Standup Zone Forum
Stand Up Paddle => SUP General => Topic started by: stoneaxe on September 11, 2017, 07:14:32 AM
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Fin that is....
I've surfed my Foote with thrusters in it from day one. I rarely play with fins much...if it feels good don't screw with it has been the mindset. What a dope!
Great sessions over the weekend. Newport (RI) was pumping with head+ sets and clean conditions. 5 hours on Saturday in some faster longer period waves that we usually get. I found I was missing some waves that I thought for sure I was going to make. Considered taking the thrusters out but never got around to it.
Sunday morning the swell has dropped but still some chest to head sets, still clean and long period. Surfed an hour and decided to pull out the thrusters to see how it felt. I was blown away..... 8)
Faster...much easier paddle in, missing less even though my arms were getting tired. And I was making it around sections that were closing on me before I took them out.
Looser.....tail moving around much easier, had to be careful not to turn too far while going for a wave. The added responsiveness felt great though and I quickly got used to it.
Performance.....faster and looser translated to faster more fun turns. I did not miss the thrusters at all and if anything it seemed like I was carving harder with the added speed. I never thought taking the thrusters out would make this much difference. Now I'm kind of pissed at myself that I haven't done it earlier.
I've always felt like a newb at some level because in the past when I have played with fins (for surfing) I never really noticed much of a change. I just figured I wasn't good enough to sense it. Does this mean I'm no longer a newbie?.... ;D ::) now I need to try new fins in all my boards..... :)
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I hear ya Bob. I've messed with as many options as my fin collection would allow on all my boards. My long green hammer is single and gonna stay there. Adding anymore fin to it makes is surf like the butt is stuck. My 9-6 stoke gets surfed as quad and used as a coastal cruiser as a single. I never surf anything as a thruster or 2+1, and that's the only set up my son and wife like. To each his own, and never cease experimentation.
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Yeah Stoney, less fins = less drag = more speed. Try just pulling out your center fin and ride the sidebites. The board will be faster and you can really slide that tail around, fun. Even switching to smaller fins will make a noticeable difference in speed. Peace.
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I was really surprised how much it changed and not just for the surfing. Even paddling back out was better...transition from coming out of a wave and paddling back out was faster...one stroke to turn 180 deg, instead of the more normal (for me) 2 or 3, better speed paddling back out and less slow down going up and over the whitewater. Wish I had taken them out on Saturday when the paddle out was challenging.
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@stoneaxe
I like to experiment with fins too. And you know I like details and I am always curious.
When you went single fin with your Foote; was your single fin all the way back in the fin box towards the tail, in the middle of the fin box or was the fin placed all the way in the front of the fin box towards the nose? I'm guessing all the way forward or in the middle of the fin box.
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Question; how big was the single fin that you were running when you had thrusters in? If it was a 2+1 setup, where you have a fairly large (5" or bigger") trailing fin with thrusters as well, that to me is the stiffest combination; just too much fin area fighting over whether the board is going to turn around the center fin or the side bites. As you said, if there is a large center fin, I don't like confusing the issue with sidebites. Like someone else mentioned, also try going with some large (5") thrusters, and a really small center fin (3.5 to 3.75"). It is another way to get away from too much fin area and fin conflict, but now the side fins are dominant with just a tiny center fin for minimal tracking.
Glad you are having fun playing with fins.
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Timely post stone. I'm looking at a fairly small forecast for this coming weekend and was thinking of surfing my longboard with a single 6.25" fin. I've only surfed it as a 2+1 so far. A guy I know surfs almost the same longboard as me (he's a stronger surfer) and only surfs it as a quad (in big conditions) or a single fin (in smaller stuff). I'm kind of pumped to give a single a try.
My smaller boards are all quads.
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I guess if your board is 10 ft plus then a smallish single eg 6 to 7 inches is going to really loosen things off but doubt you will get up to the nose for long. Depends what you want to do.
Singles feel fast and clean but I quite like having small sides and a 7 to 8 inch centre fin for everyday stuff.
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I wore out the grubscrews on my Foote 10'4" swapping out fins. I use it as a single probably half the time, with a little 4" dolphin. Very fun. Generally I use a 5" center and 2.5" thrusters, but I tried it as a twin fin with 4" thrusters (nah) and tried a big center fin for noseriding--a Jimmy Lewis that I think came from an old 11er--huge fin, probably longer than 12".
I can noseride the 10'4" with thruster fairly well. You have to stall the shit out of it before you head to the nose to really get past the logo. Most of my "noserides" are casual, finding myself fairly far forward near the end of a ride and just going further. When I do it on purpose I cross-step, and my odd technique is to start cross-stepping froward by stepping back, with kind of automatically stalls the board if I start slow and lean back a little. I step back with my front foot to make the first cross a short step. If I start from a surfing stance the first step is a bit long and uncontrolled.
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Use to ride single 9" on the 14ft but since I got the 10' I kinda like the feeling of 2 + 1 fins. I'm still using the 9" as centre fin with side bites and liking it as learning to sup surf.
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I have a few fins to play with but I'm going to have to get some more. In addition to testing variations on the Foote I also want to see how the 8-0 Vec surfs with other fins. Another board where I put a set of fins in...big moon twins...and that's it. I had it built as a 5 fin and have never tried anything else.....i think i mentioned what a dope I am at the beginning of this thread.... ::)
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If you have a wide tailed longboard...like me....I reckon a couple of small sides just gives it a little more grip without tracky feeling.
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Colin M.uses a set of thrusters in his performance lb. The center is slightly smaller.
Harold I. Uses a set of thrusters with a wide center.
Taylor J. Uses a 2 + 1 setup.
Jimmy L. A big 11" in the Black and Blue machine.
Horses for courses! Try and see what works for you.
My King's Croc needed a swept back single. Hobies liked a vertical pivot.
My New Deal Infinity rocks with a Hayden 2 + 1. The sides are really small and the center is not quite seven. All the way forward so the leading edge of the center is in line with the training edges of the sides. Didn't like single fin.
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It felt very different in the big stuff yesterday in a number of ways.
Easier getting out despite the hammering....fighting to get out meant making 10-15 successive chunks of whitewater each getting bigger than the last....friggin exhausting...drop to my knees and breath for 5 mins after the last one.... :P. I seriously think I would not have made it out with thrusters in....the extra drag and push back from each wave would have tipped the scales in mother natures favor.
Easier in....steeper drops with a small wind at my back and better glide....I didn't miss many except when I tried going way way out. And I still caught a few monsters out there. Tuckermans was calling like a siren song but I didn't have the cajones to head out there solo. It was breaking hollow top to bottom and double overhead.
Faster down the line....much better making sections.
Not as snappy in turns at speed, seeing a closeout starting to happen and trying to turn out required more rail and some paddle...got caught a few times.
I definitely want to try a combo of smaller thrusters and smaller center.
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It felt very different in the big stuff yesterday in a number of ways.
Easier getting out despite the hammering....fighting to get out meant making 10-15 successive chunks of whitewater each getting bigger than the last....friggin exhausting...drop to my knees and breath for 5 mins after the last one.... :P. I seriously think I would not have made it out with thrusters in....the extra drag and push back from each wave would have tipped the scales in mother natures favor.
Easier in....steeper drops with a small wind at my back and better glide....I didn't miss many except when I tried going way way out. And I still caught a few monsters out there. Tuckermans was calling like a siren song but I didn't have the cajones to head out there solo. It was breaking hollow top to bottom and double overhead.
Faster down the line....much better making sections.
Not as snappy in turns at speed, seeing a closeout starting to happen and trying to turn out required more rail and some paddle...got caught a few times.
I definitely want to try a combo of smaller thrusters and smaller center.
You still experimenting or staying Single?
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It's been a crappy winter....not many sessions and no experiments...so single for the moment.
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It's been a crappy winter....not many sessions and no experiments...so single for the moment.
I had such a good session on my DW board that I have decided to try the big single again on the longboard SUP again. Definitely something good about having one fin slipping through the water
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVb7i2-wenk
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVb7i2-wenk
You and your big stiffy ;D
I’m doing a whole experimentation again...single to twin to two big sides and small centre fin....just bought some Jackson Close SUP fins ...just need surf!
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Creek, I think you used to have a Striker, would appreciate your thoughts please.... I have the 9'5 and ride it as a 2+1 with a 6" or 7" centre all the way forward. It rides really well that way.
I'm now experimenting with the attached setup - a 9" cutaway with a narrow profile. My thinking is the narrowness will keep the board loose but the depth will help hold the tail down for increased nose-time. Suffering from a severe wave shortage so not making much progress. Ever try a setup like this?
I did try the Striker as a single but it wasn't that great.
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Creek, I think you used to have a Striker, would appreciate your thoughts please.... I have the 9'5 and ride it as a 2+1 with a 6" or 7" centre all the way forward. It rides really well that way.
I'm now experimenting with the attached setup - a 9" cutaway with a narrow profile. My thinking is the narrowness will keep the board loose but the depth will help hold the tail down for increased nose-time. Suffering from a severe wave shortage so not making much progress. Ever try a setup like this?
I did try the Striker as a single but it wasn't that great.
Creek on a Striker......nah....not him. I’ve tried the Striker with a 9 inch dolphin type fin and found it pretty good....really nice actually. Used it with large thruster set up too...goes great. Best all round I found was the two stock sides and a 7 inch single about three quarters of the way up.
But that’s just me....everyone has their own preference.
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I have not ridden a Striker. I was interested in that basic shape as a fun board.
On that type of board, I would run it as a thruster or 2+1.
Cutaway center would be fun and loosen it up.
Coldy... not so fast ;D
I have a 9’6 Sunova Steeze being made as we speak.
It is the same “fun shape” genra.
Interesting cuz its thin and looks like its going to throw around pretty easy for a stable, relaxing board.
I should have it soon, vids will follow.
This will be a good board to test fins on!
Here’s a pic
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I have not ridden a Striker. I was interested in that basic shape as a fun board.
On that type of board, I would run it as a thruster or 2+1.
Cutaway center would be fun and loosen it up.
Coldy... not so fast ;D
I have a 9’6 Sunova Steeze being made as we speak.
It is the same “fun shape” genra.
Interesting cuz its thin and looks like its going to throw around pretty easy for a stable, relaxing board.
I should have it soon, vids will follow.
This will be a good board to test fins on!
Here’s a pic
Looks good Creek......
I run the Striker as a thruster....was good.....I found the board plenty loose. Like with most SUPs the key is whether you have your back foot over the fins....
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I've become convinced that the Foote 10'4" I like so much is a much better board as a single fin. I like the authority of the thrusters, and as a guy who almost always moves his back foot the side I'm turning on the thrusters work well and are controllable. But having tried the board as a single fin and then immediately switched back the thruster setup feels like I'm driving while riding the brakes. Any decrease in power radically slows the board.
With the single, I can outrun closeouts and get back into green water. With the trusters, dropping down to the edge of the whitewater scrubs off all speed. Best of all so far is a stiff, wide based 6.5" Island Fin Designs dolphin shoved full forward. Loose and fast.
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I've become convinced that the Foote 10'4" I like so much is a much better board as a single fin. I like the authority of the thrusters, and as a guy who almost always moves his back foot the side I'm turning on the thrusters work well and are controllable. But having tried the board as a single fin and then immediately switched back the thruster setup feels like I'm driving while riding the brakes. Any decrease in power radically slows the board.
With the single, I can outrun closeouts and get back into green water. With the trusters, dropping down to the edge of the whitewater scrubs off all speed. Best of all so far is a stiff, wide based 6.5" Island Fin Designs dolphin shoved full forward. Loose and fast.
Yup, the speed is noticeable, especially if you have weaker surf
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Big stuff too if you're running to beat a closeout. At least for me. Of course, I tend to drop down the face a lot when I'm running, and that puts me in a lower power region, so a bigger wave becomes lower powered.
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That's exactly why I left it single...still need to play some with variations but much faster as a single.
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I’m also going for x large sides and small centre....mix it up.
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I’m also going for x large sides and small centre....mix it up.
Going rogue!
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I'm going to reverse the foil on my thrusters.....I figure interstellar space craft use hydrogen ram drives for power....ocean water is mostly hydrogen so I should come close to light speed....on a good wave of course..... 8) Not sure but I think if I add a stubby center to that it could form a wormhole.....be awesome for getting around sections.
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Time to dust off the old Turbo Tunnel?
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Anyone playing with one of those new FCS II longboard fins?
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I’m also going for x large sides and small centre....mix it up.
Going rogue!
Ha ha.....the high life living on the edge.