Standup Zone Forum
General => The Shape Shack => Topic started by: GlideMarko on February 14, 2018, 03:08:21 AM
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Any comments if would work (volume/design/overall performance wise) if I would get used flat deck all-rounder (exp.404 V3, boga typhoon), cut/open top whole length and adding nose volume, side walls and adding tail volume by closing it (like One SUP EVO pro or Infinity downtown dug out) to create dug out all-rounder. Off course with some drain holes.
Reason: this way I would avoid making new rocker and bottom design, due to lack of knowledge.
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To be clear, you are saying take a board like pictured below and convert it to a sunken deck.
When I hear 'all around' I think old school longboard shape...
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U r correct... something like this.
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How are your glassing skills, tools and work space? That's a lot of board and a very complex shape to glass with the dugout.
Are you not near a CNC? I'd say it'd be easier to start fresh from a cut blank if you can. Reshapes are hard work in my experience. Personally, I'll never do one again. I can build from scratch faster and easier myself. Same price too once you buy the donor and supplies in most cases I'd bet.
You sure you don't want a nice 6'0" shortboard? ;)
But as is the way of the shape shack, good luck and post pics. We will be with you all the way if you take it on.
Tall Dude, you wanna speak to this one? I've never tackled a board this big.
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If you know how to glass the hardest part will probably be shaping. Keeping the standing area level and symmetrical is harder than it sounds.
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don't waste your time it will cost far more and look twice as bad as if you start from scratch. If you can get a cnc blank cut and if not you can get the rocker and out line cut very accurately just using some templates. The hardest part is the glassing so if you are fine with that you shouldn't have to many problems
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My buddy dug out his custom Hovie board and it worked amazing, but that's only because it was excessively thick to begin with, and he didn't have to add any additional volume to the rails or nose.
Some others in my area have dug two miniature wells, just the size of each foot, where they normally stand. No drain holes or anything since it's such a small volume it doesn't really matter if they fill with water. It looks wacky but it supposedly works great, as long as you don't need to stand in an offset stance or something. Worth a try if you don't care about butchering the board.
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OK. 1st step... board purchased. It's 2015 Boga Typhoon Team 14x25,5. The board is 'well used' and took me 2h to repair the dings so butchering it wont hurt so much.
I also did 100km this week with it and I like the glide and its pretty quick considering its width and plenty of stability for any chop:
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/2655477835
Step 2: So, I talk to a guy who will do the reshape and plan is to cut open the whole top side with knife na than cut foam with hot wire for accuracy of standing area. Than adding drainage tubes. After, adding new nose and tail volume and side walls. Finally glassing.
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Do it. Resurrecting an older, less appealing board is great for the environment and expands your design knowledge. A little personal R & D is educational and rewarding. I just picked up an old unlimited that had a blown out rail from being left in the sun. Someone did a fugly bad repair on it, so no one had paddled it for the past few years. I rescued it, and it's going to get a full makeover. I'm going to do a nose job, a little liposuction, and tighten up the tail. Then a full body spray, for a brand new look. She's going to be sexier than ever, and I'll be excited to go paddling on my newly upgraded rocket ship:)
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Ok, I decided to redesign the board to keep my feet dry in the winter in Alp’s lake. It’s quite fast and very stable board and not just well used, but more like abused and needs repair anyway. The only issue I have is how to design the water drainage. These are the options I thought of:
1. Top drawing – deck design similar to 2018 SB sprint or 2018 whiplash (infinity) whereas first half of the deck is somewhat horizontal to the waterline and second half inclined to the top of the rail. Drain holes are placed at the sides of the first half of the deck (arrow with w). I paddled both these board yesterday and the water came to the standing are when leaning to the side making my feet wet.
2. Mid drawing – deck similar to 2017 SB sprint whereas the whole length of the deck is tilted toward tail allowing water to drain at the tail. I would add would at the tail leaving 1cm in between for the whole width of the tail allowing water drainage, but also stop behind wave to get into the deck. The mail concern with this design is to have enough decline toward the tail and not get tail to thin (second pic – w line) between bottom and deck
3. Bottom drawing – deck design similar to 2018 downtown (infinity) somehow deck horizontal to the waterline with tail closing with drain holes on the sides.
4. Not at the picture – similar to no.2- without added tail volume – just opened tail with high rails.
Any thoughts?
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You definitely want the water to be able to drain out the back if you are going to be taking this anywhere near rough water. If you are in an Ace for instance, and you get flooding over the nose and into the deck, it can take a couple of minutes at least to drain, during which time you are stationary, standing in a bird bath. A real big flush stops you dead in your tracks and causes instability. But if the water can flow out of the back it clears much quicker, especially if you keep paddling. The Mistral Equinox was based on the Ace design but addressed this issue and it made a huge difference if you are a coastal paddler.
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It's totally impractical, so of course you should do it. If there are any OC's in your area take a look at their bailing system. They use a little NACA style duct to suck the water out. Draining out the back is a good idea as well though obviously it limits how deep your dugout can be. Non-draining footwells is a bad idea--not only are your feet trapped in a single position but even "low" volume is at least a few liters per well. Probably ten pounds per well. Not the fifty pounds of a filled Ace, but still plenty.
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Have fun with your dugout project, but look forward instead to having fun with it in summer and autumn.
Your dugout will end up with water in it. Especially without high sidewalls. No matter how effective at getting water out your drains are your feet will be wet every now and again.
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Certainly minimizing the cut out areas make sense, but remember any of the deck areas you cut away weakens the standing area re. flex. The high sides on the production dugout boards are there for stiffening things. Perhaps consider stiffening strips on the top side of the rails.
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Yeah because of the rocker etc it looks like you will limited on doing a full open rear flush Sprint design. The 1cm entire tail width is an interesting concept. Will be interesting to see what you come up with. But would make sure the standing area is beefed up enough to take the loads static and dynamic. No doubt impractical but you will probs learn a lot.
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Big project :o
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so it began... bye Boga
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Yeah! Here we go.
But don’t fool yourself that you’re keeping those plugs. ;)
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Awesome ;D
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Of course plugs going out. It was just first cut to dry out the board.
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Side walls added
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Your workspace is too neat. Could you come help me clean up mine? Looks like a good start. I love nutty projects.
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Lets focus on a board itself? haha ;)
well, the workshop is not mine as I'm only 'mastermind' for this project (not that my basement woodshop looks any cleaner :P). The guy who owns the workshop and is my great source for producing my nutty projects'' is simply to busy to clean, but he's master of building carbon sailboats. Its interesting seeing vacuum lamination of 62ft carbon sailboat in one piece with 900kg (2000lbs) of epoxy in on time!
Anyway, for drainage, I decided to with the option whereas the whole length of the deck is tilted toward tail allowing water to drain at the tail and adding block to close last 40cm of a tail leaving 2cm in between for the whole width of the tail allowing water drain.
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Funny i have a 25x14 2012 Ace in my back yard it has not seen the water in a while since i started paddling a all star or sic. Things i didn't like were getting back on it or in it in the wind, the drains never seemed to keep up, paddling in the surf it would fill up punching through a wave not drain out fast keeping me in the surf longer, not as easy to move around on the board in surf and swell but it is fun to paddle. I would have sold you that cheap. But i am interested in your build i have a old carbon unlimited Bark i cant seem to part with and its heavy i have always thought of making it a dug out. Good Luck.
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I was just teasing you man. ;)
Love the way it’s coming together. I’d also love to see a master boat builder work. I can’t imag that big of a pour. Wow.
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62ft sail boat carbon vacuum wrap
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Back to board project.. rough top shaping is done. Still needed side walls filled and shaped.
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Side walls filled. Now, fine sanding...
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Looking nice!
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Carbon layer in on... the bottom still needs repair- lots of dings and adding thinnest glass layer to stiffen the board.
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Project continues...
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Tail volume will be added later with 'horizontal tail drainage'
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first test in its 'natural habitat' ;)
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drainage test:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkpyNa3RxXU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sWunhSzG9Q&pbjreload=10
It works well- the deck is inclined enough to drain water fast enough. Now, tail volume will be added.
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Why would you add that big block? The only way it will add buoyancy is if it's under water.
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Why would you add that big block? The only way it will add buoyancy is if it's under water.
Since the board dynamically pitches from nose to tail when you’re paddling hard, that block would help resist the tail being pulled down and creating drag or creating a poor release.
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Why would you add that big block? The only way it will add buoyancy is if it's under water.
Since the board dynamically pitches from nose to tail when you’re paddling hard, that block would help resist the tail being pulled down and creating drag or creating a poor release.
well, for my level of paddling... i will go with more simple answer: Because I want that block as it was planned. Once its finished, I will post a video hows paddling- let say at 10,5km/h to see how it paddles&reacts at bit faster speed.