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General Category => Training, Diet, and Fitness => Topic started by: Wetstuff on February 28, 2019, 05:27:30 AM

Title: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Wetstuff on February 28, 2019, 05:27:30 AM
This is a bit of a long read, but the end of it will give you a pretty clear idea of the likely future of our country.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/miraculous-stem-cell-therapy-has-sickened-people-in-five-states/2019/02/26/c04b23a4-3539-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_campaign=1c925f5d4b-MR_COPY_03&utm_medium=email&utm_source=STAT%20Newsletters&utm_term=.2e83602db359


Jim
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: krash on February 28, 2019, 05:50:01 AM
I wanted "stem cells" hoping for a fix for my failing heart, there was a study being done I thought about trying to get into... but my cardiologist talked me out of it, convincing me to hang tight until it was a an approved procedure.

He says my best hope is a "cloned" heart.... I'm sort of healthy enough to walk and talk without a walker and oxygen so would be at the bottom of a transplant list which is the only other option.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Bean on February 28, 2019, 07:08:24 AM
Stem cell research shows a lot of promise, but its not going to happen over night.  It's a shame that these snake-oil companies are not immediately squashed.

 
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: nalu-sup on February 28, 2019, 07:43:22 AM
Ten years ago I had a stem cell injection into an arthritic hip, that was taken from my bone marrow. It was performed by one of the leading stem cell proponents of that time. Prior to the injection I was still active in many sports, and after the injection I ended up on crutches for months in a lot of pain, and had the hip replaced three months later since I was still unable to walk and it was getting progressively worse.
For myself, I am still somewhat of a believer in PRP injections taken from your own blood, mixed with a viscosupplement such as Euflexxa. This combination has helped both my wife and I with various injuries and sore joints. This is not a stem cell injection, but my understanding is that the PRP does recruit stem cells to the site.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: eastbound on February 28, 2019, 08:32:12 AM
"FDA officials said the agency lacks the resources to pursue a comprehensive crackdown on the sprawling stem cell industry. It is difficult to impose a “regulatory architecture after an industry has sort of grown up,” Gottlieb said.

“There’s now a marketplace where arguably hundreds of millions of dollars are being made,” said Mark Schwartz, a former top official for the FDA’s Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research. Manufacturers, clinics and distributors like Liveyon “have a vested interest in keeping this going and are not so easily scared off.”"

vilify, stifle and de-fund regulation, and shit like this happens---used to be regulators were respected, if not feared--where entities being regulated cooperated for fear of losing their livelihood or being prosecuted---and sure, there was overreach etc, but net, industries cooperated with reasonable enforcement

this extends from our  totally unregulated "supplements" industry---an industry i consider mostly a bogus con
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: FRP on February 28, 2019, 08:57:35 AM
This is a bit of a long read, but the end of it will give you a pretty clear idea of the likely future of our country.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/miraculous-stem-cell-therapy-has-sickened-people-in-five-states/2019/02/26/c04b23a4-3539-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_campaign=1c925f5d4b-MR_COPY_03&utm_medium=email&utm_source=STAT%20Newsletters&utm_term=.2e83602db359


Jim

Thanks for posting Wetstuff

It is sad that some people with limited access to health care are sometimes tempted to try relatively inexpensive“placebo” therapies have not been rigorously tested by medical researchers. It is worse when the therapy is not benign. For medications taken orally the placebo effect is responsible for up to 30% of positive effect. For “surgical” procedures it is as high as 50%! This was demonstrated elegantly several years ago with arthroscopy for debriding and “cleaning up” painful knee joints. The surgical procedure was no better than the sham surgery where incisions were made but no surgery took place. Fifty percent of the patients with the sham surgery however still showed improvement. Easy for medical practitioners to be fooled into thinking what they are doing is benificial.

 Bob
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: RideTheGlide on February 28, 2019, 09:55:40 AM
This is a bit of a long read, but the end of it will give you a pretty clear idea of the likely future of our country.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/miraculous-stem-cell-therapy-has-sickened-people-in-five-states/2019/02/26/c04b23a4-3539-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_campaign=1c925f5d4b-MR_COPY_03&utm_medium=email&utm_source=STAT%20Newsletters&utm_term=.2e83602db359


Jim

Thanks for posting Wetstuff

It is sad that some people with limited access to health care are sometimes tempted to try relatively inexpensive“placebo” therapies have not been rigorously tested by medical researchers. It is worse when the therapy is not benign. For medications taken orally the placebo effect is responsible for up to 30% of positive effect. For “surgical” procedures it is as high as 50%! This was demonstrated elegantly several years ago with arthroscopy for debriding and “cleaning up” painful knee joints. The surgical procedure was no better than the sham surgery where incisions were made but no surgery took place. Fifty percent of the patients with the sham surgery however still showed improvement. Easy for medical practitioners to be fooled into thinking what they are doing is benificial.

 Bob

Even with access to quality health care, it's tempting to try something unproven when you aren't getting the results you hoped for with accepted medical practice. I admit following some click bait links for anti aging products. That is a supplement category that really attracts scammers. Placebo effect is really big in that category also. They tell you the pills alone won't do it; you have to stay active. Staying active often helps people feel younger...
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: FRP on February 28, 2019, 01:40:32 PM
This is a bit of a long read, but the end of it will give you a pretty clear idea of the likely future of our country.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/miraculous-stem-cell-therapy-has-sickened-people-in-five-states/2019/02/26/c04b23a4-3539-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_campaign=1c925f5d4b-MR_COPY_03&utm_medium=email&utm_source=STAT%20Newsletters&utm_term=.2e83602db359


Jim

Thanks for posting Wetstuff

It is sad that some people with limited access to health care are sometimes tempted to try relatively inexpensive“placebo” therapies have not been rigorously tested by medical researchers. It is worse when the therapy is not benign. For medications taken orally the placebo effect is responsible for up to 30% of positive effect. For “surgical” procedures it is as high as 50%! This was demonstrated elegantly several years ago with arthroscopy for debriding and “cleaning up” painful knee joints. The surgical procedure was no better than the sham surgery where incisions were made but no surgery took place. Fifty percent of the patients with the sham surgery however still showed improvement. Easy for medical practitioners to be fooled into thinking what they are doing is benificial.

 Bob

Even with access to quality health care, it's tempting to try something unproven when you aren't getting the results you hoped for with accepted medical practice. I admit following some click bait links for anti aging products. That is a supplement category that really attracts scammers. Placebo effect is really big in that category also. They tell you the pills alone won't do it; you have to stay active. Staying active often helps people feel younger...

Glide,

You are exactly right.....there is only one proven “fountain of youth” and that is exercise. Anything that you can do from a proven medical/surgical point of view to keep you active is something to consider. However if you can stay active without these treatments sometimes may best to avoid. “Perfection is the enemy of good”. Unfortunately allopathic medicine does not prescribe placebos as it is considered unethical. Fortunately there are homeopathic doctors that do......well they don’t consider them placebos but........30% of their patients do get better and they avoid all of the side effects of prescription medications.

Cheers

Bob
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: PonoBill on February 28, 2019, 05:48:01 PM
Medicine is a victim of its own success, which is inevitable in every effort to improve the human condition. People don't "want" what they already have. It's tough to see people who have no understanding of how the human body works enthusiastically prescribing nonsense treatments to their friends. But it's pointless to say anything, they aren't going to pay attention to anything that doesn't reinforce their current beliefs. I just shut up or occasionally make snide comments that are sufficiently ridiculous that they pass unnoticed. "Yeah, I rub Cumin over my entire body, the effects are incredible!"

I find "that's incredible!" to be a universally handy phrase. People assume I mean "that's wonderful", when really I mean I don't believe them.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: stoneaxe on February 28, 2019, 07:28:52 PM
"Yeah, I rub Cumin over my entire body, the effects are incredible!"

I'm stealing this....:)
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: eastbound on March 01, 2019, 03:15:43 AM
but who's your source, PB?

are you using chelated-esterized cumin? it cant be absorbed by the skin properly otherwise

Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: burchas on March 01, 2019, 05:24:55 AM
but who's your source, PB?

are you using chelated-esterized cumin? it cant be absorbed by the skin properly otherwise

Forget Bill, he's over the other side of the country, I'll send you a good
source over in chinatown where the best Cumin concoction can be found.

If you can't find Cumin in stock Turmeric is the next best thing.
Just make sure to ask for the Carbon infused because that's what works
best on paddlers/surfers ::)
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Bean on March 01, 2019, 07:41:21 AM
It works best if you apply it using a vacuum infusion process, although it may leave you with a mega-wedgie.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: RideTheGlide on March 01, 2019, 08:02:11 AM
It works best if you apply it using a vacuum infusion process, although it may leave you with a mega-wedgie.

My local witch doctor also sells an aqueous solution in a bag...

"IV?"
"You wish..."
 ;D
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: eastbound on March 01, 2019, 09:45:55 AM
can i borrow your vacuum setup?

wait tho, how do you breathe during vacuum infusion?--or maybe it doesnt matter? like the cumin oxygenates you while you "nap" in the vacuum bag?
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Bean on March 01, 2019, 12:57:58 PM
You have to have the right breather cloth ;D
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: burchas on March 01, 2019, 01:45:19 PM
You have to be careful with vacuum technic, outside the risk mega-wedgie
you're may also develop skin condition that will have you procure Deer Penis
powder mix. You'll probably need hit PBill source for that after all, as I don't
believe even Chinatown source have that as much as we love to buy locally.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: PonoBill on March 01, 2019, 09:15:18 PM
Never mention Tumeric to a true believer in potions. That's the nuclear option of spice-based wellness. Apparently, it cures anything, up to and including amputation. You'll have to either just walk briskly away or knock them unconscious.

burchas--those deer penises are hard to get, the deer refuse to give them up willingly.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: burchas on March 02, 2019, 06:02:23 AM
burchas--those deer penises are hard to get, the deer refuse to give them up willingly.

That's a very grim outlook Bill, for Oregon. Good news is here in NY state, we have places
so dismal, deer just commit suicide. Oh wait I guess it's not so great for deer (or the people
who have to live in those places)
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Wetstuff on March 02, 2019, 10:01:20 AM
I wonder if Medicare will approve a CPAP machine for inhaling Tumeric during REM sleep ...everybody knows that is the optimal time.

Jim
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: RideTheGlide on March 02, 2019, 11:21:57 AM
I wonder if Medicare will approve a CPAP machine for inhaling Tumeric during REM sleep ...everybody knows that is the optimal time.

Jim

My CPAP blow more air out than I breathe in, but vents in a downward direction. So if I slept naked without covers, I would get a body mist simultaneously. That would likely send me on an interesting spiritual journey.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: burchas on March 02, 2019, 01:17:29 PM
I wonder if Medicare will approve a CPAP machine for inhaling Tumeric during REM sleep ...everybody knows that is the optimal time.

Jim

Good question. i've look into it and if you applied and approved for Bean's Vacuum Infused Setup
you are in fact eligible for a CPAP machine. Now which one to get is a whole different thread.
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Bean on March 02, 2019, 03:29:55 PM
Makes perfect sense to me. Since my vac probably started it’s life in a hospital or dentist office, it is proper medical equipment.  “Nurse! Suction!”😁

Damned, I hope they cleaned it before they sold it on, I sure didn’t...
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Wetstuff on April 03, 2019, 11:11:10 AM
More 'Keep you hands on your wallet'...

"Swedish (Seattle) is one of a growing number of respected hospitals and health systems -- including the Mayo Clinic, the Cleveland Clinic, and the University of Miami -- that have entered the lucrative business of stem cells and related therapies, including platelet injections."

https://www.medpagetoday.com/publichealthpolicy/ethics/78989?xid=nl_mpt_investigative2019-04-03&eun=g1282527d0r&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=InvestigateMD_040319&utm_content=B&utm_term=NL_Gen_Int_InvestigateMD_Active



Jim
Title: Re: 'Yer' gonna want stem cells...'
Post by: Wetstuff on April 03, 2019, 11:28:53 AM
....and, 

'Illegal and Potentially Harmful' Autism Therapies

In 2017, the Perskin family traveled to a clinic in Chicago, so their son, Jason, could receive a stem cell therapy to treat his autism. Jodi Perskin, Jason's mother, had first heard about this experimental therapy in a Facebook group for parents interested in stem cell-based remedies for children on the spectrum. The visit cost $8,500, though Thom Lobe, MD, the pediatric surgeon who runs three such clinics in the U.S., recommended four visits per year: a $34,000/year investment.

Lobe is far from the only physician marketing unregulated, unproven, and possibly dangerous stem cell therapies to desperate parents. In fact, in 2017 the FDA cautioned consumers that such therapies may be "illegal and potentially harmful," and last year the agency sent warning letters to several companies. But the agency has done little else and clinics such as Lobe's continue to thrive.

"I find it astonishing that this marketplace exists as a result of regulatory inaction," Leigh Turner, PhD, an associate professor at the University of Minnesota Center for Bioethics, Minneapolis,


Jim