Standup Zone Forum
Stand Up Paddle => Gear Talk => Sneak Peeks, Rumors, and Wish Lists => Topic started by: ukgm on May 10, 2018, 08:30:00 AM
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So, this is the time of year when we start to hear whispers about what is coming from the brands for next season. Anyone heard anyone yet ? Unusually, I haven’t heard anything yet.
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The only thing I know is that you're gonna see a lot of deep dugouts.
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Racing? Do people still do that? :)
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The only thing I know is that you're gonna see a lot of deep dugouts.
Deep insight Bill ;D I'll subscribe to it.
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From what I've seen and as PonoBill said there will be dugouts coming. I saw Jimmy Lewis and JP Australia so far.
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as below ;D
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From what I've seen and as PonoBill said there will be dugouts coming. I saw Jimmy Lewis and JP Australia so far.
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Sonni was on a monster Starboard dugout for the Olukai. I saw her and another lady pulled off by the side of the road adding half a dozen straps to try to keep it on their rental car. I stopped and tied the nose to the bumper for them. I was amazed by the depth of the thing--deeper than any OC1 or surfski.
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Sonni was on a monster Starboard dugout for the Olukai.[...] I was amazed by the depth of the thing--deeper than any OC1 or surfski.
Another nail in the coffin from my perspective, when the halo boards are evolving into something I'm personally not interested in. It's as if its not evolving, but morphing into something different altogether...
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Sonni was on a monster Starboard dugout for the Olukai.[...] I was amazed by the depth of the thing--deeper than any OC1 or surfski.
Another nail in the coffin from my perspective, when the halo boards are evolving into something I'm personally not interested in. It's as if its not evolving, but morphing into something different altogether...
Actually sounds like some of the dugout shapes are getting almost deep enough to be used as coffins.
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Sonni was on a monster Starboard dugout for the Olukai.[...] I was amazed by the depth of the thing--deeper than any OC1 or surfski.
Another nail in the coffin from my perspective, when the halo boards are evolving into something I'm personally not interested in. It's as if its not evolving, but morphing into something different altogether...
Yes, that’s how I feel about it too. It’s moving away from surfing/boardsports and becoming stand up canoeing. These craft are awkward - awkward to paddle, awkward to carry, awkward to transport. If you weren’t racing you wouldn’t choose to paddle one - at least, not standing up, anyway.
But this is the evolution of SUP. Racing will become increasingly niche, a subclass of canoeing. Surf SUP will break away and become its own thing - a rather slow version of “real” surfing. The early adopters will all move to foiling. The rest of the demographic will paddle with their dogs on inflatables. And forums like this will cease to exist because there is no longer any meeting point for the various subtypes of SUP (which will adopt new names in order to distinguish themselves from each other).
And a small core of us from the early days of SUP will continue to surf 9ft+ surf SUPs, paddle downwind boards that look like big surf guns, and tour, explore, fish and do yoga on just about anything that floats. No competition, just fun. Just like we always have: old school SUP.
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Actually sounds like some of the dugout shapes are getting almost deep enough to be used as coffins.
I just love all the more my Ace-GT. Not crazy deep, low volume, 31 lbs.
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Sunova is making it easier to transport raceboards around the world.
Team members, Kelly Margetts and Lina Augaitis battle tested them in rough conditions at the Carolina Cup Graveyard race in April.
Lina's comment:
"Surprisingly competitive. This system is allowing us to travel and race around the world cheaper, with less hassle and less broken boards...."
ps... Lina is such a sweet lady, staging a comeback after having 2 children. Her baby daughter Aiste, was with her at the Sunova Dealer Meeting last week. Life is a balance, and she is doing it full power!
I watched Takuji Araki pack these 2 blue boards inside a Taxi van with with 5 people heading to the airport. Zero hassle.
Watch for his 12 yo son "Shrimpy" to compete in the M2O on one of these boards.
All Sunova's can be made as 2 piece now.
If you travel with your SUP..... it's worth a look.
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I would gladly settle for a one piece Allwater 2018 with the new tail.
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Very 1st time I saw a dugout (K15) I hated the look. I've never been interested in owning one. I don't care for the confining nature of them and a lot if not most of the boards are designed for secondary stability....which means nothing to me. I fall often and dragging myself back over that edge would get old. I think it's part of what has turned me off of racing....being big was part of it but the shape that boards have gone to in order to be competitive has contributed as well.
Despite my personal dislike of dugouts I have to says that it looks like Sunova has done it again. That answers a lot of issues for racers and the dugout shape must make the two piece a lot stronger.
I'll be interested to see the other boards in 2 pieces....I'd love to have a travel sup.
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that's one of the evolution on dugouts PonoBill, go deeper dugout or go home ;)
thanks for the pics supthecreek and do you know if there is change to the allwater board from this year to next year model.
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I do know that Lightsignature have got a new all water board built by Nelo coming out iminently. I think it's another hollow construction board like their flatwater one.
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I have to say, I don't know if its the state of the market but i'm not hearing of anything intriguing for 2019. No sneak peaks, no nothing. :(
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I have to say, I don't know if its the state of the market but i'm not hearing of anything intriguing for 2019. No sneak peaks, no nothing. :(
Some of the 2018 new models are still almost an unknown....
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If you guys follow Infinity on IG, Dave has posted on his story some Sneak peaks of the whiplash
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I've seen a few new shapes.
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The new Fanatic Strike has officially been launched. The two widths are a long way apart from each other though. 21.5 is too narrow and 25 is wider than i use now !
https://www.fanatic.com/product/strike/
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The new Fanatic Strike has officially been launched. The two widths are a long way apart from each other though. 21.5 is too narrow and 25 is wider than i use now !
https://www.fanatic.com/product/strike/
They should have just labelled them “kids” and “oldies” sizes.
Next year the 25 will be gone. Then you’ll have nothing you can race, old man :)
If I were an inland flat water guy though, I’d want to try the 14x25. Looks like it would be stable for its width. Slab-sided boards like these in the past have not fared well though - they catch every bit of wind or chop. And having super-thin walls around the standing area makes for hassle transporting, plus dings, injuries, and it being tough to get back in the board after a fall. So I don’t know how much this would appeal as an everyday proposition if you aren’t a die-hard racer.
They’ll be a lot of (smaller) women out there though that might be very grateful for the 21.5” wide one - as long as the board isn’t too painful to carry (another downside of thin sidewalls on a dropped-deck design is that the sidewalls cut into your arms uncomfortably when you are carrying it).
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I do like the new strike and that 21.5 wide is very narrow to stand on unless your weight weenie.
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I just got my 2018 whiplash! Love it, but still waiting on my LA race twins!
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I have heard about the new Starboard sprint today. Similar but more rounded off edges to make it better in rougher waters.
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This is new...
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This is new...
It does look like a Dryft with the nose "reversed" and flat rocker. Also look like the deck is slightly recessed.
A Dryft/Fireball cross?
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2019 Fanatic obviously have the new Strike, the Falcon (which is now a clog) and finally the new 'Blitz'.
https://www.facebook.com/fanaticsupaustralia/
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And from the back:
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2019 Fanatic obviously have the new Strike, the Falcon (which is now a clog) and finally the new 'Blitz'.
https://www.facebook.com/fanaticsupaustralia/
Ah, “The Blitz”... there’s a name associated with happy memories in the UK.
Coming up for 2020 from Fanatic, the new model called “Dunkirk”...
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2019 Fanatic obviously have the new Strike, the Falcon (which is now a clog) and finally the new 'Blitz'.
https://www.facebook.com/fanaticsupaustralia/
Ah, “The Blitz”... there’s a name associated with happy memories in the UK.
Coming up for 2020 from Fanatic, the new model called “Dunkirk”...
That's a sinker....Dieppe would be sinking even more......
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I’ll bet sales of the Blitz will bomb in the UK.
But maybe in Germany they will be keen.
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Very nice looking NSP, Starboard, and Infinity right there... oh! wait... ;)
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Wonder if the new clog Falcon comes with a rope ladder? The deck is so sunken you are gonna need one to get in and out of it.
And why is the nose of the Blitz so bulbous? It’s gonna be a struggle pushing that upwind. Didn’t the Blitz designers get the memo that the trend is for wider butts and sleeker noses on the race boards that the elites are actually going to race on?
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I’ll bet sales of the Blitz will bomb in the UK.
But maybe in Germany they will be keen.
Very subtle. ;D
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
Good idea. If you are not going the custom route, I can guarantee that no-one will beat you on a 2019 board who wouldn’t beat you on a 2018 one. The UK race conditions are too unpredictable and generally meh for any design innovation to have any significant effect, given current constructions and regulations.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
Good idea. If you are not going the custom route, I can guarantee that no-one will beat you on a 2019 board who wouldn’t beat you on a 2018 one. The UK race conditions are too unpredictable and generally meh for any design innovation to have any significant effect, given current constructions and regulations.
..... that and the fact that I was offered some boards for a song being used by the pro’s at this weeks London cup. I’d never pay full retail anyway but if you shop wisely and know the right people, there are going to be some bargains out there. I mean look at this way, who is going to buy a load of ex team sprints in a 21.5 width ?
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I must try ALL those Fanatics. 8)
I'm curious what the widths and rockers are like on the Blitz and the Falcon dugout, and what the intended market/purpose is for each. I.e., is one intended for all-water racing and the other for downwinding, or are both intended for both?
Also interesting rounded underside and soft rails on the tail on the Blitz, and what looks like sharp rails on the pointy tail of the new Falcon.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
Good idea. If you are not going the custom route, I can guarantee that no-one will beat you on a 2019 board who wouldn’t beat you on a 2018 one. The UK race conditions are too unpredictable and generally meh for any design innovation to have any significant effect, given current constructions and regulations.
..... that and the fact that I was offered some boards for a song being used by the pro’s at this weeks London cup. I’d never pay full retail anyway but if you shop wisely and know the right people, there are going to be some bargains out there. I mean look at this way, who is going to buy a load of ex team sprints in a 21.5 width ?
Who indeed.
And then having bought one, why would you buy a new one next year?
And so the (precarious, anyway) market collapses. Then there’s no-one to pay for the races.
But in the meantime I’d love to try those Fanatics. At least they’ve come up with some bold designs. Not sure I’d ever want one. But at least they are interesting.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
Good idea. If you are not going the custom route, I can guarantee that no-one will beat you on a 2019 board who wouldn’t beat you on a 2018 one. The UK race conditions are too unpredictable and generally meh for any design innovation to have any significant effect, given current constructions and regulations.
..... that and the fact that I was offered some boards for a song being used by the pro’s at this weeks London cup. I’d never pay full retail anyway but if you shop wisely and know the right people, there are going to be some bargains out there. I mean look at this way, who is going to buy a load of ex team sprints in a 21.5 width ?
Who indeed.
And then having bought one, why would you buy a new one next year?
And so the (precarious, anyway) market collapses. Then there’s no-one to pay for the races.
But in the meantime I’d love to try those Fanatics. At least they’ve come up with some bold designs. Not sure I’d ever want one. But at least they are interesting.
It's a bit of a longstanding gag on the UK circuit whereby you can walk around before any race start and see about 3 or 4 previous generations of your raceboards that have been bought and sold over the years. The 21.5's will kill this off. I know of 3 team riders that are going to be looking to shift theirs in a couple of months time and even if they sell (and I think they'll struggle) you'll be selling them to an already small pool that (as you say) won't buy another unless biblical improvements in stability are assured (and that's unlikely with conventional shaping now). Have that happen 2 or 3 years in a row and your domestic race board market will finally collapse. You can't blame the manufacturers for pushing things unchecked - this was the governing bodies fault. They needed some controls in place that would still allow a downshift in sizing but over a longer period of time and not to extreme levels. Everybody's focus on the sports control, the Olympics and speed itself is ultimately going to result in disappointment, losses and mass disinterest. But hey, that's no different to many other sports but SUP was uniquely placed.
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I saw - maybe - the new Strike at the London race at the weekend. But it looked like maybe an old Falcon-style boof-nosed Board was still the weapon to be on if you are an elite paddler in that overall format of races (ie. where short technical sprints are weighted highly)?
Also, why did I not see more UK racers in the elite races in London at the APP World Tour event? It looked like a couple of UK women didn’t turn up? Or maybe the UK racers simply weren’t sufficiently near the front to get coverage (I was watching on the web because my train line to the venue was closed this weekend!)? I saw Marie but I think that was about it. Mind you,the coverage did go on and off - it looked like the website went down at the times of peak traffic.
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It does look like Arthur Aruntkin placed second on the boof nose Fanatic - maybe the Blitzkrieg was back to London that day.
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Yep.
I noticed many years ago when testing a SIC Bullet V1 - of all boards - that a planing hull/nose board doesn’t seem to have the same top end speed limit as a cutting bow one. Over very short distances and with a huge expenditure of energy I could get the Bullet to go faster than my flatwater cutting bow boards. Of course, I could only keep it up for a few yards. But it did make me wonder what could be achieved by someone who can actually paddle and is supremely fit. The displacement noses tend to “dig in” under extreme effort in a way that the planing hull ones don’t. But maybe it’s just me :)
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I think that is the idea being the Infinity Blackfish and the Naish Maliko been "sprint" boards.
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I saw - maybe - the new Strike at the London race at the weekend. But it looked like maybe an old Falcon-style boof-nosed Board was still the weapon to be on if you are an elite paddler in that overall format of races (ie. where short technical sprints are weighted highly)?
Also, why did I not see more UK racers in the elite races in London at the APP World Tour event? It looked like a couple of UK women didn’t turn up? Or maybe the UK racers simply weren’t sufficiently near the front to get coverage (I was watching on the web because my train line to the venue was closed this weekend!)? I saw Marie but I think that was about it. Mind you,the coverage did go on and off - it looked like the website went down at the times of peak traffic.
It was by invitation only. Most of the uk ladies & men were in the pro am. Marie had to be wildcarded to be in the elite race apparently. The coverage was crap and I still don’t know the results in all the events. Personally I didn’t fancy it and was getting ready for a bike race and having spoke to a few paddlers there, I made the right call.
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Well that’s very strange for the women’s events because the impression given was that there weren’t many racers.
Tricky location. The event was unlucky in that two of the main railway systems into and around London were disrupted at the weekend. And of course there is the World Cup football...but putting that aside there is the issue that the water in the Thames really isn’t suitable for immersion sports. You’d need a hazmat suit if you are going to be falling in regularly - and several of the elites did, courtesy of their very narrow boards these days.
It was pretty amazing to see Kai, Connor, Mo, Travis, Michael, Candice etc paddle in the UK though. I hope they get to paddle elsewhere in the UK and not just go home with the impression that all the UK has to offer is a dirty river, no air con, and traffic congestion.
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On the up side one thing UK sure doesn't need is AirCon.
Even if they emit "heat wave" warnings when outdoor air temps might reach 15C (59F).
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On the up side one thing UK sure doesn't need is AirCon.
Even if they emit "heat wave" warnings when outdoor air temps might reach 15C (59F).
Actually, the reason I said that is that there is a heatwave in the UK right now that has been going on for some time. It is set perhaps to be the hottest summer since 1976. New records have been set, the train lines are buckling because of the heat, and where I live the tarmac in the road is melting. In my workplace, people are gathering in one of the large rooms downstairs rather than in their offices where there is no air con. The paddlers in London were complaining about the heat - in the centre of town surrounded by buildings and with little open space it can easily get over 30C - and unlike other countries which have this kind of heat regularly, we are not set up for it. It’s tough at night when the temperatures hardly drop and you don’t have air con and are used to a chilly climate.
At home, I can’t go anywhere in the car at weekends because I live near the sea: the roads are completely jammed from 10am to 8pm with tourists. It’s a 3 mile round trip walk to the shops. It’s because the sea is over 20C (more like 24C in local spots when the tide comes in) and for once in the UK you don’t need a wetsuit. The water yesterday actually felt warm to the touch.
These are temperatures that would be completely unremarkable in many other countries and would hardly even be noticed. But here is it causing quite a lot of diruption and discomfort. The pollution and pollen issue goes through the roof in London when it gets this hot week after week with no rain or wind. Not ideal conditions for doing a long distance SUP race.
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I think that is the idea being the Infinity Blackfish and the Naish Maliko been "sprint" boards.
I think its merely that a lot of pro's travel not knowing exactly what multiple races will throw at them so they just opt for a board that covers all the practical bases and assume there is little between them anyway. I know that's not true but you can't expect athletes to be scientists or engineers as well.
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I think that is the idea being the Infinity Blackfish and the Naish Maliko been "sprint" boards.
I think its merely that a lot of pro's travel not knowing exactly what multiple races will throw at them so they just opt for a board that covers all the practical bases and assume there is little between them anyway. I know that's not true but you can't expect athletes to be scientists or engineers as well.
It’s ironic that in the London *sprint* event, held in protected pure flatwater conditions, was won a planing nose board, with a board called “Maliko” coming second, with the board called the “Sprint” managing only third. In fact, I think three of the top 4 finishers were on planing nose “all-waters” ones.
Maybe Starboard should rename the Sprint? It won a (mild) downwind race recently :)
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I think that is the idea being the Infinity Blackfish and the Naish Maliko been "sprint" boards.
I think its merely that a lot of pro's travel not knowing exactly what multiple races will throw at them so they just opt for a board that covers all the practical bases and assume there is little between them anyway. I know that's not true but you can't expect athletes to be scientists or engineers as well.
Actually the Infinity Team travelled specially for the race and all but one were using Blackfish instead of Whiplash. And these are for sale after the event took place. So it looks like a deliberate choice.
TEAM BOARDS FOR SALE IN THE UK!!
Kai Lenny 14’x23” Blackfish.
Slater Trout 14’x235 Blackfish.
Tyler Bashor 14’x23” Whiplash dugout.
Candice Appleby 12’6”x25” Blackfish.
Shae Foudy 12’6”x23” Blackfish.
Chloe Walkerdene 12’6”x23” Blackfish.
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I don’t think anyone could possibly have guessed a few years ago that the choice of elite paddlers for pure flat water would be planing-type boards. It seems so counter-intuitive, and may be a product of the race formats we use (in particular, where drafting is allowed) rather than saying anything about the laws of physics. However, anyone seeing Caspar in his early sprint events on a Naish Maliko in pure flat water must surely have paused for thought, nevertheless. Of course, what works for the elites may be completely wrong for the average guy, and in any case you’ll never convince photofr to use a planing hull in flat water ;)
Oh yeah, and btw in the women’s elite sprint race final in London, the only Starboard Sprint came in last. More evidence that the Sprint board, err... isn’t?
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Amazing these guys can push 10.5-11 km/hr. As interesting listening to their race strategies. Connor unfortunately gassed out pulling the train -> while Travis took this as good Molokai training.
Really makes you appreciate how much speed these guys are generating. Is pretty tough for many to even get their board sprinting full out to go 11 km/hr -> let alone hold this at race pace.
https://vimeo.com/278778102
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I don’t think anyone could possibly have guessed a few years ago that the choice of elite paddlers for pure flat water would be planing-type boards. It seems so counter-intuitive, and may be a product of the race formats we use (in particular, where drafting is allowed) rather than saying anything about the laws of physics. However, anyone seeing Caspar in his early sprint events on a Naish Maliko in pure flat water must surely have paused for thought, nevertheless. Of course, what works for the elites may be completely wrong for the average guy, and in any case you’ll never convince photofr to use a planing hull in flat water ;)
Oh yeah, and btw in the women’s elite sprint race final in London, the only Starboard Sprint came in last. More evidence that the Sprint board, err... isn’t?
(I’ll claim my ‘no prize’ as I said a while back that the smart move would be for racers to paddle the narrowest allwater board they can handle).
For modern racing, is an allstar in its 22 inch width the best option rather than the 21.5 sprint ? It’s bloody hard to say as many elites now seem to be using boards out of their intended use :o
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Yes indeed, Eagle - their speeds seem to almost defy the laws of physics.
Hence why I said that what might a a sprint board for you and me might not be for them (and vice-versa).
But I guess that’s just the difference between elite athletes and the rest of us. Any average person who has run alongside an elite marathon runner will know that.
It’s very difficult to see exactly where they are creating such power at the blade though. It would be great to set a team of Research physiologists onto it to find out.
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Yeah similar sort of speed diff vs elite marathon runners. You very hard pressed to sprint beside -> while they are in race pace cruise mode.
Boothy went to his strength going it alone after he broke Connor. His 21.5 Sprint gave him just enough of an advantage to stay clear ahead. Would have expected an AS22.5 to be somewhat slower. If not for Connor keeping it somewhat close pulling the train using his Sprint 21.5 -> the pack would have been likely further back drafting a slower rabbit. For example the group Kai raced with were way way back.
Strategy was to get a clear gap to keep the finish sprinters at bay -> and this worked to perfection. Kinda reminded me of the peloton and lead chase group. Travis went full out but still was passed at the line. All strategy and all very interesting.
Here there is that 2017 Sprint 21.5 for sale at $1500. A huge depreciation hit but oh so tempting. Just cannot see using that board in the slop and chop of the ocean we often have. So am content with the boards we have. Def will take a certain buyer for that one.
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I guess that London has one board for everybody :-)
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It’s very difficult to see exactly where they are creating such power at the blade though. It would be great to set a team of Research physiologists onto it to find out.
Power or force ? I doubt its force.
Relating to this, one thing I did learn last week when some of my friends went paddling with some of the pro's in the days leading upto the London event was that their paddles have gone much shorter again. Jim revised quickblades table not too long ago but that's not reflective again of the pro's. The feedback I heard was that the men in particular are now going their height minus at least 10%. To me that suggests a change in stroke rates, smoother spikes in board acceleration and a shift to athletes who are physiologically better off with a half decent VO2 max to support all of this. It's basically the ongoing natural selection process of a new sport .
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Yeah, I handled one of Mo Freitas’s paddles and it was too short for me - and he is a bit taller than me.
You only need to try paddling on your knees to see the advantage of being closer to the water. From a performance point of view, standing up to paddle is really stupid. Only an idiot would do it from the perspective of traveling efficiency and speed, which is why the canoeists look down on us.
So it is inevitable that as SUP progresses now, the elites will develop some very strange-looking techniques that allow you to get closer and closer to the sitting or keeling position, and use ever shorter paddles. It’s going to end up looking as ridiculous as competitive walking does (to most people’s eyes), and as impossible to do as Olympic canoe, where unless you have started before your teens you are pretty much never going to be able to do it.
But this was predicted by Jim Terrell years ago and we’ve been over it a million times.
It’s interesting however that it’s still the ocean athletes who are still dominating SUP racing - even in flat water. One of the predictions from years ago has not yet come true - which was that soon the top SUP racers would all come from an inland (flat) water background (the Gorge doesn’t really count!), like younger versions of Larry Cain. But that hasn’t happened yet. Maybe the skills learnt in choppy waters translate better to flat water than vice-versa. Or maybe it’s that pure flat water is boring compared to the ocean: it’s hard to motivate yourself for a 5-hour training paddle in the same old bit of flat water, but the same bit of ocean changes from day to day so gives greater variety of activity.
The other thing is that these ocean athletes do not have the same kind of obsessive commitment to things like diet and training regimen that you’ll get in eg. rowing and other inland flat water paddle sports. It’s a culture thing: the ocean athletes will often spend 8-9 hours a day on the water so just bolt down whatever food is to hand and then get out there again because they are enjoying it so much. Whereas competitive rowers are all about ergo machines, weighing scales, strict training regimens and optimising every mouthful they eat. It’s a very different mentality. I thought that by now the “training robots” (as ukgm referred to himself) would have taken over. But it is nowhere close to happening yet. It is interesting to speculate why. Maybe it’s all about marketing: ocean athletes in bikinis surfing raceboards on pristine island waves somewhere hot is an easier and more profitable marketing tool than some sweaty training robot in a drysuit on a muddy river in the rainy, dreary UK midlands, or in the arse end of Germany somewhere miles from the sea :) So the ocean brands still dominate the market at the top end, and the athletes who practice a panoply of their sports, like Kai, get all the money to travel to races etc.
Maybe it will be this that will also slow the development of the stranger-looking future techniques, where SUPers will crouch like they are laying eggs and use 2ft long paddles, using a stroke that would put 99% of the population in traction. That stroke is not going to look too good on Instagram next to a pic of Kai on a 100ft wave. Maybe the marketing BS is actually going to slow the progression of SUP into a weird pastime for a few training obsessive who have no shame.
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1) Yeah, I handled one of Mo Freitas’s paddles and it was too short for me - and he is a bit taller than me.
2) You only need to try paddling on your knees to see the advantage of being closer to the water.
3) ....where unless you have started before your teens you are pretty much never going to be able to do it.
4) ..like younger versions of Larry Cain. But that hasn’t happened yet. it’s hard to motivate yourself for a 5-hour training paddle in the same old bit of flat water, but the same bit of ocean changes from day to day so gives greater variety of activity. The other thing is that these ocean athletes do not have the same kind of obsessive commitment to things like diet and training regimen that you’ll get in eg. rowing and other inland flat water paddle sports. Competitive rowers are all about ergo machines, weighing scales, strict training regimens and optimising every mouthful they eat. It’s a very different mentality. I thought that by now the “training robots” (as ukgm referred to himself) would have taken over.
1) I actually experimented with this back in the spring but I found it hard to compensate my technique for the loss of reach. It also sent me to the chiropractors....
2) ..... plus lower probable aerodynamic drag and a fractional increase in stability. It makes a lot of sense but I suspect this will widen the gap between recreational paddlers, elites and guys like me caught between the two.
3) This really came home to roost for me this year. When you see 16yr olds like Starboard UK's Ben Pye doing a downwind race on a 21.5 Starboard Sprint, well, I realised that it was time to diversify my athletic stock as I knew upskilling was eventually coming but I'm not hanging around in SUP much longer to try and contend with it.
4) I think the ICF worlds might start to create its own group of athletes or some canoeing crossover. However, at this moment in time my feelings are that the sport has no incentive for good athletes to come across from other disciplines as there is no Olympics, no decent prizemoney, no governance and that the training tools that create such people (such as power meters) are not in place yet. It will remain a lifestyle sport in the manner you described.
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It’s interesting however that it’s still the ocean athletes who are still dominating SUP racing - even in flat water. One of the predictions from years ago has not yet come true - which was that soon the top SUP racers would all come from an inland (flat) water background (the Gorge doesn’t really count!), like younger versions of Larry Cain. But that hasn’t happened yet. Maybe the skills learnt in choppy waters translate better to flat water than vice-versa. Or maybe it’s that pure flat water is boring compared to the ocean: it’s hard to motivate yourself for a 5-hour training paddle in the same old bit of flat water, but the same bit of ocean changes from day to day so gives greater variety of activity.
I have to give a shout out to Lina Augaitis who came from Ottawa Canada (inland) and became the fastest female flat water SUP paddler in the world, and she was also winning rough ocean races against the very best before taking time out to start a family.
I think there are many reasons for inland paddlers not having success large scale and you mentioned one being water culture with oceans, which is huge. I liken it to hockey in Canada as around 50% of all players in the professional NHL league are Canadian, and it has much to do with hockey culture and development beginning at a very young age. Many people here begin skating and playing hockey before they are 5 years old, and it's very similar to ocean athletes in primarily warmer climates learning board sports at very young ages and sticking with it. Even starting at older ages, the amount of water time would aid greatly in becoming proficient.
As it gets colder and winter sets in, participation in outdoor paddling falls off dramatically in northern climates (major in Canada), even in areas where the water doesn't freeze. Training alternatives help, but it takes absolute commitment, travelling and financial backing to take it to the next level, which is very rare here. Another probable reason is population close to ocean environments. More people generally live closer to the coasts, and fewer people generally live far inland, and throw in the ocean culture with a higher level of participation with SUP, beginning with other board sports typically starting at a younger age, and the probability for success would seemingly be much higher. I know of exactly one paddler in the entire region where I live who enters races somewhat consistently and he is pushing 40, and we are surrounded by water. The other people around here who enter races go into the touring or recreational classes, and the closer you get to the coast, the bigger the cities and there are far more racers. The United States Dwarfs Canada exponentially for racer participation.
As far as paddling conditions out here go? I think you need to come take a look for yourself ;) The Great Lakes are inland seas with conditions that can have epic storms and produce very large swells. The conditions where I live are highly variable and a zoner mentioned in another thread the value of having a rough water board for paddling on Mountain Lakes, as his conditions change so quickly. Same deal where I live. It can go from glass to thigh high+ in a matter of minutes, and consistent wind can produce good sized swell. It gets sloppy with cliff backwash in many areas, some areas on the lakes have current, and each lake seems to have it's own attitude and characteristics that present different challenges. So, while the lakes out here may not have the true ocean ferocity found in some areas around the world, elite paddlers can be, and are challenged in the conditions that get whipped up here. There is also a wide, deep river right beside me that always offers variable conditions and is never truly flat in multiple areas, with boils, whirlpools, eddy's and wave trains that can be run on composite boards without risking damage. I've seen some very experienced paddlers from the coast go swimming during a race that used to be run down the Columbia here. Fun times for sure.
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Starboard launched their 2019 range of Facebook today. One my local stockists is also already advertising an allstar in a 22.5 width. I can’t tell much from either but Starboard started their advert by saying the new boards are both faster and more stable [groan.....]
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Starboard launched their 2019 range of Facebook today. One my local stockists is also already advertising an allstar in a 22.5 width. I can’t tell much from either but Starboard started their advert by saying the new boards are both faster and more stable [groan.....]
But do they still have Starboard’s famed porpoise-power? :)
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Starboard launched their 2019 range of Facebook today. One my local stockists is also already advertising an allstar in a 22.5 width. I can’t tell much from either but Starboard started their advert by saying the new boards are both faster and more stable [groan.....]
But do they still have Starboard’s famed porpoise-power? :)
Upgraded to full dolphin-power.
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"Starboard started their advert by saying the new boards are both faster and more stable [groan.....]"
Obviously.
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I'm seeing stars.
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Starboard launched their 2019 range of Facebook today. One my local stockists is also already advertising an allstar in a 22.5 width. I can’t tell much from either but Starboard started their advert by saying the new boards are both faster and more stable [groan.....]
But do they still have Starboard’s famed porpoise-power? :)
Upgraded to full dolphin-power.
Excellent.
I heard a rumour that for 2019 they will be laying the biaxial cloth at 60 degrees to the meridian, interspersing it with 4D phased carbon stringers to create a catnip matrix, which encourages hull torsion oscillation that mimics the natural movement of sea mammals. So maybe that is what you are referring to. It’s an exciting innovation, and the boards are now getting so lifelike that I look forward to the day when they start talking to each other. Or maybe even mating: That sure would save me a few dollars in new boards.
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Or maybe even mating: That sure would save me a few dollars in new boards.
just don't stay on the board while this is taking place.
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I couldn't say anything publicly at the time but I'd had Starboards catalogue to comment on for a few days. Full details here:
https://www.supboardermag.com/2018/07/19/our-thoughts-on-the-2019-starboard-race-board-range/
Evolution rather than revolution methinks.
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Or maybe even mating: That sure would save me a few dollars in new boards.
just don't stay on the board while this is taking place.
Ah yes, thank you for the warning. However, Starboard’s garish graphics are sufficient enough contraception for me not to have to worry.
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I'm liking the new stars but I need to test them 1st before making an assumption.
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Did anyone see the new 2019 Naish Maliko?
https://www.naishsurfing.com/product/maliko-140-x26-pro-sandwich-carbon-stringer/
Look same as last year, maybe some minor modification to the nose but more changes in construction
it seems. Graphics are Heinous imo.
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Did anyone see the new 2019 Naish Maliko?
https://www.naishsurfing.com/product/maliko-140-x26-pro-sandwich-carbon-stringer/
Look same as last year, maybe some minor modification to the nose but more changes in construction
it seems. Graphics are Heinous imo.
I was asking the OZ distributor about the changes in another forum but have not received an answer yet. I am glad they have not made significant changes to a successful design. On the other hand it also mean that more people will keep their board instead of upgrading so less on the used market......
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Did anyone see the new 2019 Naish Maliko?
https://www.naishsurfing.com/product/maliko-140-x26-pro-sandwich-carbon-stringer/
Look same as last year, maybe some minor modification to the nose but more changes in construction
it seems. Graphics are Heinous imo.
I think they are the same but with colourway changes. The grey of the Maliko looks awful. It's like someone got a can of spray primer out and threw it all over the board. Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market and what they have is good enough for the market size on offer.
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Did anyone see the new 2019 Naish Maliko?
https://www.naishsurfing.com/product/maliko-140-x26-pro-sandwich-carbon-stringer/
Look same as last year, maybe some minor modification to the nose but more changes in construction
it seems. Graphics are Heinous imo.
I think they are the same but with colourway changes. The grey of the Maliko looks awful. It's like someone got a can of spray primer out and threw it all over the board. Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market and what they have is good enough for the market size on offer.
Considering the effort they used to go through to make the boards look good thats a plausible assumption. The paint scheme on this one is a bit of a WTF to me, it just looks weird and completely uninspired.
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^ yep. weird and inspired.
Looks very JP btw. Which is even weirder.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
To be honest, I’m not against brands finally getting away from the ridiculous 12 month r&d and launch cycle.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
I think you got it right the first time around with a 16' Maliko style board. When/if come the time to change either of my boards (Vapor and/or AceGt) that is likely the route I would follow shamelessly with your approval using your plans and a custom builder.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
I think you got it right the first time around with a 16' Maliko style board. When/if come the time to change either of my boards (Vapor and/or AceGt) that is likely the route I would follow shamelessly with your approval using your plans and a custom builder.
You're welcome to it anytime.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
Even the widths have been retained at 24, 26 & 28. Compared to fanatic and starboard, that's starting to appear old school.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
Even the widths have been retained at 24, 26 & 28. Compared to fanatic and starboard, that's starting to appear old school.
Compared to fanatic and starboard, that's starting to appear old school reassuring.
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in away i'm kind glad they didn't f*ck with the shape. This board just feel right to me and
I didn't feel there is anything I wanted to change about it which is very untypical for me.
But if there was ever a chance I was to buy this board, these colors pretty much killed it.
Two years in a row like this suggests to me that Naish have given up on the race market...
Your assumption make sense especially after I've discovered Naish axed their presence in
Maui. Both storefront and warehouse were shutdown.
I guess I'd better copy the design to Shape3D just in case I'll ever want to come back
to a 14 footer.
Even the widths have been retained at 24, 26 & 28. Compared to fanatic and starboard, that's starting to appear old school.
I can’t see Manca Notar and Annie Reikart competing on 24” wide Maliko, so I assume that Naish have given up on the idea of their pros paddling production boards. Expect to see the elites on 21.5” wide customs in the new easy-to-copy Naish livery for next season’s races...
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I think you got it right the first time around with a 16' Maliko style board. When/if come the time to change either of my boards (Vapor and/or AceGt) that is likely the route I would follow shamelessly with your approval using your plans and a custom builder.
You're welcome to it anytime.
[/quote]
Cheers
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does anyone truly know that the new Maliko overall shape has change from 2018?
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I saw a 404 dugout other day, Mt ching was on it and did anyone seen it?
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does anyone truly know that the new Maliko overall shape has change from 2018?
Judging by the 3D rendering on their website and the exactly the same volume for the shape
it safe to say the shape hasn't changed.
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I had a look at the 3D bottom and it looks like it has some concave and also looks like they went back to 2017 bottom.
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2019 Fanatic obviously have the new Strike, the Falcon (which is now a clog) and finally the new 'Blitz'.
https://www.facebook.com/fanaticsupaustralia/
Ah, “The Blitz”... there’s a name associated with happy memories in the UK.
Coming up for 2020 from Fanatic, the new model called “Dunkirk”...
Here in Melbourne, we have a football team known as the Bombers, who, when they aren't receiving suspensions from WADA for institutionalized doping, are known to enter the stadium in home games to the sound of a London blitz air raid siren. Classy stuff.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
How certain are you that Starboard team riders will compete in the ICF worlds? If you listen to ISA shill Caspar Steinfath, none of the world's top athletes have any interest in attending the ICF event. But I guess he would say that, wouldn't he?
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
How certain are you that Starboard team riders will compete in the ICF worlds? If you listen to ISA shill Caspar Steinfath, none of the world's top athletes have any interest in attending the ICF event. But I guess he would say that, wouldn't he?
It's not they don't want to, it's that many of them are formally contracted to the ISA and have to shun the ICF. That's the only problem the ICF has - a championship is only as legitimate as the quality of athletes attending it. If the ICF doesn't attract some of the names, it won't get the traction. However, I think they've been smart by having it as an open entry because if it starts pulling in 300 athletes and becomes a festival in itself, that inclusivity will work well for their PR and legitimacy.
For what its worth, I do know of some domestic level team paddlers are planning on going. I couldn't this year due to a date clash with a family holiday but I probably will do at some point.
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No word yet on what the Allstar will be doing for next year. My current thoughts are that rather than going back down the team route is that I'll be racing on a knockdown sale 2018 Starboard Sprint in a 23 width or the 2018 Allstar in a 23.5. I was going to go down the Lightsignature road but my little voice says not to..... or at least see how their team riders do at the ICF worlds first on them.
How certain are you that Starboard team riders will compete in the ICF worlds? If you listen to ISA shill Caspar Steinfath, none of the world's top athletes have any interest in attending the ICF event. But I guess he would say that, wouldn't he?
It's not they don't want to, it's that many of them are formally contracted to the ISA and have to shun the ICF. That's the only problem the ICF has - a championship is only as legitimate as the quality of athletes attending it. If the ICF doesn't attract some of the names, it won't get the traction. However, I think they've been smart by having it as an open entry because if it starts pulling in 300 athletes and becomes a festival in itself, that inclusivity will work well for their PR and legitimacy.
For what its worth, I do know of some domestic level team paddlers are planning on going. I couldn't this year due to a date clash with a family holiday but I probably will do at some point.
It appears to offer more suitable conditions for surf racing and downwind than anything the ISA has presented thus far. The great irony of the ISA running SUP races is that they seem to want to push the events towards flat water, hence the counter-intuitive and retrograde step of transforming battle of the paddle into the nondescript "technical racing" just so that they could relegate the events to inland lakes.
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The formats of the races are heavily dictated by weather. Let’s see what the ICF do with their formats if they don’t get wind or waves. The ISA have been generally pragmatic about hedging their bets for this reason.
In the UK, as soon as British Canoeing offered the SUP community some minor role in the organisation, or affiliation, many of the guys in the business immediately got down on their knees and asked British Canoeing what they would like to put in their mouths, gratis.
I guess it is a sign that the ISA has failed to make sufficient inroads into the UK SUP community.
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The formats of the races are heavily dictated by weather. Let’s see what the ICF do with their formats if they don’t get wind or waves. The ISA have been generally pragmatic about hedging their bets for this reason.
In the UK, as soon as British Canoeing offered the SUP community some minor role in the organisation, or affiliation, many of the guys in the business immediately got down on their knees and asked British Canoeing what they would like to put in their mouths, gratis.
I guess it is a sign that the ISA has failed to make sufficient inroads into the UK SUP community.
As far as the uk went, it wasn’t that british canoeing did more so much but more so that surfing England did nothing. They hadn’t really organised a good race in years and left what races we had to informal organisers such as uksup to manage and run. Even the national team qualifiers were run on goodwill in their name by others. It seemed this was due to their interests being mainly surfing based and apathetic.
One thing I will say is odd though and that’s the ICF limiting the inflatable board class lengths to 12’6 when everything else is up to 14ft.
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Lilos only 12-6? I didn’t know that. That makes NO sense, since the only argument for 12-6 that does make sense is the travel logistics thing, and inflatables solve that. In fact I was hoping that there would be unlimited class inflatables for overseas races. Imagine how the logistics of doing the M2O would change if you could carry your board on your back, and take it normal luggage on the plane over. Sadly however, there seems instead to be a race to the bottom with iSUPs right now, not to the top.
I was out surfing my UL board today, about a mile offshore, at a rippy spot. Lovely session, with the place to myself. Some guy on an all round inflatable paddled out, got about half way and I could see that he was getting bounced around all over the place. He turned around and gave up. Wise man. Even if he had made it out he’s have caught nothing - waves too fat and awkward. But I was having nightmares problem. Inflatables have a very long way to go. It’s such a shame that innovations from ULI years ago, like the wiki rail, haven’t been extended and developed by other brands. For a moment there it looked like inflatable design might be going somewhere. I’ve got an ULI from about 10 years ago. The fins on it are far better than those on the new Starboard iSUP I just got. There’s progress for ya...
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Check out these inflatables.
I rode one in Thailand..... bottom turns and lip smacks are possible.
They really do work.
I have ridden other inflatables and IMO, it was not really surfing.... it was just a challenge to see if I could make a wave.
These are different and worth a look.
This video is a "kickstarter" vid.... I don't know if Stefan is still funding or if he is in operation.... but I do know they work pretty well for an inflatable. Definitely an interesting approach.
No, I do not have any connection with the company.... I just like Stefan and his product.
http://vimeo.com/247146564
Website:
https://www.tripstix.de/
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New Model from NSP - Carolina. This is looking like a step in a good direction.
The Rest is pretty much the same.
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Check out these inflatables.
I rode one in Thailand..... bottom turns and lip smacks are possible.
They really do work.
I have ridden other inflatables and IMO, it was not really surfing.... it was just a challenge to see if I could make a wave.
These are different and worth a look.
This video is a "kickstarter" vid.... I don't know if Stefan is still funding or if he is in operation.... but I do know they work pretty well for an inflatable. Definitely an interesting approach.
No, I do not have any connection with the company.... I just like Stefan and his product.
http://vimeo.com/247146564
Website:
https://www.tripstix.de/
This one looks truly interesting. I like it being unsinkable. ;D Would make crossing large lakes (especially where you can find tree trunks with sharp edges from time to time) alone on an inflatable less intimidating.
It seems that they've also been working on an inflatable race board. I hope it does come out some day.
BTW, is their factory Thailand-based?
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I agree burchas, looks good on paper and probably one of best dugout board available but choose your width carefully and a demo would be good if you can.
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If was to buy this board, the only width I would consider is the 25 3/4 if I'm to use it
in its intended conditions. It's good to see they didn't go kookoo on the volume.
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If was to buy this board, the only width I would consider is the 25 3/4 if I'm to use it
in its intended conditions. It's good to see they didn't go kookoo on the volume.
And a 27" or about would not go amiss. Like the 2017 Ace that came in 27" and is supposed to be very good.
But of course it would likely not make sense for a racer target demographic. How many would paddle a less than sexy 27" clog.....outside of me I guess.
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Any rumors about the 2019 models of SIC Maui? I read in another thread that Mark Raaphorst is no longer with the company (or is he?). Are they going to hire another shaper to come up with something new?
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Any rumors about the 2019 models of SIC Maui? I read in another thread that Mark Raaphorst is no longer with the company (or is he?). Are they going to hire another shaper to come up with something new?
There were a few new SIC models introduced at the Outdoor Retailer last week. I'm pretty sure Mark is still with SIC, haven't heard anything contrary to that, but I think he also has a new Foil brand: The Flying Dutchman.
New models include a Okeanus (from what I understand it's a touring version of the RS), the Sonic (another touring board, at an entry price with Bic technology), RS inflatable models an all-round board that I don't know the name (only saw some side views, but it has a longboard shape). Also, I think there will be a production RS 14 x 21.5
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nice SIC boards
I think its time for SIC to build a dugout ;)
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Any rumors about the 2019 models of SIC Maui? I read in another thread that Mark Raaphorst is no longer with the company (or is he?). Are they going to hire another shaper to come up with something new?
There were a few new SIC models introduced at the Outdoor Retailer last week. I'm pretty sure Mark is still with SIC, haven't heard anything contrary to that, but I think he also has a new Foil brand: The Flying Dutchman.
New models include a Okeanus (from what I understand it's a touring version of the RS), the Sonic (another touring board, at an entry price with Bic technology), RS inflatable models an all-round board that I don't know the name (only saw some side views, but it has a longboard shape). Also, I think there will be a production RS 14 x 21.5
Nice photos, thanks! The deck of Okeanus looks more recessed than that of RS. Not bad as a touring version. ;D
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It’s such a shame that SIC stopped making the 11-11 Recon. One of those boards in a light but tough construction would hit the mark for a lot of (bigger) folk: you could race it in the rec class in the morning, take it and the dog for a lunchtime cruise in the afternoon, and then finish off with a sunset surf on it in the evening. The new SIC surf/all-round are either too short or too wide (or both) for me to be interested. But clearly there must be a big market out there somewhere for 34” wide boards.
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Tried out 6 boards from One. The best of the bunch was the 17'11x25 UL dugout by a long shot. Could even use that board as a single quiver daily driver. Steering was spot on and the width felt stable like 28. Was really nice with a slender nose -> much better than wide splash boof designs. As well felt much faster than the tubby surf nosed Bullet 17.4 paddling on flat. Very nice for its design parameters.
Also tried the 24 Edge 2.0 which has a triple concave like my 23 All Star. Felt very stable for a 24. Was the next best board for me. But speed was slower than my AS. Def could feel the drag and a bit less glide.
Storm was nice as well as the Evo. Pro versions were all very stable at 25. Felt better to me than the fat Ace boof. At this width -> drag felt pretty high. Overall One has some very nice stable designs. Narrowest board available was the 24 -> but could see the 25s being very user friendly for a lot of paddlers.
http://www.onestanduppaddle.com/boards%20page/Unlimited
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^
I had a short paddle on the One Evo Pro 25" along with the 2016 and 2017 Starboard Allstars in 24.5" and 25" widths recently.
While both Starboards are surprisingly stable at 25", the Pro was certainly more stable than both the 2016 and 2017 Allstar. No revelation that the dug out design of the Pro would be more stable than the Allstars, but it was just very comfortable to paddle overall, and the stability carries through to the tail. I would say the Evo Pro easily felt as stable, if not more so than my Evo 26" for both primary and secondary stability.
I wasn't overly interested in owning one of the newer dug out designs until I paddled the Pro. Getting back in doesn't look fun at all after you get dumped though. I would be interested in the 27" wide as an all conditions distance cruiser and add tie downs front and rear.
The sneak peek of the new touring board from SIC looks good too and I want to try to the 26 and 28" widths for the RS.
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^
I had a short paddle on the One Evo Pro 25" along with the 2016 and 2017 Starboard Allstars in 24.5" and 25" widths recently.
While both Starboards are surprisingly stable at 25", the Pro was certainly more stable than both the 2016 and 2017 Allstar. No revelation that the dug out design of the Pro would be more stable than the Allstars, but it was just very comfortable to paddle overall, and the stability carries through to the tail. I would say the Evo Pro easily felt as stable, if not more so than my Evo 26" for both primary and secondary stability.
I wasn't overly interested in owning one of the newer dug out designs until I paddled the Pro. Getting back in doesn't look fun at all after you get dumped though. I would be interested in the 27" wide as an all conditions distance cruiser and add tie downs front and rear.
The sneak peek of the new touring board from SIC looks good too and I want to try to the 26 and 28" widths for the RS.
Hey Mel, you should consider talking to Norm about the Sunova touring board that he has been working on with them. If somebody can come up with a fast touring board, it would be Norm for sure. I am also planning to try one when time allows.
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A nice touring board might be that One UL in 26. Would suspect that to be super stable. Basically a canoe SUP with toe steering. Could load a huge amount in that dugout. The 25 UL paddled like a dream on flat for a full out DW dugout design. Liked the feel so much -> took it out a couple of times just to make sure. Glide was much more than expected and did not feel splashy.
Problem for us would be loading and storage. These dugouts are getting to be quite huge and cumbersome to move around. Tough to stack a board like that for group shuttles. Stepping forward and back was easy and stable. Out of the Sunova SB and One -> each dugout has a different feel.