Standup Zone Forum
General => Training, Diet, and Fitness => Topic started by: linter on March 07, 2017, 12:16:03 PM
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I just got hit with it a few days ago and the pain was so intense and unremitting that I went to the emergency room, where they pumped me full of morphine and even that only cut the pain in half more or less. Took a scan and told me I had bulging discs and called it lumbar radiculopathy, which i gather is another name for sciatica.
I'm in San Diego without a network of doctors. The ER people told me to go back home to RI as soon as possible. I told em I didn't want to go quite yet for various reasons. One nice NP, while discussing all this and telling me to leave asap, even got a little misty eyed.
They sent me home with pain killers, muscle relaxers and Ibuprofin 800.
The day I went in, my entire left leg was engaged. It felt like some had cut that leg open and was dragging a knife back and forth through the blood and gore. Man, it hurt, and there was no position I could find that would make it any less.
The day after my ER visit, however, the total leg pain is gone and the only thing that's still there is a ball of pain right above my left bun cheek.
I'm afraid that once all my pills run out, the big pain will return. That being the case, does anyone have any suggestions of what I might do to try to keep that from happening?
Massage? Accu? Chiro? Any home remedies?
As mentioned, I do not have doctors here in SD, so it'd take me forever to find one and then make an appointment. I'm planning on returning to RI in 3 to 5 weeks, but I'd sure love to get this taken care of before then. For one thing, just to get ready to leave, I have to do a lot of packing and heavy lifting, and right now, that'd be pretty much impossible.
fug.
thoughts?
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Hi Linter. I not sure I have any advice but I seem to get that every few years with the last bout just about this time last year. It lasted 2-3 weeks and pretty much ruined a trip. I wasn't to the point of going to an ER but I did get a massage. I can say that helped while being done and for just a bit after, but not a lot of difference overall or for very long. I can't remember if I could trace back the earlier bouts to anything specific but I trace my last one back to a position I was sitting while in a car I napped in while traveling. It seems to have started with that and then hours more in the car on the road after it. I put lots of miles in daily and often so it's not that all itself, it was the nap and how I was specifically.
I haven't tried accupuncture but have gone to a chiro with some of the past bouts and that seemed to help. This last one was the worst and I know exactly what you are talking about with the leg pain and where the pain is at after the leg pain starts to wane. Same side for me too.
I have recently heard that there is some doubt on meniscus surgery being the way to go vs just doing physical therapy, especially if you are 40-60 or so. I also heard there seems to be some stuff out there pointing to that with the bulging disc issues. Not sure if that is what you refer to there but you might research and check that out if that is something someone is trying to steer you towards, back surgery.
I did ibuprofen and massage, have done the chiro and in the end it was just really waiting it out. I looked up stretches and did those and a few other things. Home/natural herb stuff all seemed to be leaning towards the same few things and I can't remember what they were. I tried some and it was after it was set in pretty good and I couldn't say if they helped speed anything up or not.
I started this earlier.
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,31417.0.html
There's quite a few of these out there. I got to try one out and it really got me thinking it was a good thing to have. I have since calmed down from that but am still considering one.
Sounds like some chiropractors have them in their places or perhaps you can find one on demo at Costco or Sams Club to see what you think. This is one of the things that they all seem to tout, sciatica. I really don't know how to explain the sensation you have on it or exactly what it does but it was unlike anything I have been around or felt.
The marketing is all similar it seems, they all want you to call to give the best pricing, all sorts of stuff going on with that but if you got a chance to try one with this pain going on I would be real curious to know if it helped or not. I know I will search one out next time (yeah, probably will be) if I haven't got one by then.
I looked this up. Maybe one near there?
https://www.costco.com/zaaz-schedule.html
Good luck. I wish you well. I think I know what it feels like for you. Owch!
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Hey Linter hope you are on the mend and up and about soon. I dealt with lower back and sciatica many years ago and managed to over come it and deal with it. Well you never get rid of herniated discs but you can learn to manage them.
I had an excellent book called "Pain Free" by Peter Egoscue. His stretching and rehab exercises are legendary, especially for sciatica. Check Youtube, and Google to read articles and see videos on exercises for the pain you are dealing with. This book was so helpful in my recovery as were many instructional videos on Youtube.
His book is great because he is so upbeat and positive which was important to me because I was so, so depressed when I learned I had 2 herniated discs. 12 years later I can say I feel great, and learned a lot about stretching and exercises for my lower back, and I can even tell when sciatica or back pain is going to flare up and halt it in it's tracks.
Take your time, don't rush things, you will be up and paddling before you know it. The acute pain, what you are/were feeling takes some time to calm down, so any stretches or exercises you do start slowly. One of the best things you can do is stretch your hamstrings...they play a vital role in lower back pain . Also I try not to put on weight and keep my abs strong which will help keep back pain away.
best of luck and know there is light at the end of the tunnel
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It sounds a lot like what I was going through last winter. I have the bulging discs, spinal cysts, etc. I ended up getting some cortisone injections and a facet block. Those helped with the pain radiating down my leg but what ended up causing most of the pain, and especially in my butt/hip...exactly where you say...was the sacroiliac joint. My PT manipulated it...basically pushing down on my hip...while I did back extensions. The pain is very similar to sciatic nerve pain. Tell me...do you paddle mostly left sided? He suspected my unbalanced paddling and weighting my right leg (I'm righty) could be causing it. Since I've gotten back on the water I focus on balancing my technique and I do exercises he gave me...so far so good. I still get twinges but nothing too bad.
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It sounds a lot like what I was going through last winter. I have the bulging discs, spinal cysts, etc. I ended up getting some cortisone injections and a facet block. Those helped with the pain radiating down my leg but what ended up causing most of the pain, and especially in my butt/hip...exactly where you say...was the sacroiliac joint. My PT manipulated it...basically pushing down on my hip...while I did back extensions. The pain is very similar to sciatic nerve pain. Tell me...do you paddle mostly left sided? He suspected my unbalanced paddling and weighting my right leg (I'm righty) could be causing it. Since I've gotten back on the water I focus on balancing my technique and I do exercises he gave me...so far so good. I still get twinges but nothing too bad.
+1 for this. I do that along with changing stance on purpose. Front foot forward then left foot forward then as soon as a little bit of breeze downwind taking a semi-surf stance again changing right and left. I find that its really help with the pain while paddling and post-paddling. It is the advantage of a stable board. If I stay stuck in a parallel stance only, it takes between two and three km before I start wondering why the Hell I am paddling :-)
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thank you one and all.
carib: i'm going to get that book.
stoney: yes, i pretty much only paddle on the left side. in fact, i can only catch waves by paddling on the left. the right has no power. i will try to switch up more when i'm in the line up and maybe that'll help.
also, my feet are typically stuck in the basic parallel-stance position. it takes me forever to develop muscle memory for almost anything and once it gets developed, as in my stance, it's very difficult to form an alternative. I mean, it took me two years to even be able to stand on a SUP and it's the parallel stance that I used to get me there. it's on me like cement, but yes i will start giving other stances a try.
actually, i have tried other stances, now that i think of it. one foot forward, then the other. but when i look down at my feet, they haven't moved more than an inch. my brain lies to me a lot like that. i find it very hard to get into surfer stance, mainly because my brain is telling me I'm already there and in it when I'm not. I haven't figure out how to combat that situation. Weird.
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I've dealt with herniated disc problems for 25+ years. Other people's experiences are good but also remember that every back is unique. What works for one doesn't work for others.
When my discs act up there are different levels of severity and different levels of symptoms--sciatica being one of the worst. While I had surgery in 91, since then they are a lot slower to put you under the knife--good thing as that recovery really does take a year. Since then, I've noticed that the disc and related symptoms come on when I'm in more sedentary seasons and not exercising enough.
Fortunately, I can usually feel the symptoms coming on so it gets me active, doing morning stretches and just moving around. I've discovered that, while the temptation is to immobilize when my back goes out, I actually feel better if I go for a walk and let things loosen up.
I'll stop there because where your case gets unique is the fact that your paddling on one side may be causing imbalance that may be contributing. I'm pretty high on a good Physical Therapist for that--I haven't had much luck with Chiropractors. The PT I've seen puts me through a good regimen and gives me exercises to do on my own at home. Once you're past the initial pain, that's what I'd recommend.
Sorry you're going through this. It can be absolutely crazy-making.
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Linter, I'll send you a message. Maybe I can help
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Hey Linter, I like this site for anatomy tutorials. It helps me converse with my massage therapist and helps me understand what she is doing.
http://youtu.be/kXg3akhbrrg
A pro (of some sort) will fix you up.
The great thing about the human body is that it wants to be balanced, flexible and strong. It's a machine, endlessly repairing and replacing cells.
It will take a while, but you will be better than before.
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I basically have this same problem at the moment. Happened to me about a month ago. My pain wraps around my leg and is focused in my shin. Two weeks ago, I couldn't walk to the bathroom and was stuck on the couch for 2 weeks. Just now improving. I have been taking Hydrocodone along with CBD oil for the pain. Still not enough to make it go away.
Had an MRI, I have numerous bulged discs in my lumbar. Huge ones at the L5-S1 and L4-L5. If they haven't given you steroids yet, I would recommend trying a Medrol pack. Basically a course of steroids you take over a week. The last two times I had this happen, two packs did the trick and I was fine. This time the pain was worse and the steroids did not solve the problem. Dr. has recommended an injection this time.
I would recommend the book "The Permanent Pain Cure" by Ming Chew. He is a PT in NY. My friend turned me on to him. At the time, my friend had a bad back and was supposed to get surgery on his rotator cuff. Ming fixed him up so he didn't need surgery and back is strong as ever now. The book has a bunch of stretches that I can attest will make your back feel much better. If you adopt his routine, I believe it is a good maintenance program. I obviously have not followed it and have consulted it when I have this problem. Going forward I will be doing the stretches and other recommendations on a daily basis.
The book has information on supplements to take. He recommends taking systemic enzymes to get rid of scar tissue and inflammation. I have been taking them and my back is now getting better. Another recommendation is to drink lots of water like 2-3 quarts a day. One theory is that if the discs get dehydrated they shrink and it makes it easier for them to slip out of place.
Someone else that was having a similar problem recommended taking something called palmitoylethanolamide or P.E.A. You can check a site called www.peacure.com for this supplement. Studies show that it reduces inflammation and pain after about a week. I haven't tried this, but I am going to order some and give it a try. Not too many sources to purchase this product and some of it is made in China. The site I referenced produces the supplement in the Netherlands.
If you want to go the psychological route for the cause of your pain, you can get the book Healing Back Pain: The Mind-Body Connection by John Sarno. I know lot of people swear by the information in this book. I think his theory is repressed anger and emotions (stress) physically manifest into back pain.
Any who that is my 2 cents.
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Someone else that was having a similar problem recommended taking something called palmitoylethanolamide or P.E.A. You can check a site called www.peacure.com for this supplement. Studies show that it reduces inflammation and pain after about a week. I haven't tried this, but I am going to order some and give it a try. Not too many sources to purchase this product and some of it is made in China. The site I referenced produces the supplement in the Netherlands.
I wouldn't trust any supplement where the ingredients are made in China. Speaking just for myself, I wouldn't consume anything where the ingredients are made in China since my level of trust in chinese ingredients is about as far as I can throw an elephant. Back in 2007, the chinese pet food suppliers put melamine in their pet food and exported that pet food to countries around the world including the US. Pets here in the US died because chinese pet food suppliers cut corners in the name of profit.
https://www.fda.gov/AnimalVeterinary/SafetyHealth/RecallsWithdrawals/ucm129575.htm
If they can get away with it, they'll put it in other things and the general chinese population has it's own problems with their food supply which is near the bottom of the article in the link below.
http://time.com/107922/china-pet-food-contamination-recall-video/
Off Topic:
Go into any Petsmart or Petco store for pets and look at their pet non-ceramic bowls (excluding stainless steel). Lots of those bowls are made in China and I have a sneaking suspicion they have traces of lead in them when it comes to the manufacture of those bowls. I can't prove it, but I don't take chances with our pet cat's health. The ceramic bowls for food and water for our pet cat are made in the good old US of A.
Back on Topic:
Better stick with ingredients and supplements which come from the Netherlands to be on the safe side.
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Just wanted to give a shout out to Sunset Cliff's zoner Tom. He knows a heckuva lot about sciatica and similar and we've met twice for him to explain and stretch me out in various ways. Super helpful. Super great guy. Thanks, Tom!!!!
I did some flat water paddling yesterday and it went well. I'm going to try the surf tomorrow. We shall see!
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hey Linter so happy to hear you were back on the water!
To expand on some of my initial post, here is a link to a video of some of the Egoscue exercises that are sciatica specific. I have done similar stretches when I feel my sciatica coming on and they have always worked...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LNEjJkPHKM
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I have had sciatica for 10 years now. The only thing that really work for me was to strength the area, the core and lower back muscles and gluteos.
It is not easy to train that area without injury.
After lots of research i found kettlebells and in particular the russian swing. I was able to do this exercises no pain. And 1 year on, i am pain free in the whole area.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUpSFguwRQM
Alse yopu can read this: http://www.dragondoor.com/kettlebells_have_your_back_a_neurosurgeons_personal_and_professional_perspective/
My 2 cents
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thanks all, great additional stuff. went in the surf today for the first time since getting hit w the thing and i did ... okay. i'd lost a lot of muscle strength in both legs during the three weeks off, so i was very very shake. but, i caught a few waves and that's the important thing. and there was no pain, probably due to adrenaline/endorphin rush.
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Something else to try....I'm very surprised at how well it works for me.
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,31499.0.html