Standup Zone Forum
The Foil Zone => Foil SUP => Topic started by: surfcowboy on February 11, 2020, 08:34:26 PM
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In what is my weirdest build yet, I’m customizing a bump cap for foiling head protection.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RXVVTL1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
It’s a plastic shell that fits into a baseball cap and provides just enough protection to keep you from getting stitches (maybe.)
I’ve sprayed mine black, out it under a trucker cap for water use and am putting some 1/8” EVA inside it. (Hobby Lobby or any craft store sells this for a buck a sheet.
I’ll post up pics and results as I get it done. But it looks like you’re just wearing a cap. I’ll probably try to get a strap or at least a lanyard on it to keep it in place a bit but I dig it so far and even without it’s worth wearing I think.
Will it protect you from a cracked skull? Does it cover all your head? Is it approved by any agency? No.
But it’s surprisingly effective and will certainly be an unobtrusive improvement over my bare skin. Check it out, if you do nothing but put it in your cap it’ll stop stitches or a fin cut. If you pad it at all you’ll be pleasantly surprised and it could keep you conscious from a hit.
I’m trying Super 77 spray glue first to hold the EVA. Maybe also could source some EVA with that sweet 3M adhesive?
I’ll keep you posted on mods and how it works. I think I might even wear this surfing if I can make it reliable in the water.
I’ll also try to share my padding templates.
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That looks interesting, Cowboy. I have my old skate helmet and found a face-guard baseball players use that I thought of modding to use with the helmet. The problem is: you (I) don't want to look like a total dork. ...afraid of your stubbing your toe.
Foiling does not look as dangerous as riding a Harley w/o a helmet in LA traffic .. but how to balance the obvious risks without looking like a Hermit crab is the issue.
Jim
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https://www.park-and-diamond.com/ (https://www.park-and-diamond.com/)
Might be of interest...
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nice DIY but I rather be safe and worry about other people think like your kook. I wear a full head protection such as gath helmet in the beginning of foiling stage and I still do during winter to keep my head warm. From my experience and if I didn't wear the full head helmet my ears and the side of my face would've been in a lot of mess.
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Hey guys, I’ve seen that link and yes, the kook factor is necessary.
Full explanation, I’m actually going way overboard on my early sessions and wearing a moto-x full face helmet behind the boat as it looks like tacos are common then.
I plan to move down to a skate type helmet, and then, only then, to the bump cap. (Probably 10 sessions or so in or later if I’m not feeling it.) I don’t think I’d use a gath but maybe I should try one on.
I think this also might accompany me on standard prone sessions as well. Fins can be worse than foils in some cases.
But now we’re really getting somewhere. The great helmet/no helmet thread of 2020. Could this rival straps vs no straps? Short SUPs vs Long? Wax vs traction? Proners giving us grief in the lineup? Will this be responsible for bannings and half the board leaving over a resentment? Only time will tell. So far you guys are too nice. Someone show up please and call me an idiot and claim that helmets emit radiation. 😂🤣
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I've never hit my head with the foil. I did hit my chin on my rail on about session 5 or so. Hit my head on a normal surfboard a bunch of times though so maybe it's just me.
Your mast is about 2 feet long. Give yourself 2 feet of clearance. Jump early and jump often. Don't try to save things. You're just learning what the foil wants to do on the early sessions.
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Thx Hdip,
Hopefully when I’m back from SD we can connect and get some mushy waves. I also like that you take multiple boards and prone or foil depending on what you see. I carry fins even.
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I had a proner buddy tell me that if a foiler shows up with a helmet and an impact vest, he should bring one for everyone else in the lineup.
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per, HD. "Jump early and jump often. Don't try to save things. You're just learning what the foil wants to do on the early sessions."
Probably rather than dressing for a medieval joust - spend time developing muscle memory for the above. Good one.
Jim
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My buddy on Kauai got his best advice from Seabass. "Go where the foil wants to go."
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I understand once your foiling time is up most of us put safety aside but from experience foiling is still dangerous. I've had times were what if I landed there or here and I can tell you (example) sometimes 5 inches landed away is close call. Yes, we all mastered the eject button but you still make mistakes and hopefully on a good side of mistake and not on a bad side of mistake.
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This is gold. Thx guys.
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I ride all types of foil sport and I can't stress the importance of a helmet. One with ear protection is even better. I had a buddy blow an ear drum out while falling from a wave and I've been cut by foils a bunch even in the face. Now it's helmet with ear protection and I wear a hat under it to add extra protection with the visor. It's bad enough getting hit with a 18 liter kite foil board, you're going to be lucky to survive a sup.
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This is what I use and obviously could give a $hit what others think. My safety is my responsibility no one else's. I believe these are some of the best options out there for water-based sports where you want some protection from the sun also. If you're looking for ear protection too they have helmets for that as well.
https://www.shredready.com/collections/all-helmets/sup (https://www.shredready.com/collections/all-helmets/sup)
My opinion is if you're involved in a water sport where you can get knocked out you had better be wearing at least a pfd or a helmet. Maybe it looks a little funny or takes another few seconds to prepare but the consequences are and never worth the tradeoff. Helmets were considered kooky for skiers and snowboarders 15 years ago and now they're considered a smart choice... 8)
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Cowboy, Thanks for that. I got a pair (?) of these caps. ' Very interesting. I just happen to have some Ensolite foam they use at the inside/top so can expand the cushion a bit without losing the form-fit. ' Very interesting ..compared to a Gath, skate helmet, etc. It should be easy to make a chinstrap. I got some other commercial c'hit I am working on, but will post some pics. Thanks again.
Jim
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well, i hate to tell ya'll this but it isn't the helmet that makes for dorkfactorsupremo but the chin strap. say it ain't so. i can't. tis. sigh.
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We have those guys here, Linter. A board leash would cramp their 'style'. ...and since there is no rule: 'FU ..and your rugrats'. Most are likely pretty unproductive elsewhere.
Jim
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Linter, you’re right but interestingly Hawaiian foilers are pretty fond of the fcs and dakine surf cap with strap. They alone might make it more common like happened with snow sports. We will see. Also, the recent injuries of some big pros who are wearing helmets now during recovery might also start to sway things. Some folks won’t ever do it but on a big day on any craft, it should be the norm I’d think. Molly would have laughed at a vest in the ‘60’s and yet today he knows they are the right idea.
But either way, we’re evolving and the incidence of injuries seems (like SUP) lower than we all feared when surfers were freaking out about cutting kids in half. lol (I also love how surfers are worried about “the groms.” I’m betting by grom, they mean “me, but I can’t admit I’m scared.”
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also, the factor of danger will increase when more foilers around you and even worse when their inexperience at close proximity and one mistake can lead to :o ::) :-X
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Cowboy, I switched-up materials. I decided 'make it tighter' had to accompany non-slip. I have a variety of neoprene cloth and this 2mm with a fine pattern on the raw side seems to suit the gig best. I used 2-sided Eternabond tape rather than contact cement, but, even though it works perfectly on the plastic surface, it does not grip the Lycra side well. I will add six small tube rivets.
BUT - it fits great. And even though it may look like I had a brain tumor removed the day before - there will be No Chin Strap! Cheers.
Jim
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Nice man. Put a cap over it and it’ll lessen the hospital look. Also you can crank it down with the cap’s size adjustment.
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Here’s my version.
3M 77 adhesive (mask it off!!) and EVA inside an old trucker cap. Black spray paint. I didn’t want to leave my forehead bare so that’s 1/8” EVA with a layer of 4oz glass and epoxy over it. That stuff is incredibly flexible. It’s a bit short. I’ll cut a longer one the next time I glass something if this doesn’t disintegrate the first time out.
It passes my nightstick test. Might have to wear it to my next protest.
No, it’s not a gath. But yes, I’ll have better protection than 90% of the people in the water. Probably add a lanyard for when s$&t gets real. I’ll start with full face, probably move to a skate helmet for a bit and then down to this.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/145b8d43c0e38d98090c71dd539ddb2b.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/03a9f9bd805cb8a05443a57ec4b6cdc5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/5cb7347445ecbedd7f8edc6f0603c0dc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/8155ced8b0311102016c7df05868695c.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/111baafd08965a12fcfd2bce1a28ed4c.jpg)
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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After this I'm considering glassing over a neoprene beanie and then putting another one over it to cover the glass layer.
That will cover ears and back of skull. I'll keep you posted.
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I can't picture that bump cap staying on after a wave takes you out. I might be wrong but, I've felt my helmet try to lift off my head several times after crashes and waves coming from behind after a crash.
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It will not, most likely. As I said, I’ll fix a lanyard for when I’m foiling. (I do think it’ll be great for learning to dock start however.
That said, I do surf in a cap like this about half the time, in mellow waves, with no strap and I’ve lost 2 in 10 years. (Mostly in big surf.) those FCS surf hats are really for real waves. A backwards baseball cap stays on through a good duck dive.
This is v1. Failure is guaranteed. That’s how you learn. I figure if 6 of us make these one will be decent lol. Also, not meant to replace a real helmet.
But 100% I’m wearing one of these working in the garage or on my car from now on.
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It will not, most likely. As I said, I’ll fix a lanyard for when I’m foiling. (I do think it’ll be great for learning to dock start however.
But 100% I’m wearing one of these working in the garage or on my car from now on.
Yes, I think you've got something there for dock starts or in the garage, but for protection foiling in the surf....eh, not so much.
Unfortunately, the foil accident stitches I've seen in our locale are on the face, and not the head...and the only time I had a foil come at me, was when I went over the handlebars, ejecting my standard ball cap as I hit the water, and then caught the front wing with my hand I had put up in front of my face on the way up to the surface. Now notably, the foil was coming at me so slowly when it hit my hand that I doubt is would have been more than just a slight bonk on the forehead coconut, but no real damage would have been done.
My point being, the sudden impact injuries where the real damage seems to be happening, are the quick, unexpected falls into the rails of the board face first, or even worse...the "taco" event of going over the side of the board as the sharp wings of the foil are coming up out of the water after you. In either event, I don't think a helmet on the head is going to be of much protection, but that's just my experience and opinion....other's mileage may vary.
Good luck, and be safe regardless of whatever head (and body...lot more ribs getting injured I'm seeing) protection direction you end up taking.
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I do agree that any responsible thread on this subject stress that we recommend full, real helmets, with face guards.
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That's the 'cover all bets dillema', eh, 3S? I'll post a picture of my first idea. I guarantee it would generate as much ridicule as those 'two outrigger floats either side of a SUP' would. If I could start foiling privately, I would likely have shin and thigh guards, a welders mask, shoulder pads and a chest protector. I taught myself to kite in about 2001 ..with dangerous kit. I figure if I can take that thrashing; I should be able to handle this one ..with better kit and some training.
Hopefully, this printing will quash the inevitable; "What are the rivets for?" questions."
Jim
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I paddled in my cap. It works and I used my lanyard.
Trying it without the lanyard next time with a little grabby bare neoprene added into the band.
I see no reason to foil without this thing.
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Honestly the first month I learned foiling, I think shin guards were the most needed protection. I can't believe how many times I bashed my shin(s) on the rail. I think I remember a few charlie-horses to the quad too. I've yet to have anything even close to a head injury, thank goodness.
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I will say, the Zone helped me there. I was hyper aware of my shins and feet when getting back on the board. I’m far from out of the woods but seriously, thanks to all of you who posted your pain. Learning in 2020 is way better than 2018.
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does wearing a full wetsuit help?
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Yes, most folks complain about bumping shins and such getting back on the foil or walking in/out. Even a little neoprene helps the bumps.
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I was trolling Amazon and found this. Anyone try one? https://www.amazon.com/Hella-Slingshots-Black-Removable-Plastic/dp/B07KXKFYR3?ref_=ast_sto_dp (https://www.amazon.com/Hella-Slingshots-Black-Removable-Plastic/dp/B07KXKFYR3?ref_=ast_sto_dp)
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Dude, they made my hat. Buy one now at that price.
The only thing I have over them is that mine has a single 4oz layer of glass and EVA to keep my forehead covered since I wear it backwards.
btw, I wore mine the other day and figured out that when I grab my hat when bailing it puts my hands and arms in front of my face. So this encourages me to duck and cover with my free hand.
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I was trolling Amazon and found this. Anyone try one? https://www.amazon.com/Hella-Slingshots-Black-Removable-Plastic/dp/B07KXKFYR3?ref_=ast_sto_dp (https://www.amazon.com/Hella-Slingshots-Black-Removable-Plastic/dp/B07KXKFYR3?ref_=ast_sto_dp)
Same issues as most of the bump caps. The back is open and that’s where the foil is likely to hit you.
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I have no clue what brand, but I have seen really good kite/wing foilers wearing a soft helmet that looks like this:
https://www.amazon.com/GAMEBREAKER-Multi-Sport-Shell-Protective-Headgear/dp/B07BJXVTCQ/
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Dwight, that’s why I wear mine backwards. The bill will take a bit and there’s a lot more coverage.
If you look at my design there’s a flap that fills the hole above the adjustment strap which becomes the front.
But yeah, without a whole lower back section like the heavier duty helmets have for the base of your skull I’m sure it’s way less protection.
But I will say that a kid at the beach the other day got a cut up top from a fin or board in a place that would have been covered by any hat or bump cap, so there’s that which means nothing lol.
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Clay, I saw one many years ago in Cabarete - I am pretty sure I have also seen rugby players use them. They get roughed up a bit.
Jim
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I learned to foil with an original aluminum skyfoil (designed by Rush Randle), with a kite. At the time, guys were just learning to foil with a kite. Most of the bad injuries were to the face. I call my aluminum hydrofoil "the machete". I don't use it in the surf. During the learning curve, the foil hit me often on the shins and feet. I wore a 4/3 fullsuit, which helped the shins a bit (shin guards are a great idea). And I wore wakeskate shoes to protect my feet. A proper impact vest was invaluable. I destroyed a life jacket while learning. I always wear a gath helmet (surfing/kitesurfing). Awkward wipeouts scared me. I wanted something will full face proctection. A fellow foiler sported a nice full face helmet (purchased after a face injury). I believe it was the (which looked cool):
https://www.outdoorplay.com/WRSI-Moment-Full-Face-Helmet
I started shopping around locally for a cheap option. Scored a lacrosse helmet at goodwill and it has served me well.
There is enough social distancing in kitesurfing that fashion is never too kooky. A local windsurfer wears a helmet retrofitted with the single bar you'd see on a football kicker's helmet that covers the chin, respect.
Great topic. Hydrofoiling is rad. Tony Hawk was an endorsement for body protection.
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Refreshing this thread. Update, bump cap works and I don’t wear the strap. I have to grab it when wiping out sometimes but it’s not a hassle really. I have the strap when I want to be secure (heavier conditions.)
I remade the front part in a more functional but less attractive version. I’m going to get some sort of sphere and glass the EVA molded to my head and replace that filler piece the next time I glass something. (My next Wing board?!)
I’ve not gotten hit yet but I will report that my impact vest saved me a bump to the back this weekend in a fall.
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Oh, I did end up buying that hat I found on Amazon. Its well stitched and the shell is worth the price alone. The strap does dig at my neck a little which is uncomfortable so I only wear it when it's big out. I might just take the shell out and put it on a regular cap.
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A friend here has one of those I think. I really need to improve this back cover attachment. It seems these are taking off. 3 or 4 of my local crew are wearing them now.