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General => Training, Diet, and Fitness => Topic started by: APPST_Paddle on August 23, 2018, 07:22:31 AM

Title: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: APPST_Paddle on August 23, 2018, 07:22:31 AM
I'm 37 years old and in fairly good shape, 6'0, 175 lbs. or so. I eat fairly well, I go with 1/3 veggies, 1/3 protein, 1/3 complex carbs each meal basically with protein shakes and/or nuts, fruit for snacks. I'll have a crazy meal once or twice a week, drink once or twice a week.

5:30 AM - wakeup, check/pray for surf, no surf - gym for 45 minutes. I typically do some sort of muscle group 5-6 days/week if there's no surf. 
3:30-4 PM - check wind, if windy (basically 5 days/week the whole spring and summer) - kite, if not, I typically do some form of cardio 3-5 days/week (30 min) - cycling, flatwater paddle,etc. 

So, I'm hitting a bit of a plateau, where I'm looking for new workout plans, or just a general mix of what I typically do. My goal, has most of us have, is to be able to surf as long as possible both in terms of hours in the water/session/week, etc. and longevity. I want to be the guy surfing at 90.

My question for the group is, what have you found works for you. Whether it's a mix of traditional strength training with SUP mixed in. A mix of cycling, swimming, running, etc. mixed with SUP, or just straight paddling all of the time.

I'm contemplating either limiting my strength training to 3 days/week which would probably be 2 days of legs/core, 1 day of upper body, and mixing in more paddling, maybe some swimming (in the summer), cycling, etc. The bottom line is I work a desk job, so I have to do something everyday or at least 6 days a week or I go stir crazy.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: goodfornothin on August 23, 2018, 09:35:41 AM
Kettlebells, wimhof breath with cold water submerssion, yoga, and deep sand sprints (i use a 90lb kettle bell tied to a waist belt)

Ive also been fermenting most of my food and i am suprised with the results
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: Eagle on August 23, 2018, 11:43:24 AM
"My question for the group is, what have you found works for you. Whether it's a mix of traditional strength training with SUP mixed in. A mix of cycling, swimming, running, etc. mixed with SUP, or just straight paddling all of the time."

Variation.  But what helped most was getting DEXA scans to define progress.  Is an accurate way to track muscle fat BMD vs type of training over time.  The detailed scan info pinpoints exactly what needs work.  Has actually helped a ton to maintain motivation and focus over the years.  Takes most of the guesswork and speculation out of the equation.  ;)
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: APPST_Paddle on August 24, 2018, 07:30:56 AM
"My question for the group is, what have you found works for you. Whether it's a mix of traditional strength training with SUP mixed in. A mix of cycling, swimming, running, etc. mixed with SUP, or just straight paddling all of the time."

Variation.  But what helped most was getting DEXA scans to define progress.  Is an accurate way to track muscle fat BMD vs type of training over time.  The detailed scan info pinpoints exactly what needs work.  Has actually helped a ton to maintain motivation and focus over the years.  Takes most of the guesswork and speculation out of the equation.  ;)

Yeah, my wife and I have talked about getting those. I agree, I'm going to just keep mixing up my routine, work in some swimming, maybe a bit more running, etc. Again, the primary goal is overall fitness and longevity without injuries. Being able to see your obliques and lower ab muscles is a nice by-product.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: SoFloSupChick on September 05, 2018, 02:22:35 AM
This is not the end all, be all solution, but this is what worked for me in the past. And if you're already doing strength training, I think this might be a good change.

If you want the biggest bang for the buck and the least amount of time spent in the gym, it's weight lifting (free weights, power-lifting-style not nautilus-type equipment), and sprints. If you've never done this type of weight lifting before, I highly recommend the book Starting Strength. It will have both the lift instructions and a starting program all laid out for you. For sprints - any kind really - mix it up! For example, look into Tabata sprint protocol.

If you really want to see amazing results, look into leangains program in terms of nutrition. It might seem crazy at first, and requires dedication. But it does work wonders, if you want to see that 6-pack.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: ukgm on September 05, 2018, 03:35:31 AM
I'm not a huge fan of Tabata style workouts. The gains are well proven but once you get past 6-8 weeks, they'll completely rely on the athlete having the ability to achieve a true maximum effort and I don't believe that is mentally sustainable in the long run. Do them as a block periodically but mix it up is my advice. This is particulary pertinent for those over 40. I've been doing some reading of the 'anabolic threshold' concept recently and that's changing the way I train and eat in particular. I'm moving to much heavier weights as a result.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: Adolfo on September 05, 2018, 04:26:38 AM
Looks  like you are doing OK in the strength and cardio fields.
But if you want to surf  at 90, I would recommend mixing in a couple of yoga classes a week, and also some swimming when there is no wind.
Yoga really makes a difference in the long term.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: singingdog on September 05, 2018, 04:34:56 AM
Functional strength has been the key for me (57). Constantly mixing it up, and introducing instability into strength training is a great way to keep your body from "memorizing" exercises and reducing the benefit. I am not so interested in "pure" strength but the ability to apply strength in a dynamic environment (SUP, MTB, trail running, and nordic skiing in my case)

And yoga everyday.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: Eagle on September 05, 2018, 03:36:31 PM
"My question for the group is, what have you found works for you. Whether it's a mix of traditional strength training with SUP mixed in. A mix of cycling, swimming, running, etc. mixed with SUP, or just straight paddling all of the time."

Variation.  But what helped most was getting DEXA scans to define progress.  Is an accurate way to track muscle fat BMD vs type of training over time.  The detailed scan info pinpoints exactly what needs work.  Has actually helped a ton to maintain motivation and focus over the years.  Takes most of the guesswork and speculation out of the equation.  ;)
... Again, the primary goal is overall fitness and longevity without injuries. Being able to see your obliques and lower ab muscles is a nice by-product.
100%.  Injuries is the fundamental aspect for me moving towards 60.  Yesterday felt great and was doing 5x5 very heavy DL.  My very last rep heard and felt a little "pop".  Lowered the weight and felt my lower back muscles tighten up and kinda get real sore bending over.  Long and short is that it is already getting back to normal today after some stretching last night and rehab with weights today.  Def a wake-up call.  As just a split second lapse in form is all it takes sometimes.

Guess is that all the development to opposing and supporting muscles really helped keep this mishap from becoming a big problem.  Def counting my lucky stars.  Gotta keep perfect technique.  ;)
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: puget sound on September 16, 2018, 08:04:08 PM
Variation of both activity and intensity has been key for for me (mid-40s). That and recovery time. It has taken me a long time to learn and respect that going hard all the time causes injuries now instead of causing strength.

Variation is also a good excuse to play around and try fun new things in the name of health.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: APPST_Paddle on November 14, 2018, 05:37:36 AM
Looks  like you are doing OK in the strength and cardio fields.
But if you want to surf  at 90, I would recommend mixing in a couple of yoga classes a week, and also some swimming when there is no wind.
Yoga really makes a difference in the long term.

I agree with this - swimming I worked in during the summer, but mainly I've mixed in stretching more than before. Yoga will be the next step, I've taken classes on vacation in CR, etc. but nothing dedicated.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: eastbound on November 14, 2018, 06:16:14 AM
time is my main problem--love yoga, but just dont have 90 mins to do it on any regular sched--i use dumbbells at office--i do popups and wall sits whenever i can--i stretch randomly--but i get avg of 8 x 55 minute bike rides to/from work each week--and this would be sunk commute time, whatever my mode-that has been my savior--caveat would be if i got injured cycling---i am flirting with retiring or dialing back work significantly--an incentive to that route is that i would have time for daily yoga, and more focussed exercise and diet---
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: APPST_Paddle on November 25, 2018, 02:39:01 AM
time is my main problem--love yoga, but just dont have 90 mins to do it on any regular sched--i use dumbbells at office--i do popups and wall sits whenever i can--i stretch randomly--but i get avg of 8 x 55 minute bike rides to/from work each week--and this would be sunk commute time, whatever my mode-that has been my savior--caveat would be if i got injured cycling---i am flirting with retiring or dialing back work significantly--an incentive to that route is that i would have time for daily yoga, and more focussed exercise and diet---

Same - stretching and yoga sometimes get squeezed out because of time. I'll add in one more thing that has helped quite a bit by accident somewhat. Last year, my wife bought a Peloton bike. My first thought was we have a gym membership what the hell - and it will never get used. I'm at 150 or so rides and she's right behind me, it's a great tool to get in some lower body exercise on climb runs or overall cardio, quick and easy.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: natas585 on December 09, 2018, 03:47:45 AM
Lots of ways to the top of that mountain. I use the one that gets me there with the least amount of wear and tear and most amount of left over free time. The activity with the highest amount of all cause mortality prevention is strength training. I mix calisthenics in my morning wake up ritual and little bits of yoga in my workout warmups as well as some meditation/breathing in my evening routine as I wind down. Unless I'm surfing or racing nothing last more than 30 minutes. Usually workouts are 20 mins or less. Sure you can spend 90 mins on yoga, 60 on cardio, 90 more on sitting on gym equipment. But why if you can get the same results from lots less. Unless you're a pro athlete and can recover from the huge amounts of exercise induced stress why would you? Lots of great advice in the previous comments. Obviously this is my opinion, and it might change as I learn more about the field of strength and conditioning. I recommend 3 strength specific workouts a week. They would be one of each of the following: Squats, Presses, Deadlifts. Periodize and structure them accordingly. Use the gym as your laboratory and notice how your body feels at that time. They should last 30 mins including warmup. I use sup for a high intensity conditioning workout mixed with running. The beach is awesome for these. 2 miles total of paddling and running sprints. 20 -30 mins total twice weekly.  Always work on skills of whichever activity is your focus every time you warmup, saves time. Days off of work or weekends are for longer distance cardio or racing. Good luck.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: mr_proper on December 09, 2018, 04:11:20 AM
For me, pull ups, pushups and squats work best. I do it as far as possible every day and takes a max. of 25 minutes. otherwise I paddle 1-3 times a week (does not really work at the moment).
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: RideTheGlide on December 09, 2018, 07:32:06 AM
I will be 60 in a little over 2 weeks. I probably spend 75% of my time on a cardio machine. I do some core/abs work, but some of that is vanity - I am going to turn 60 with visible abs after being clinically obese in the summer of 2017. But the machine/device I think helps most is the endless rope machine.

https://www.google.com/search?q=endless+rope+machine (https://www.google.com/search?q=endless+rope+machine)  - just a generic query as there are variations that different gyms have. Mine has one like this:

(https://lifefitness.com/sites/g/files/dtv111/f/life-fitness/commercial/group-training/synrgy360/gym-feat-SYNRGY360-rope-pull.jpg)

I back away from it a bit and rock back on my heels so that I am off balance about to fall backwards and then use the rope like I am try to pull back to my feet purely using my arms. It does graduated resistance. I can never pull myself forward but I can always try up until the point I just have to stop. Reaching out and pulling with core engaged over and over and continuing to do it as hard and fast as you can as your strength ebbs - sound familiar?
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: connector14 on December 09, 2018, 09:26:51 AM
One day I was trying to get my 88 year old dad out of bed and I was sitting in a wheelchair showing him how he could move around in the chair using his legs and arms....he said to me "son,  all of this emphasis on movement is highly over-rated"....

He had been an active tennis player until he fell once on the court while in his 70's....his doc told him he had better stop playing tennis or he might have a bad accident and never walk again.....worst advice he even could have gotten....he was never the same after that and he became so sedentary and weak and went downhill pretty quick after that. His doc gave him the excuses for becoming weak and lazy.

Keep moving folks !
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: RideTheGlide on December 09, 2018, 04:08:14 PM
The activity with the highest amount of all cause mortality prevention is strength training.

The studies I see put both cardio and strength training in the upper forties as far as improvement in risk. Those are strong numbers. I like a little of both to have strength and endurance, but I like to do long paddles.

Here are a couple of studies, one for strength training and one for cardio:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26921660
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2951585

The takeaway id being fit helps significantly. Which road you take to get there doesn't seem to make much difference.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: hbsteve on December 09, 2018, 04:46:35 PM
Because of some diet changes and blood pressure medication, I lost some muscle strength.
I have started doing kettle bell swings and farmers carries.  The kettle bell swing uses a lot of the same
movement as paddling.  A gym membership isn't required.
I bought two 10 pound dumbbells to start with.  I was originally worried that was too light.  The store I bought them
from is in a mall.  By the time I got to my car, I was glad I didn't buy 15 pound dumbbells.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: PonoBill on December 09, 2018, 07:08:23 PM
One day I was trying to get my 88 year old dad out of bed and I was sitting in a wheelchair showing him how he could move around in the chair using his legs and arms....he said to me "son,  all of this emphasis on movement is highly over-rated"....

He had been an active tennis player until he fell once on the court while in his 70's....his doc told him he had better stop playing tennis or he might have a bad accident and never walk again.....worst advice he even could have gotten....he was never the same after that and he became so sedentary and weak and went downhill pretty quick after that. His doc gave him the excuses for becoming weak and lazy.

Keep moving folks !

Pretty much my mantra.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: TallDude on December 09, 2018, 07:46:24 PM
Since I started walking (a fast) 3 miles a day (with some steep hills), my legs have become so much stronger. It's improved my surfing too. I've started doing a few distance paddles each week as well. I used to run and ride my mountain bike but both started to inflamed my knees, so I would just paddle to stay fit. My legs didn't get much of a workout just paddling. After having surgery the beginning of this years, the only exercise I could do was walk. I was really feeling my legs getting stronger. So for now the walking and paddling is my current workout routine. No gym for me.
As far as my diet goes, I just bought a new BBQ and have been using it twice a week  :)
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: ukgm on December 10, 2018, 12:22:51 AM
Two well sized dumbells and a rucksack full of plates in your garage and you can do loads of relevant work in 20 minutes.
Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: Cruisinby on December 11, 2018, 03:32:54 PM
ADD STRETCHING AND MINOR YOGA and you will go far,  Im 66 still prone surf, sup and windsurf.   My older friends who are profient all stretch and do minor yoga at home.   Dedication thru commetment will yield major dividends !    Find what works for you, your skill level and physic. 

paddle on youngster !   Hope to See when Im 90, Look for old one eyed bald headed fat man still havin fun !



Title: Re: Strength Training Thoughts
Post by: APPST_Paddle on May 06, 2019, 12:53:24 PM
Reviving this thread, pretty much plateau'ed for the last few months. I've done some TRX combos for a few weeks, and then I used the 3 month program from Surf Strength Fitness, which was a nice mix (but I've done it twice now). Looking for something to stay lean (I'm fluctating between 165-170 lb) but continue to strength legs, core, shoulders. I may work in some of the Dave Kalama mix - and focus on squats/deadlift/press variations.

That along with kiting/paddling roughly 5 times a week.
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