Standup Zone Forum

The Foil Zone => Wingsurfing, Windfoiling, Wingfoiling, Wing SUP => Topic started by: SUPeter on November 11, 2019, 06:05:18 AM

Title: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 11, 2019, 06:05:18 AM
Just curious.  Anyone else out there trying?  I made one, which at 3.6 M is too small for the types of wind we get in Maine.  Currently making a 5M .  It is not easy!  Maybe I do it just to grow some neurons. Being such a new sport, I can see there being so many improvements to current gear in the not too distant future. 
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 11, 2019, 10:37:48 AM
First one.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: Wetstuff on November 11, 2019, 11:02:43 AM
Cool, good for you.  Brain-to-hands... Interesting rib system.

Jim
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: PonoBill on November 11, 2019, 11:25:00 AM
Wow. So very cool. I love people who don't know what they can't do. The boom to wing rib is exactly what I want to do to my Duotone 5M. I guess I'll have to get sewing.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: JEG on November 11, 2019, 12:14:38 PM
good fo you SUPeter, keep us updated.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: blackeye on November 11, 2019, 12:30:49 PM
I am intrigued that these wings have a low pressure laminar surface, but a big gaping nothing for to attach flow on the high pressure side. Now that SUPeter has shown that these things can be homebuilt, can someone attach a skin to the high pressure side?

I was watching a paraglider static test his new rig. It didn't have an inflatable leading edge, but it did have mesh vents on the high pressure side that kept the two sides apart. I would think that could be done with these wings. Would the efficiency increase enough to justify more complexity, cost and weight?
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 11, 2019, 02:03:17 PM
Hi Blackeye.  I have been wondering the same thing.  To cover the underside of the wing with a very light easily draining material that would offer a better wing shape overall.  It'll get done by someone who is familiar with these materials.  There are also so many other adjustable parameters such as boom to leading edge angle adjustments and boom length to alter sail shape.  How about reefable sails for differing conditions.  Its all possible with the correct engineering.  Just have to keep it lightweight.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: blackeye on November 15, 2019, 07:34:39 AM
Just have to keep it lightweight.

Maybe efficiency gains would mean you will get the same lift in a smaller wing. That said, it has dawned on me that a foil's high pressure side seems to take care of itself. It just isn't that important to manage compared to attached low pressure flow. (Collective "Well, duh" from the gallery?) So gains from a second skin might not be worthwhile.

My little epiphany is a bit highjacky. Back to business: Your wing is awesome, and I commend the depth of thought you have put into it.

Note: Edited for increased clarity.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 15, 2019, 07:43:13 AM
Yes, I agree.  Hence the reason for the pre-shaped carbon battens.  When making the canopy, I needed a method to lock in that oh so important wing shape.  Not yet sure if I will be using some, none or all of those battens when finished. 
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: Admin on November 16, 2019, 02:34:38 AM
What a cool project.  Amazing skills!  One consideration might be the area distribution of the wings.  Wing designs that devote a lot of area to the wingtips tend to be tougher to control.  We have a unique element in wingsurfing in that we are loosely connected at the middle of the wing only and the rest of the wing exerts force on that connection.  Leading edge thickness tapers at the wing tips  as does the depth of the foil shape  but if a lot of area is devoted there it tends to distort and fight for control of the wing. 
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 19, 2019, 08:31:58 AM
Yes, I agree.  In my mind I was hoping to keep more of the lift energy towards the center line of the wing.  I just figured keeping as  narrow as I dared and as long as I dared would improve the handling characteristics.  Maintaining overall wing shape is also a consideration which I have addressed using some pre-shaped, lightweight carbon battens.  Won't be long before I know, one way or the other.  Ill try to post two pics.  One alone and the other with a 4M Naish wing for comparison.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 19, 2019, 08:32:37 AM
With 4 M Naish wing
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 19, 2019, 08:33:46 AM
I will be cutting down the wing length considerably to approximate 5M.  Full length is now about 6M.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 19, 2019, 08:35:34 AM
One more pic.  I also feel that the larger the leading edge diameter , the better.  This keeps air attached to the low pressure side through a wider range in Angle of attack, before stalling occurs.  My leading edge tube is 12" diameter.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on November 19, 2019, 08:40:35 AM
pic
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on December 19, 2019, 07:40:18 AM
5 meter wing finished.  Flies great! Easy to control. Its winter here so I will probably be getting out on ice and snow covered lakes.  Unless some warm front allows me the opportunity to foil.  Boom mount is rock solid and adjusts for both pitch and length.    I flipped the blade over, much better.  Ill hopefully send a few pics but its always a crap shoot.  The battens are perfect. Really helps to maintain that perfect wing shape in all winds.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on December 19, 2019, 07:40:51 AM
Another pic
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on December 19, 2019, 07:41:32 AM
another
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on December 19, 2019, 07:42:04 AM
another
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: SUPeter on December 19, 2019, 07:42:36 AM
another
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: Dwight (DW) on December 19, 2019, 08:30:16 AM
Very nice  ;D
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: PonoBill on December 19, 2019, 10:25:54 AM
Love the paddle boom. I tried to convince Ken Winner that would be a good idea but I don't think he bought my argument. Ken is in spectacular shape and could easily prone paddle in from a mile or so out. I'm fat and old--that would take me a week without a paddle.

I've built a few carbon booms for Duotones, and they provide a welcome weight loss. Your attachment looks a lot like the duotone's as I'm sure you know, but it looks easily adjustable.

Battens may not solve all the problems of a large wing. I think there may be value in the baffle that floats the canopy above the strut in the F-one wing. Not only maintains the shape better than a long batten would, but it may also contribute to stability by reducing airflow transversely. With all the tipping that happens with these wings and the resultant change in airflow and pressure under the wing it seems likely that there's an uncontrolled spill of air from the less effective wingtip to the lower pressure, more effective one.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: blackeye on December 22, 2019, 09:43:39 AM
I like the patterns from the repurposed sailcloth. Reminds me of Brian Jungen's sculptures using plastic chairs and Nikes.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: surfcowboy on December 23, 2019, 03:50:33 PM
Man, this is great. Expect a commercial outfit to release that paddle boom thing any day now.

Love what you do man.
Title: Re: DIY Kite Wings Anyone?
Post by: clay on December 23, 2019, 05:41:32 PM
That's Rad, congrats!  Much respect and awe.

I repaired a couple holes in a bladder on one of my kites.  While it's pretty straight forward to take it apart and repair, all the connectors and tight spaces are quite fiddly and a pain in the butt to back together.  So have much more respect for kite makers, especially diy.  Well done.
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