Standup Zone Forum

The Foil Zone => Wingsurfing, Windfoiling, Wingfoiling, Wing SUP => Topic started by: flkiter on December 19, 2020, 06:49:24 AM

Title: Another one for the boomers
Post by: flkiter on December 19, 2020, 06:49:24 AM
Demetri of epic is getting into winging. I had him on a wing less than a year ago and he's already fully hooked.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on December 20, 2020, 07:14:09 AM
Looks like Epic took the centre strut from the Duotone Unit (curve) and the handles (mini boom) from the Cabrinha V2. 

We need you to give it a thorough try and let us know what you think.
Title: OK Boomer
Post by: PonoBill on December 20, 2020, 08:20:49 AM
Looks good, though it misses out on the one handing benefit for upwind and some of the transition benefits. I don't think a boom has to extend to the leading edge to give full benefits, but something to fill that gap would be great.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 02, 2021, 08:32:12 PM
Here's Alan Cadiz on a Duotone prototype (?), which looks like a cross between the Echo and the Unit.  About one minute in he turns on the afterburners and everyone looks like like they're in a scene out of the movie Tenet (they look like they're moving backwards).  While visiting Maui in 1989 I saw him do the same thing with a sailboard -- make everyone else look like they were sailing backwards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMRmKSlMMuI
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: PonoBill on January 02, 2021, 08:49:23 PM
OK boomer.

Alan is a freak though, I think it's that hat. He's had that thing for as long as I've known him, which must be close to 40 years now. I took windsurfing lessons from him in the early 80s.

Looking at all those wings in the little fucking harbor is just nuts. Last winter, if there were five wings out it, it was a lot. Tracy Dudley just messaged me that most days there are fifty wingers out. I thought she was exaggerating. Nope. Wow. And the harbor sux. I'd rather wing almost anywhere but there. North shore surf must be off the charts. No wind on the south side??

Alan lives across the street from Ken Winner, which surely gives him a few months lead on new toys.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 03, 2021, 03:36:25 PM
Here's another wing with a centre strut and two long solid handles.  It comes in an eight metre size as well!  I'm not sure I can keep up with all the new product.

https://kitesource.ca/products/airush-freewing-pro
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Dwight (DW) on January 03, 2021, 03:53:09 PM
Interesting. Nice handles.

Canopy looks like sail cloth, not kite cloth.

2 rear windows aimed at a blind spot.

2 battens

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50797737197_16e567124b_c.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50796882688_03985a711f_c.jpg)

Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 03, 2021, 04:04:35 PM
Battens are removable but this to me seems like extra set up and pack down time.  The battens must be for stability so the wing should be stable.  Looks like a lot of draft -- will it be susceptible to backwinding?
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: PonoBill on January 03, 2021, 06:48:04 PM
Hsuria??
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 03, 2021, 07:07:49 PM
More about the Duotone -- the next three or four months will be an interesting ride!  Pretty "Slick" looking wing.

https://www.surfshop-w7.com/duotone-foilwing-slick-eng-p-12548.html?utm_source=seabreeze.com.au
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Dwight (DW) on January 04, 2021, 03:47:37 AM
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50799580672_8ed901d7b2_c.jpg)
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Dwight (DW) on January 04, 2021, 03:54:40 AM
The new Cabrinha wing

https://www.instagram.com/p/CJnAOY5jrGv/?igshid=1cvb4qocvnsp3
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 04, 2021, 09:18:53 AM
Looks like Cabrinha dropped the small second middle strut (which camber induced the canopy) but kept the handles.  Lots of options coming fast and furious.

I would guess that the batons on the Air Rush are there to help induce draft.  The curved middle strut on the Duotone Slick would do the same.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: PonoBill on January 04, 2021, 10:30:57 AM
The middle strut will also keep the lateral center of effort from shifting side to side which the V1 duotone suffered from in larger sizes.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: cnski on January 05, 2021, 07:19:30 AM
It would be a REAL TRAGEDY if Duotone doesn't fix the pygmy sized front grab handle. That this is so stupidly small. It's pretty much a no grab with winter neoprene gloves and man sized hands. And forget behind the back wing transfer tricks.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 05, 2021, 07:22:15 AM
Anyone find that there is a problem with either the Duotone Unit or Echo backwinding?  I've used a 5 metre Echo without any problems.  Not sure about the Unit (never tried it).

Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Caribsurf on January 05, 2021, 07:44:09 AM
What exactly is backwinding?  I have the Duotone Unit 6m and am very happy with it's performance in winds 13-20mph
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Dwight (DW) on January 05, 2021, 07:51:34 AM
Echo does not backwind
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: cnski on January 05, 2021, 09:44:06 AM
Unit does not backwind either.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: obxDave on January 06, 2021, 01:14:07 AM
It would be a REAL TRAGEDY if Duotone doesn't fix the pygmy sized front grab handle. That this is so stupidly small. It's pretty much a no grab with winter neoprene gloves and man sized hands. And forget behind the back wing transfer tricks.

Echo always behaves better “luffed” with one hand at the front of the boom rather than on the front handle, but I agree that the front handle is too small. Oh, and don’t worry about behind-the-back wing transfer tricks. The rank and file here will debate detailed wing construction/performance details ad nauseam without a single mention of attempting or working on behind-the-back transfers :o
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Admin on January 06, 2021, 05:10:46 AM
What exactly is backwinding?  I have the Duotone Unit 6m and am very happy with it's performance in winds 13-20mph

Windsurfers use Backwinding to mean sailing with the sail between you and the wind.  In that position you are pushing out on the sail.  There are a lot of backwinded tricks in windsurfing and a lot have now translated to the wing.  360's, Heli tacks, duck tacks, Hoss tacks, push loops, Vulcans, Spocks, and most of the new school tricks are all backwinding tricks. 

Above they are using backwinding to mean wing collapse or distortion.  This can happen when you are cranking high into the wind and at speed.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: red_tx on January 06, 2021, 06:13:57 AM
Very interesting thread. My 4.2 Sling Wing is not cutting it and I am looking for a 5.4 or 6M.
I was going to pull the trigger on a 6M Echo then............ the backwinds blew into my mind.....

Which wings backwind? I cant have any lackluster design holding me back from BACKWIND fun time manuvers!

Thanks
-red
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Caribsurf on January 06, 2021, 06:42:48 AM
What exactly is backwinding?  I have the Duotone Unit 6m and am very happy with it's performance in winds 13-20mph

Windsurfers use Backwinding to mean sailing with the sail between you and the wind.  In that position you are pushing out on the sail.  There are a lot of backwinded tricks in windsurfing and a lot have now translated to the wing.  360's, Heli tacks, duck tacks, Hoss tacks, push loops, Vulcans, Spocks, and most of the new school tricks are all backwinding tricks. 

Above they are using backwinding to mean wing collapse or distortion.  This can happen when you are cranking high into the wind and at speed.

Thanks Admin..appreciate the explanation. 
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: PonoBill on January 06, 2021, 07:41:36 AM
The new F-0ne Strike looks interesting, more an incremental improvement than jumping to a new design. It's time to retire the hobo fleet. I've ordered a quiver for Spring.

They look suitable for old man mowing and I can write endlessly on fabric bias and panel direction instead of paying attention to the all-important behind the back transfers.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on January 06, 2021, 08:41:00 AM
Backwinding -- for me, backwinding means when a wing becomes unruly in gusts, especially when heading upwind and the front area of the wing literally pushes back against the rider.  This is really disconcerting for the rider, especially if the wing has a real proclivity to backwind in normal gusty conditions -- the rider ends up constantly wrestling with the wing = no fun!

If you decide to head upwind and your wing constantly pushes and releases the whole time and in order to control the wing you have to substantially back off your angle of attack -- in my opinion it's time to look for a different wing.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: Admin on January 06, 2021, 08:55:56 AM
Yes!  Sometimes it will just give you little warning signs, kind of like, "Buddy, you are too close to the wind".   Other times it comes at you all at once and can slam you hard, just like if you had actually crossed through the eye of the wind.  That one sucks.
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on February 04, 2021, 02:16:59 PM
The kid in this video is on a Gaastra wing (I think -- GA = Gaastra?).  The wing uses two mini booms so I'm guessing that there will be a Gaastra wing released soon with mini booms opposed to six or seven handles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyv8ghZg8jI&t=12s
Title: Re: Another one for the boomers
Post by: deja vu on March 22, 2021, 04:57:47 PM
Here's the Epic wing.  The handles look more like a cross between the Ensis and Cabrinha wings rather than a "boomed" wing like the new Slick.  I suspect it has some up or down wrist twist (in other words the handles most likely will twist when you move your wrists up or down).  Both the Slick or Echo have direct input to the wing when the wrists are turned either up or down (no twist through the boom).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfbRmNoqZOk
SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2024, SimplePortal