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The Foil Zone => Foil SUP => Topic started by: gzasinets on June 20, 2020, 09:15:40 AM

Title: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: gzasinets on June 20, 2020, 09:15:40 AM
New wing from GoFoil - NL190 - looks like a HA takuma LOL - supposedly faster then gl's.
https://www.instagram.com/stories/jasonihall/2335196139010054921/
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on June 20, 2020, 10:35:42 AM
I couldn't see anything in that link - am I looking in the wrong place?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Hdip on June 20, 2020, 10:39:25 AM
Itís not public yet. either the story expired or he pulled it down. It was an unboxing video of a new wing. It has little wingtips like the takuma.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: container on June 20, 2020, 10:54:40 AM
I thought id been seeing little snippets of tiplets on a new gofoil but couldnt be sure. This wing must be it. Tips like that reduce drag by around 12% so its not surprising they are using then as well. Only negative would be the amount of paddles that end up chopped to pieces when you nick the blade while sup foiling
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: gzasinets on June 20, 2020, 01:01:19 PM
He pulled it down, I have the screen recording but can't upload mov files due to ridiculous size limits.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: container on June 20, 2020, 01:06:10 PM
Maybe you could screenshot it and post that?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: gzasinets on June 20, 2020, 01:48:58 PM
Hopefully this works https://www.dropbox.com/s/dagi7kbquxs2vl5/Video%20Jun%2020%2C%2010%2057%2055%20AM.mov?dl=0
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: container on June 20, 2020, 01:59:16 PM
Interesting, looks like the back of the tip is cut away where it intersects the T/E, which is the vortex is and consequently where you WANT the tiplet?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: supfoo on June 21, 2020, 05:51:17 PM
I like how everything is a secret at GoFoil. The web site has finally been updated but is still lacking information.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on June 21, 2020, 06:18:28 PM
In my opinion, this is silly.  Winglets DO increase lift-to-drag ratio for a given wingspan.  However, slightly increasing the wingspan with the same extra wetted area is a superior way to increase lift/drag ratio.  You see winglets on commercial jets specifically because they need to stay under a certain wingspan to fit into the gate parking spots.  And on a big jet like that a smaller wingspan is quite a bit lighter in terms of structural mass.  We don't have those problems.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wingtip_device
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: exiled on June 21, 2020, 06:52:14 PM
We do have wing tips breaching on turns though, which seems to be the major downside to long wingspans on foils.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: container on June 21, 2020, 08:44:07 PM
Make it anhedral? Shit weve arrived back at a kai gofoil.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on June 21, 2020, 11:26:08 PM
We do have wing tips breaching on turns though, which seems to be the major downside to long wingspans on foils.

If you're banked at less than 45deg then the vertical winglet will pierce the surface before the same length of additional wingspan - so that's not a good reason for winglets either.

But hey, I haven't ridden it, so what do I know!?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: judoChop! on July 15, 2020, 10:52:34 AM
any news on these? what does NL stand for?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: SanoSlatchSup on July 15, 2020, 12:13:40 PM
any news on these? what does NL stand for?
I think "No Looky".... ;D
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: 805StandUp on July 15, 2020, 02:34:38 PM
Lol... I heard it referred to as Next Level in one of the videos...
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on August 06, 2020, 02:33:12 PM
starting to see more and more instagram mentions of the NL - surely someone on the board has ridden it...
paging Steamroller
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Hdip on August 06, 2020, 04:04:01 PM
Not sure if Iím supposed to say but I saw one hit a rock the other day.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: SanoSlatchSup on August 07, 2020, 09:02:42 AM
Not sure if Iím supposed to say but I saw one hit a rock the other day.
Ah, wondered wth that was...
(https://media.tenor.com/images/36d13b2324e1e1196ea5509035a6e59a/tenor.gif)
Hope everyone's OK. :)
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 10, 2020, 12:03:15 AM
i got all 3...BUT  they're so much fun i started loaning um out the first week i got um...they're so much funni had to spread the word...went kitesurfing the past 4 days...goi g todo a video real soon...but in a nutshell the NL190 is THE wing for  SUPfoil...
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: PonoBill on August 10, 2020, 07:52:56 AM
The Maui foilers have been glueing on tiplets for a couple of years. I tried it, didn't see much difference. If I were going to get serious about tiplets I'd point them down and use them for any wing that i didn't want to have be too long. I kicked my 1150 last night, which really pissed me off. I might put some tiplets on my 1010 for just that reason. The 1150 glides forever, but it's a lot of wing. I can see it when I look down.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on August 11, 2020, 04:24:26 PM
In terms of rider/wave size - is the NL190 most similar to the GL180 and the NL220 most similar to the GL210?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 11, 2020, 08:37:18 PM
yes!...
but both are waaaay faster and both pump way better...im 240lbs and all ill ever need again is the NL190 from .5 foot to a couple feet overhead waves...i just got the other sizes because i wanted to try um out...if i do ride waves double overhead you just take the spacing washer out of the tail pedestal so the tail gives just a little less downforce...and youre set!...

the thing is they dont fly on their own like the Maliko200/IWA or the GLs...until you engage the foil with a little kick of you back foot...thats perfect because on a big wave you want to keep the nose down until you're ready to make your bottom turn...but once you do...its Warp Factor9!...Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! ;D
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 11, 2020, 09:07:20 PM
https://youtu.be/j-Cn3It65eU


does anyone know where that video of the front wing breaching the wingtip and undergoing total span ventilation?...there the whole wing stalls?...i though it was youtube bu i cant find it thought i saw it here posted..i want to use that....solution....winglets with the cutout!
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: bigmtn on August 12, 2020, 12:59:49 AM
This one?
http://www.instagram.com/p/BzEySSgnvfi/?igshid=1d5u4dene2fcz

https://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,34980.0.html
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 12, 2020, 01:42:46 AM
thats it!...aewsome you're the BEST..i would've spent years searxhing for it on YouTube and never found it... ;)
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on August 12, 2020, 08:51:24 AM
how the heck did anyone catch that so perfectly on video!  would be amazing to see the same on the NL wing if that's what you're going to try and capture Steamroller
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 12, 2020, 08:14:02 PM
when the wingtip breaches the surface of the water flow separation occurrs and the wing undergoes ventilation which propagates all the way across the span causing the wimg to stall ...lose all lift and the whole shebang comes crashing down...

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.....stall horn for the pilots  here... ::)

the NL wings with the wingtips and the cutouts of the trailing edge are designed put the flow back together...get it laminar again...end the stall and keep you flying...they work too!...im just having a hell of a time getting video of this and explaining it  simply...pics  and video is always much better

Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Beasho on August 13, 2020, 10:37:48 AM
when the wingtip breaches the surface of the water flow separation occurrs and the wing undergoes ventilation which propagates all the way across the span causing the wimg to stall ...lose all lift and the whole shebang comes crashing down...

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.....stall horn for the pilots  here... ::)

the NL wings with the wingtips and the cutouts of the trailing edge are designed put the flow back together...get it laminar again...end the stall and keep you flying...they work too!...im just having a hell of a time getting video of this and explaining it  simply...pics  and video is always much better

This is cool.  Really Cool!  IF not fake news I will have to buy another Foil!

AHHHHHHHHHH!  I think you are recommending the NL190.   I had been holding out but thinking the GL180 would round out my GL210 and GL140 gap.  BUT now I have a new Filler.

PS: I have ridden the GL210 in 15+ foot waves so I think the NL190 should 1) hold down even better  2) Go Faster  3) Be MOW better

Keep the feedback coming.  The other GoFoil 'select' people are all hush-hush for some crazy reason.  Where is DailyBread on all these topics? 
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: red_tx on August 13, 2020, 11:12:17 AM
Awesome discussion about breaching and the wing tips. Thanks all for your contributions. The breach video is telling.
I cant wait to "KIK" the NL190  :)
-red
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: PonoBill on August 13, 2020, 01:53:20 PM
when the wingtip breaches the surface of the water flow separation occurrs and the wing undergoes ventilation which propagates all the way across the span causing the wimg to stall ...lose all lift and the whole shebang comes crashing down...

It's not really flow separation, that refers to an angle of attack steep enough so the flow doesn't follow the contour of the wing. If you break the surface with a wingtip the low-pressure side of the wing (in this case the top) is sucking like a vacuum cleaner. I covers the wing with a sheet of air drawn from the surface that kills lift. The phenomenon is similar, but flow separation deals with a single medium. In this case, the lift is killed by an intersection of two media--air and water.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 14, 2020, 01:18:54 AM
Yes....correct ....absolutely ....jeez it's a good thing you said that Otherwise when I put out these videosim  working on I'm gonna get all kinds of flaming... In fact I might post all my transcripts here before I post videos just to make sure not screwing something up again... I'm going off of 25 year old knowledge of engineering and NOTeven a mechanical guy on the first place...

Beasho... You are primarily big wave riding guy...high advanced level ...the GL180  would work great but ...wait for the NL190 instead...its like a whole new thing
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 17, 2020, 01:36:20 PM
you guys want to see just a little bit of what kind of speed these new NL Wings are capable of?....this is a far away crappy shot with the surfline cam from across the street and waaaay down the beach but even from way out that pumpout speed is ....bitchen!

NL220 wing!...

https://youtu.be/CTysXYbwTA0
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: container on August 17, 2020, 01:44:02 PM
That looks pretty standard for a (true) high aspect wing, its fast but i think the main point is just how slow everything else is! Really everything we have been riding thats thicker than 12% and has an AR of less than 5 is a fkn dog.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: surfcowboy on August 17, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
Steamroller that kick at the end of the drop is what Iím hoping to get from a smaller wing. At that spot itís mushy but not in a long roller kind of way so that later takeoff is still too much for me. Glad to see you giving a clinic on how itís done.

I saw some of that footage from the pump out video and couldnít believe the speed. That pump is faster than most waves Iíve surfed.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: SanoSlatchSup on August 18, 2020, 09:10:14 AM
Dang steam, look at you go...you're killing out there on that wing!! Cool thing to also see...is you've got it turning as well as any of the other "surfy" (not "glidy") wings out there. Well done sir, well done!
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Beasho on August 18, 2020, 07:17:14 PM
you guys want to see just a little bit of what kind of speed these new NL Wings are capable of?....this is a far away crappy shot with the surfline cam from across the street and waaaay down the beach but even from way out that pumpout speed is ....bitchen!
NL220 wing!...

I have to agree that this wing looks visually FAST!!!!!  When I got my GL210 I was flying around my local spot and a fellow SUP'r Marty who has surfed a long time and knows his stuff said "What do you have a motor on that thing?"  I thought he was joking.  Then I asked whether he was serious and he said 'Yes man your going way faster than anyone else.'  That was the GL series which Steamroller is very familiar with.

You also have to give it to Steamroller.  He is the only BIG guy that has video evidence of flying around like a featherweight pumper. Well Done!!!!!  You inspire me to push longer than I otherwise would to hunt down the outer swell line. 
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 20, 2020, 01:34:33 AM
THIS  is why we foilsurf...33 guys out...1 guy surfing all the rest sitting...1 footers on the inside are the BEST!...crappy surfline cam though sorry

https://youtu.be/lHXA4d9Ymm8

Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 20, 2020, 01:01:58 PM
it s unfortunate that the resolution is sobad because this is ahead high wave and im dropping on way late  after the lip has begun to pitch...but because these things stay on the water until you're ready to fly i was able to stay in control andthen hit the gas!


https://youtu.be/IPqZJ7fArHU
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 20, 2020, 01:04:13 PM


https://youtu.be/IPqZJ7fArHU
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on August 20, 2020, 02:56:46 PM
man, I bet 90% of those guys out there absolutely hate you right now.  How could you not look at that and not be jealous?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 20, 2020, 10:01:04 PM
Ha!...im on a SUP and. foil in southern California.!..double hate....the whinest bitchiest most crybaby place on earth...they hate everything here ;D...and never happy unless they're complaining
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Beasho on August 21, 2020, 06:28:39 AM
this is a head high wave and i'm dropping on way late  after the lip has begun to pitch...but because these things stay on the water until you're ready to fly i was able to stay in control and then hit the gas!
This is going to be great in bigger waves.  The key is to STAY DOWN and do NOT FLY until you get out of harms way.  Bigger boards with long noses help to 1) Get in earlier and 2) Keep the whole rig from pitching

Your pumping continues to impress.  I am going to have to go for a run to stay in shape right now. 
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 21, 2020, 05:57:45 PM
you guy's wanna see some SPEED?...

https://youtu.be/fb6ImYCVoRs
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: supfoo on August 21, 2020, 06:44:00 PM
Great video Steamroller! How much do you weigh & what is the volume of your board? Many Thanks!
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Dwight (DW) on August 22, 2020, 04:46:10 AM
Your cardio is next level doing that with a mouth cam  ;D
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 23, 2020, 02:39:11 AM
im 5'8" 238 lbs cause i been on a diet ;D....the board is 110L I think...5'6"◊29"◊thick

got some more NL stuff coming soon...
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: opie on August 23, 2020, 09:53:40 AM
Which pedestal/stabilizer combo do you prefer with the NL 220 wing?  Thanks
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 23, 2020, 05:37:32 PM
i use the 6.5 pedestal with the bigger stabilizer with the flipped up wingtips...dont know what size it is but it works really well for a big guy....very fast. very maneuverable  and pumps great.

..its the one with the stabilizer mouted on the underside of the fuselage...use it with one washer under the stabilizer in the front screw...havent tried it without the washer because havent been out in anything bigger than 1 foot overhead yet...maybe this winter
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 23, 2020, 05:42:24 PM
a
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 24, 2020, 02:07:33 AM
part of the GoFoil NLWing video...thoughts?...i feel like something is wrong...

PonoBill and Beasho...i need you guys...

if i sound like a total dumbass...please let.me know...and i won't include it...thanks


https://youtu.be/XRzxQgDmJoI

Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Beasho on August 24, 2020, 06:27:14 AM
Fragging Great!

The only slight piece of feedback is that the leading edge can not be a total knife edge.  It has to be bulbous to induce efficient "circulation." A very specific term.  As the angle of attack changes the flow must wrap around the leading edge without separating.  The only time a knife'y'er edge makes (more) sense is with supersonic wings. 

The beauty of all this is that the best results have been empirical.  Because of the weight we are applying, the density of the water, and the significant changes of speed, turning radius, pumping and lack of control surfaces some kid is going to come along on prototype 1,658 and say "Man this really works."

PS: I remember learning that a 747 has 150 lbs per square foot of wing loading.  Every person on the plane flying on a handkerchief sized magic carpet.  Here we are doing the same thing (144 sq Inches / 150 lbs) but on water now. 
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: jondrums on August 24, 2020, 05:34:52 PM
Sort of reinforces my suspicion that the main improvement here is the foil section and not necessarily the winglets...
Steamroller are you working on the design of these?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Beasho on August 24, 2020, 07:05:41 PM
Sort of reinforces my suspicion that the main improvement here is the foil section and not necessarily the winglets...
Steamroller are you working on the design of these?

Not to pile on the Winglet/No-Winglet battle but JonDrums makes a point.  All the SWEET technical talk and very little about the winglets  :o 
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 24, 2020, 11:53:17 PM
more on the winglets in the making...the wing was changed...yes... but the winglets were needed for.lift efficiency at slower.speeds AND to stop ventilation propogating all the way. across the span like in that video..

.with them you can spin the tips out of the water...drop them back in and recover your ride...couldn't do that before ...in thenpast if you pierce the surface...catastrophic stall and you're done ..

.also flying through Whitewater and kicking out of a wave and over and through Whitewater to continue pumping is a reality...

the imgur app on mynphone...android...doesnt have a choice for a hosted pic with the *.jpg extension....how are you guys able to post pics?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 24, 2020, 11:59:25 PM
like beasho said this RnD is mostly empirical...you cant solve these equations analytically...they have to be done numerically with software...i get really nervous thinking about the math involved

but im a real good test.pilot for all the prototypes ...and a "very excellent driver"... ;D
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Dwight (DW) on August 25, 2020, 04:47:11 AM
Without winglet.

Watch his tip flirt with the surface.

He has winglets now. Look for video soon.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEStV4VAO6u/?igshid=1kxxkkjd6jje3
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: steamroller on August 25, 2020, 07:18:32 AM
holy crap thats a PERFECT illustration....THANKS!...im using it!!!!...i havent seen that one before
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Hdip on August 25, 2020, 07:25:14 AM
If you need anymore before clips I have millions of them. Iím the king at poking a wingtip and breaching.
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: peterp on August 25, 2020, 07:53:47 AM
Looks more like Mr Before Clip needs a longer mast...
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: SanoSlatchSup on August 25, 2020, 10:21:50 AM
Eh, never mind...waste of bandwidth.  :-X :)
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: Hdip on August 25, 2020, 10:25:17 AM
https://www.instagram.com/p/CEFpSoYjXpf/

Maybe the wingtip pokes first so you know it's poked out and that inch saves you from putting the actual wing out of the water?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: J.Riggs on September 03, 2020, 02:04:59 PM
We've had great downwind conditions on Maui lately. I tried the NL 190 for the first time last weekend. I'd been using the GL 180 for the last year. The new wing is definitely faster and more efficient. It glides over bumps with a lot less effort and turns easily. Getting lifted felt very similar to the GL180. I got a few clips during the last run and handed the my paddle off with the Go Pro attached to Dave as he flew by and he got some nice steady footage too.  Dave and I are both riding the NL190. Kathy is riding an Axis 900 and Shep is on the Signature 210 in this video.

https://youtu.be/iVVTAVuE1r8
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: exiled on September 03, 2020, 02:18:42 PM
How did you rig up your paddle to sling across your back like that?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: DavidJohn on September 03, 2020, 02:50:35 PM
Thanks JR.. Awesome 😎
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: J.Riggs on September 03, 2020, 03:30:36 PM
How did you rig up your paddle to sling across your back like that?
That's Dave Kalama and he has an adjustable paddle. Once he's lifted he shortens the shaft and puts it over his shoulder. The strap is bicycle inner tube. It's permanently tied on and doesn't seem to get in the way while he's paddling.   
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: gulljammer on September 04, 2020, 06:29:14 AM
We've had great downwind conditions on Maui lately. I tried the NL 190 for the first time last weekend. I'd been using the GL 180 for the last year. The new wing is definitely faster and more efficient. It glides over bumps with a lot less effort and turns easily. Getting lifted felt very similar to the GL180. I got a few clips during the last run and handed the my paddle off with the Go Pro attached to Dave as he flew by and he got some nice steady footage too.  Dave and I are both riding the NL190. Kathy is riding an Axis 900 and Shep is on the Signature 210 in this video.

https://youtu.be/iVVTAVuE1r8


Smooth! What rear stabilizers are being used?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: 805StandUp on September 04, 2020, 02:56:10 PM
We've had great downwind conditions on Maui lately. I tried the NL 190 for the first time last weekend. I'd been using the GL 180 for the last year. The new wing is definitely faster and more efficient. It glides over bumps with a lot less effort and turns easily. Getting lifted felt very similar to the GL180. I got a few clips during the last run and handed the my paddle off with the Go Pro attached to Dave as he flew by and he got some nice steady footage too.  Dave and I are both riding the NL190. Kathy is riding an Axis 900 and Shep is on the Signature 210 in this video.


Great video!  Thanks for sharing, Jeremy!
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: frenchfoiler on September 06, 2020, 03:36:49 AM
How did you rig up your paddle to sling across your back like that?

So you did the run on a prone without a paddle ?
Title: Re: GoFoil NL 190
Post by: J.Riggs on September 09, 2020, 11:23:44 AM
How did you rig up your paddle to sling across your back like that?

So you did the run on a prone without a paddle ?
My board is a prone board but I can stand on it and paddle to get going. I handed my paddle to Dave during the run to get extra footage. Dave uses the paddle to get lifted and then puts it over his shoulder. On really good days Dave will take his prone board and no paddle.
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