of my friends said "How's that microchip feel in your arm?" And he was serious. People think Bill Gates is injecting them with a tracking device or we are lemmings going down for the count. With all science you have to recognize that the probability of anything is rarely 0% or 100%. But I would bet against the chip in the arm theory.
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People believe they have superior knowledge. Especially the truly stupid.
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What about down the line? I hear that and again, we didn’t know what would happen with those vaccines we took as kids. I know I have a hefty scar from my smallpox, so my modeling career is down the tubes.
A lyric snip from an old Tragically Hip song, "the start of enough". Love that. That is what these vaccines are for us. The start of enough. The beginning of our fight back but not an answer simply by their existence. If it works, how well it works, depends entirely on participation. Less sick people, less transmission, less chance for more problematic mutations. Necessary now, and possibly regularly as we go forward. We are lucky to have these.
The song is appropriately, Vaccination Scar. Headmount, I know that you enjoy a well written description.
This tear on your bare shoulder
This little silver boulder
This slowly falling star
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CaXJc_EhPg
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2nd pfizer yestd. Feel sick, bad nights sleep taking it easy today. Looking forward to better times and some sup/surf travel, yeeeha!
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Felt sick all yesterday. All my joint ached. Slept great last night. Paddled 4 miles this morning. Just took it easy.
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Pfizer 2 yesterday. Only complaint was that it took 45 mins instead of 6 this time. Sign said they had vaccinated >15,000 in prior 24 hrs. Impressive operation. NY just opened to 30yo and up, and opens next week to all adults. California too. Eager for my daughters to be eligible.
Best course now is for as many of us to get vaxed as quickly as possible, and "us" needs to consider the rest of the world. With Brazil going full petri dish who knows what variants they can produce. Generosity with our resources and vaccine would benefit us.
Israel has been quickest to vax the most, and it's been good for them--bc of this, they have best data on vax issues. Importantly also, they collect data (we are just getting our data collection capabilities up to speed, finally).
I was happy with this:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/pfizer-says-its-covid-vaccine-safe-91-effective-up-to-6-months-after-2nd-dose/
Then this printed:
https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/coronavirus/1617185858-antibody-levels-drop-sharply-after-3-months-of-second-vaccine-jab-israeli-study
Net, weve got lots to learn about these viruses.
There is a story where the vax slows spread/mutations, virus burns out, and treatments improve sufficient to allow normalcy. Jeeze I hope that's our story.
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Daily vaccinations have peaked I believe earlier this week. Even though it is now available for anyone who wants one, the demand is waning. I talked to my pharmacist buddy last weekend. I said "We can't be more than 1 week from having no demand for this vaccine, right?" He disagreed and was seeing such strong numbers through the little vaccination clinics his pharmacy was running, that he thought his gravy train was going for another month. He texted yesterday and told me I was dead on and that vacc appointments fell off the table on Wed this week. He went from full bookings to 50% utilization, and cancelled weekend clinics. Public clinics cannot find enough arms to poke either.
Again the "public health" people have failed to understand human nature. If they said "GET YOUR VACCINE AND GO BACK TO NORMAL", vaccine demand would stay elevated. The people I know who don't have the vax are all the same, none of them are political, or science'y reasons; they are all "What is in it for me?". The pundits are saying things like "we need to increase access to vaccines, etc" The access thing is in the rearview mirror. They need to increase demand, if we are following the carrot and stick methodology the stick (fear) people have the vax, we need to make the carrot more enticing.
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I have a friend that explained to me that he is not going to get the vaccine because he knows his natural immune system will take care of it and then he'll have natural antibodies that he can pass on to others which is the only way we will reach herd immunity.
You just can't argue with that.
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No, there's no point in arguing with such potent stupidity. I do wonder how he intends to pass on his "natural immunity". Blood transfusions?
Yes, it appears no one in public health has the least bit of marketing sensibility--why would they? They work in an absolute monopoly. Monopolies suck at marketing.
There has been a fiendish element of this pandemic that plays out in vaccination as well--until the hospitals get overwhelmed its old people who die of it. Some of the comments I've heard from younger people are bloodcurdling. Like dismissing their mother's death from Covid because she was "circling the drain anyway."
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In one fell swoop the CDC ended mask mandates. Allowing individual areas to determine if they are required. WA and OR have both ended their mask mandates "for vaccinated people". Which of course should have been the direction from the outset of vaccinations. There would be a lot more vaccinated people had they done this.
I just spent 10 minutes on Facebook (terrible) and 90% of the responses I see to the news story is: "I'm still wearing my mask as I don't trust other people. I follow the science. I am protecting the vulnerable!"
I can't get my head around it. There is 4 solid months of vaccination data available that show they are working really well, and that vaccinated people don't spread any disease. Masks have become some kind of religious dogma for people. I imagine that the news cycle will pivot towards how good the vaccines are now that CDC has finally got this message out and the mask weirdos will calm down. But maybe not, for many people there is no better feeling than smug pretend martyrdom.
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Stupid in every way. I have no problem picturing the ivory tower conference room discussions and political ass-kissing that drives these decisions. "You don't need a mask if you're vaccinated" is the most obvious marketing AND public health approach, and they've squandered that. Boneheads.
And yes, when I drive through Paia I see nearly everyone wearing masks outdoors. Once people get used to something they just do it. The funniest sight I saw recently was a nicely put together young lady wearing a microscopic bikini and a mask. The mask had at least three times as much cloth as the entire bikini (no, I didn't measure, just a careful estimate). Walking around fundamentally naked wearing a mask is quite an interesting fashion choice.
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I just have trouble believing that mask wearing accomplishes very much. For Dr's and nurses wearing them properly and using the correct masks, yes I can believe. For the average person wearing a mask that doesn't fit tight, is made of cloth, and gets washed once a week, not so much. I guess it prevents someone from sneezing on you.
I was exposed to covid for 3 days, no mask, due to my son having it. We shipped him back to his bio dads house where everyone was sick once we knew what was happening. I Never caught it.
I'm not an anti-vaxer, getting my 2nd shingles shot monday. But still have not done the covid shot. I'm on the fence.
JP
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A vaccine against a highly contagious, potentially fatal disease is available that is astonishingly effective, all but eliminates the potential for you to spread the disease to people you care about, with no significant side effects for healthy people--and you choose not to get it. But you vaccinate against Shingles--a potential source of extreme discomfort but not life-threatening, only contagious by direct contact with fluid from the sores to people who have never had chickenpox and are not vaccinated against it. What keeps you on the fence?
The efficacy of masks has now been extensively studied and demonstrated. No, they are not as effective as a properly fitted respirator--they aren't a talisman, or a political statement, just a tool. People wandering about with a filthy mask and their nose uncovered look as stupid as someone with their pants under their dick. That doesn't make a mask ineffective for you unless you choose to do the same thing.
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:)
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I chose Moderna. Am 73. Have had both shots I choose to wear a mask. Georgia is an interesting
place to observe a wide variety of responses and behaviors..
Am not exercising my open carry rights..
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A vaccine against a highly contagious, potentially fatal disease is available that is astonishingly effective, all but eliminates the potential for you to spread the disease to people you care about, with no significant side effects for healthy people--and you choose not to get it. But you vaccinate against Shingles--a potential source of extreme discomfort but not life-threatening, only contagious by direct contact with fluid from the sores to people who have never had chickenpox and are not vaccinated against it. What keeps you on the fence?
The efficacy of masks has now been extensively studied and demonstrated. No, they are not as effective as a properly fitted respirator--they aren't a talisman, or a political statement, just a tool. People wandering about with a filthy mask and their nose uncovered look as stupid as someone with their pants under their dick. That doesn't make a mask ineffective for you unless you choose to do the same thing.
I had a Hernia operation 2 months ago and the doc said no covid shot for a while. I still put the shingles vaccine at a higher priority FOR ME. Now that the state of Hawaii is talking about letting folks in without a test if vaccinated, I will likely get the shot if they indeed change the rules.
JP
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I have a really hard time understanding people who fight against wearing masks and the "anti' vaccination" groups. There was a guy on this site a while ago talking about our rights and how we shouldn't have to wear masks. He went so far as to lie about having a medical condition to try and avoid wearing a mask in a store. I mean come on. For fucks sake, if you don't want to wear a mask or get a vaccine for yourself, then at least show some compassion and do it for others.
And just to be clear, the person I'm referencing above is not you jpeter.
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Yesterday on my way to go foil I drove by a group of people at the intersection of Haleakala Highway and Hana Highway who had signs opposing vaccine passports and calling masks "The newest Tyranny".
There's a lot of tyranny in the world. I have to wonder how sheltered and privileged a person's life needs to be to consider a mask mandate to be tyranny.
Covering genitals--the new tyranny. Requiring driver's licenses--the new tyranny. They won't let me take a dump in the aisles at Safeway--tyrants!
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Both my parents are in their 70s and both had cancer.
Both my dad and my former mother in law have anxiety.
The stress of the fear mongering, lockdowns, and social isolation put them both in the hospital Last summer. They both had strokes within a few weeks of each other. My dad was in for three weeks had a bleeding ulcer, kidney failure and almost bled out.
So my real life lived experience is that lockdowns and spreading fear are deadly dangerous and cause harm. Also nobody I know has tested positive for covid, nor has anyone I know died from it. So my real world experience is that covid poses zero threat. All the people I know who have the vaccine have reported side effects.
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Consider yourself lucky--but not that unusual. In a country of 330 million people, 560,000 people dying from Covid means lots of people will not directly know people who died. I knew one person who died of Covid--young, healthy, fit, and now dead. It's a little more unusual that of the 33 million people in the USA that have had Covid, you don't know any of them. I know a few dozen people who have had it, most of them have long-term effects.
It's hard to prove a negative, but looking at the hospitalization trends prior to vaccines being available, and the excess death rate, we dodged a nasty bullet. Places where hospitals were overwhelmed are graphic examples of what can and did happen. If you don't live in one of those places the threat seems distant.
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My best friend, his wife and their kids got COVID about 6 months ago. He and his wife still cannot taste or smell. Their kids didn't loose their taste or ability to smell. My wife is a nurse and had COVID patients. It didn't phase her because she's had to deal with TB patients in isolation on a weekly basis for more than 25 years. Gown up, face mask, face shield, gloves, even filtered air system occasionally for highly infectious patients. When she leaves the room, it all comes off and goes in the trash. Repeat that 9 to 10 times a shift.
A lot of her COVID patients had lost digits, organ failure and a number of other life changing results. She said she's never had a flu patient with anywhere near that kind of life long damage. Everyone I ask if they've been vaccinated and did they have and lasting side effects, all have said they're fine. My whole family has had the vaccination and they are all fine. Even my parents at almost 90 years old.
Get vaccinated. It's free.
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Anecdotal evidence is enough for a lot of people who never take the time to understand that devastating public health crises are never evenly distributed. I’m old enough to remember Polio, which was more of an equal opportunity killer and crippler. Hundreds of thousands of people got it and died, or spent their life in an iron lung, or walked with braces and crutches for their life. People kept their kids inside for the entire summer. People were thrilled to have a vaccine. Everyone wanted it. I got both the
Salk and Sabine vaccines in school, sitting at my desk. No parental consent, no anti-vaxxers except the Christian Scientists who were universally considered whackjobs.
Despite all that I only knew one person who had polio, and for him the result was minor facial paralysis. If you don’t work in the field, or don’t happen to be in a location with overwhelmed medical staff, people just wont see that much—until they do, and then they’ll want immediate care regardless of the circumstances.
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All of our individual circumstances will be different. Would be a pretty boring existence if this wasn't the case. I think however, there comes a time when we need to look beyond our own experience, and take into account what we need to do for the greater good. And in my opinion, a global pandemic qualifies as one of these times.
I'm a pretty healthy guy. I'm 68 years old but generally pretty fit and don't have any of the conditions that Covid seems to target. I always felt that if I got Covid I would be O.K., although admittedly this thinking was before the variants hit. But I wore a mask and got vaccinated because even though I thought I'd be O.K., I know I would have felt terrible if I got Covid and passed it on to someone else. That was a chance I wasn't willing to take. And quite frankly, and with all due respect, in my view to do otherwise is nothing short of selfish. Because in a pandemic, our individual choices and actions can have a devastating effect on others.
As for personal experience, for the longest time I didn't know anyone who had Covid. Then I had a friend get it who had no symptoms. I also have family in India, and my cousin's husband got quite sick with Covid (but is recovering), and my second cousin's uncle, who had diabetes, got Covid and died ten days later. I also know a couple of others who had contracted the disease, again without serious consequences.
But the most telling example I can give comes from a young woman who is a friend of ours and lives in Portugal. At one point Portugal was hit terribly hard with Covid. I believe for a time they were one of the worst areas in the world. This young woman's grandparents both got Covid. They were taken to the hospital in an ambulance but couldn't get inside the hospital. I don't remember how many days their treatment lasted, but the entirety of their treatment took place in the hospital parking lot in the back of the ambulance. When we expressed shock at this, our friend said it was actually a good thing, because it was well known that if you went into the hospital with Covid, the only way you were coming out was in a pine box.
During that same video chat, my wife asked this young woman if there were rallies in Portugal against masks and if there were anti vaccination groups. I will never forget her reply. She said "No." She said that there was so much Covid in Portugal, that "if you don't know someone..." and here I thought she was going to say "if you don't know someone who has had Covid...". But this wasn't what she said. What she said was "if you don't know someone who has died from Covid then you know someone who knows someone else who has died from Covid". Pretty frightening.
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As a kid, there was a park surrounding our local 'TB San' we would play in while some were kept in an Iron Lung fighting tuberculosis. I played on ..because it didn't affect me. Nobody I knew had it. As an adult, I would be much more cautious if tuberculosis seemed to be rampant as Covid. I see Spring Breakers, anti-vaxers, etc, and scratch my head?
The country went bug c'hit on 911 ...we watched it on TV in our shop. Thank god they didn't show the jumpers. It was horrifying... 2,977 died that day.
We have had 34,000,000 (as in million) cases of COVID in the US alone... 600,000 deaths and people are still saying "It hasn't affected me." The—prospect of—the shortage of toilet paper or choir practice being called off seems to have been a cause of larger concern to some.
I got an email about two weeks ago from a young fellow in India who did contract paintings for us two decades ago. His mother had died two days prior ...and he had it. He has not replied to my offer of what help I could be from here—he may never.
Jim
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There are still 700 people a day dying here in the US. Covid isn't done. It is most likely to become endemic. If you are fortunate enough not to have been infected, know someone who has been infected or know someone who has died from this, you still have plenty of time. This will be around and how well we do as individuals and as a society and world depends on vaccination. We have these vaccines that are easily tolerated and super effective. The resistance to that is/has been mind boggling.
(https://media.nature.com/lw800/magazine-assets/d41586-021-00396-2/d41586-021-00396-2_18861630.png)
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Noone who was here in NYC during Spring '20 discounts the deadly seriousness of Covid.
It killed my father and 47/200 in the highbrow assisted living facility in which he lived. It quickly killed a healthy 24 YO fitness buff who worked in the same office as me.
I know a few people who were excellent, driven professionals who are long-hauling and nowhere near their former selves. I brought pizzas to the hospital nearby me here in Brooklyn and was horrified.
Few here resist being vaccinated, and ive heard of few problems, but for occasional flu-like symptoms for a short time.
New Yorkers thank God for the vaccine.
And Covid is not over. It's brewing all over the world. It behooves us to attend. Read about the coincident fungal infections emerging in India. The fungus likes the eyes. Eye removal can be the last hope for survival. It's infected thousands and unfettered so far.
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CV-19 will definitely become/is endemic. What is the argument that it would not? The only question is the severity of the attenuated version. It is currently the 4th most common respiratory virus circulating in the globe and it could stay at that ranking and bump back to the top for years. The severity of it will determine if it is vaccine worthy in coming years, right now it is vaccine worthy as it can clip you pretty hard.
It is rampant in my community right now. 50% of people are vaccinated, but I know at least 20 people who have it as I type this. Literally within a week I went from "its over" to "everyone has it". Most people had minor colds, some had fevers for a few days. This is the first time I have personally known more than 1 person with it. One lady (one of my friends mother) is going to die in the next couple of days. No surprise in that she has pretty much all the comorbidities you don't want to have with CV, but still sad.
What I think the "science" needs to determine is how well did any of the NPIs work? Why did we change the playbook from 200 years of study of infectious disease over 2 months in 2020? They have determined that less than 10% of the infected can spread the disease, thus the exponential spread model is not exactly correct. We just saw the huge spike in cases in India and the rise and fall was so steep, that there is no way it could have spread that fast from 10% of carriers making contact. The only reason I can determine the curve has a gaussian profile is timing of the reporting and hours in the day to test people. Uruguay and the supposed model compliant society of Taiwan also just experienced their big spike in cases.
We keep hearing things like "we let our guard down" and there were "unsanctioned events", but maybe human interaction is far less important in the spread that we think. Why do meat packing plants and nursing homes get outbreaks, while airplanes and dentists offices never have them? Everyone is wearing masks in those places. How does a rural area get sudden spread without large parties or events, when only 10% of people with the illness spread it? The math can't keep up for just interpersonal contact within 6'.
My mind keeps going to fecal aerosols, but clearly the tiny aerosols can hang in the air for a long time. Maybe the "contact tracing" is just not effective enough to ever really point out any correlation.
My family was impacted far, far more by the NPIs than the CV19. I will remain pretty steadfast that had we treated 2020 as a very bad flu season without the myopic draconian measures the excess deaths could have been less (still more than normal), but we could have cut out missed cancers, failure to thrive, obesity and long term mental health.