Standup Zone Forum
The Foil Zone => Foil SUP => Topic started by: blueplanetsurf on December 19, 2016, 11:45:07 PM
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We recently got some GoFoil Kai foils at Blue Planet and got one of them all set up on a board. We practiced riding it on Sunday towing behind a jet ski and this morning I was actually able to paddle into a few small waves and foiled a little on the waves. Don't be fooled, it is definitely a challenging sport but I now feel like I can actually learn it and it seems like a great way to have fun in mediocre surf and hopefully on downwind runs as well. I'm super amped to learn this! Here is a video of our tow session:
https://youtu.be/TlcVRQ6IqtE
And some photos of the setup. Jeff Chang installed the tuttle box for me in a 8'0 x 31" Taro Chip model, which seems to work great. The box is 20" from the tip of the tail to the back edge of the tuttle box opening.
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Nice video Robert. It's important to show the crashes too like you did. Those who are thinking of doing this need to know there is a learning curve that will be challenging for a time. Also glad you and Jeff were wearing helmets as that foil doesn't care if it hurts you .
It looks like a medium length mast. Is that the only one that comes with the foil?I'm thinking a longer one would help to recover in better in between chop. I've noticed that I preferred to have my rear foot on top of the mast and closer to the fin cluster. Less teeter toddler effect. Keep us updated on your progress as we are all trying to figure this out.
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Thank you. Yes, I'm showing the crashes and want to emphasize that it is dangerous and certainly not easy to learn this sport. Foiling is awesome and I'm super excited about learning how to do it. I don't want to discourage anyone but go into it with caution and don't expect too much on your first few attempts.
Regarding mast length, the GoFoils only come with a 24" mast which seems to work well. When we first tried foiling we were using a kite foil with a longer mast, over 40" long and found it very difficult to use, especially when you are starting out. When you first get on a foil, the tendency is to lean back too much, which results in the foil going up out of the water, stalling out followed by a crash from higher up if the mast is longer combined with a greater risk of hitting the foil. Also, for surfing you want to be able to paddle back out without hitting the bottom, so a longer foil is probably not very practical in the surf, even for more advanced foilers. I think the Slingshot foil with three different mast length options is a good concept for learning:
http://www.slingshotsports.com/2016-Foiling-Flight-School-mast-package#.WFlgi7GZPwc
This was our first "learning to foil" video in case you missed it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5wcqrZ4BjI
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nice! I get it. Been there done that (when I was young!).
Tracting for sure is the best way to get early flight time foiling. Here are 4 tips on tracting for those that don’t have an extensive wakeboard/waterski background:
- Get a smooth driver.
Constant steady speed. Let the rider make the mistakes. Harder than you can ever imagine to find a good driver. Weird but true.
- Hold the handle towards your waist. Usually one hip or the other.
Think of it this way. If your rams are straight out you are being pulled from your shoulders. So you’ll be top heavy. You want to be pulled ideally from the middle. Just crank your hands down towards your hips to do this. It’s a total core workout and if your stomach muscles aren’t strong enough then go SUP a bit more until they are.
- You’ll learn quickly how to not generate slack in the tow line.
Meanwhile, if you do get slack, do not pull the line in, raise your arms to take in slack. You’ll see Bob do this at 1:07 and 1:30ish in the first vid.
Sounds weird? Just do it. If you don’t, and try to pull the line in, then you fall backwards. Such is life.
- If you want to let go and keep cruising.
Turn towards the boat just before letting go. Turning away from the boat increases line pull. You want to have no line pull as you let go (as noted in the vid). Especially foiling.
Basically generate some slack in the line just before you let go.
I'm not foiling now, I'm saying this from memory. I'm going to sit out the first couple of generations of SUP foils just because I'm an old fart and not in a hurry. But I will foil. I want to ride a boat wake on a lake for miles.
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+1
I was thinking that foiling behind a boat looks a lot like waterskiing with a lot of the same techniques.
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So... how does one do it without a boat ...kite, but is there a training ground other than inertial from surf or ocean swells? ..not that I'm interested mind you. (Kee'rist, I don't need another way to hurt myself!)
Jim
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https://youtu.be/0ics7pTH64c
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I recently learned something by accident, that might change the direction of surfing foil design.
I mounted my windsurf foil to a kiteboard and discovered the combo feels more like surfing, than the kite foils feel like surfing.
Here is what we think the difference is. A kite foil (and the Goil Foil) has the mast right tight behind the wing. This makes the board pivot between your feet during a turn.
The windsurf foil has the mast mounted way behind the wing. This changes the rotation of the turn to feel more like a surfboard carving off the tail. More of a surfing feel.
It's something you wouldn't think would matter because, for both foils, the wing is between your legs, in the same place. But the windsurf foil, with its mast right at the tail, changes the turning feel.
One disclaimer, mine has a raked mast. This test hasn't been done yet on a straight mast, like LP or F4.
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I recently learned something by accident, that might change the direction of surfing foil design.
I mounted my windsurf foil to a kiteboard and discovered the combo feels more like surfing, than the kite foils feel like surfing.
Here is what we think the difference is. A kite foil (and the Goil Foil) has the mast right tight behind the wing. This makes the board pivot between your feet during a turn.
The windsurf foil has the mast mounted way behind the wing. This changes the rotation of the turn to feel more like a surfboard carving off the tail. More of a surfing feel.
It's something you wouldn't think would matter because, for both foils, the wing is between your legs, in the same place. But the windsurf foil, with its mast right at the tail, changes the turning feel.
One disclaimer, mine has a raked mast. This test hasn't been done yet on a straight mast, like LP or F4.
That's interesting DW, it makes sense that the distance between the mast and the foil would change how the board turns.
I thought the mast on the windsurf foils is raked forward and/or the foil is more forward so the foil can be positioned under the rider when it's mounted in the regular center tuttle box on the tail or a windsurf board.
I thought that if you mount a windsurf foil in a more forward position like on a kite foil board, the foil wing of a windsurf foil would be further forward. You say the foil is in the same place between your legs, how does that work?
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Robert, I just built a kiteboard with Tuttle box in the rear, like a windsurfer.
(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff242/fishersfort/E13A1C17-13F4-4370-B6E9-E822B1E292B1_zps9m5r2xlw.jpg)
(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff242/fishersfort/4B446A84-B238-4685-A740-D274E8A01003_zpsnk2v7myr.jpg)
(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff242/fishersfort/30E3D44D-3A82-4651-924D-D295561E117C_zpsyyaeyobx.jpg)
Here it is being tested by the best foiler in this area.
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I just saw a pic of this foil designed for stand ups.
It's a little different than the Go-Foil.
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Robert, I just built a kiteboard with Tuttle box in the rear, like a windsurfer.
Here it is being tested by the best foiler in this area.
Cool, that looks like a good shape that could work as a SUP foil board as well if it's scaled up.
So you are saying that having the mast further back underneath the back foot makes it feel more like surfing? That makes sense to me.
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does the gofoil float rob?
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I have not tested it but I'm sure it would sink, it's pretty hefty.
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When I surfed yesterday at Cardiff there was a guy out with a GoFoil on a very small board. He was obviously experienced with foils and was catching quite a few of the mediocre waves and making them work. His takeoff looked surprisingly easy. Even well before the foil lifts the board completely from the water, it obviously reduces the skin friction on the board. That's an element that really hadn't hit home until then. It explains how heavier surfers like Sam Pae and Chuck Patterson can get these boards up in small waves. Lift increases as the square of speed, so accelerating to even a slightly higher speed than light riders will make the foil work. Of course, the heavy guys need to maintain speed, and probably can't gain as much with pumping, but it's an interesting phenomenon that somehow slid right past me.
I might not be seeing this correctly, but it looks like boards with GoFoils lie on their sides when they aren't being held by the surfer. You can see that in the tutorial video here, at 3:14. http://gofoil.com/tutorial-videos/ This implies that the GoFoil floats. But I may be misinterpreting pictures and observations. Pretty funny to watch Alex's wife Karla screaming and foiling. I haven't seen to Alex in probably twenty years, but we know Karla pretty well, she's our real estate agent for Ponohouse.
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When I surfed yesterday at Cardiff there was a guy out with a GoFoil on a very small board. He was obviously experienced with foils and was catching quite a few of the mediocre waves and making them work. His takeoff looked surprisingly easy. Even well before the foil lifts the board completely from the water, it obviously reduces the skin friction on the board. That's an element that really hadn't hit home until then.
The only foil I've ever seen at Cardiff was when Zane was in town one day, but I'm guessing it was probably Chuck Glynn. He is our local SUP freak (in a good way) and was foiling in a video with Laird at Hanalei just a couple weeks ago - he's a Laird team rider and somehow related to him.
And that is an interesting observation! In my head the foil "engaging" was like falling off a cliff but it makes complete sense that its progressive - just not as noticeable at slow speeds.
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He looked familiar, but I'm not sure why--at first I thought it was Brennan Rose but he's probably staying in Maui where it's warm
(http://www.supthemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/male-brennan-rose.jpg)
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I might not be seeing this correctly, but it looks like boards with GoFoils lie on their sides when they aren't being held by the surfer. You can see that in the tutorial video here, at 3:14. http://gofoil.com/tutorial-videos/ This implies that the GoFoil floats. But I may be misinterpreting pictures and observations. Pretty funny to watch Alex's wife Karla screaming and foiling. I haven't seen to Alex in probably twenty years, but we know Karla pretty well, she's our real estate agent for Ponohouse.
Hello, I know that this is my first post after lurking on this forum for a few years, but I am very interested in foiling and have had a season with my Zeeko Kite foil.
The reason that the foil is on its side at the 3:14 mark, is that the rider has straps on his board. The foil is not floating, and even if it did float, it would require a lot of flotation to keep such a large board on its side.
Cheers.
Doug.
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I see what you mean, I didn't notice the straps. It wouldn't take a lot of float to turn the board on it's side--a little float on a long arm (two feet, say) would tip a good sized board. The geezer foil is on a much bigger board (11'11" SIC) and it tips the board up on edge with a shorter arm. It's very floaty though--EPS foam core with carbon skin and an aluminum stiffener.
I still don't know the answer to the question of "does it float". Someone who has one will have to tell us.
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His takeoff looked surprisingly easy. Even well before the foil lifts the board completely from the water, it obviously reduces the skin friction on the board. That's an element that really hadn't hit home until then. It explains how heavier surfers like Sam Pae and Chuck Patterson can get these boards up in small waves. Lift increases as the square of speed, so accelerating to even a slightly higher speed than light riders will make the foil work. Of course, the heavy guys need to maintain speed, and probably can't gain as much with pumping, but it's an interesting phenomenon that somehow slid right past me.
I have been hoping this was the case but we have been starved for information like this. When Kai Lenny was here in Half Moon Bay for the Titans ceremony I was asking him about the foil. He was looking out a meek little inside waves and saying "You see those waves I could totally catch those on my 5' 6" board with the foil." I knew that wasn't possible unless something 'otherworldly' was going on like you described.
The foil is acting instantly to start reducing wetted surface drag. As speed doubles lift quadruples and you eventually get lift off. The math is there but the mind has yet to catch up.
Here is the training video referenced earlier:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4Mb_5wsxf8
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Cool video, thanks for posting Robert! By the way I like your blueplanet video intro and outro, they look great!
So I have zip, zero, zilch foil experience.
I do have many years of wakesurfing experience. What I learned from this is that being pulled by the rope and riding flat water is counter productive to learning to surf. When being pulled by a rope a beginner's stance, foot positioning and weighting are all way off and wrong for surfing. The rider has to get into the wake to the point that the wake is doing all work and the rope has gone slack, and then be able to stay on the wake. At this point the rope is only used to recover from mistakes and can be let go of.
I remember the early days of wakesurfing being excruciatingly frustratingly difficult. All that changed with improved boards, ropes, boats, and technique. And with the right board and technique just about any wake is surfable.
My question:
Does this apply to foil surfing behind a boat? Do we need the equivalent of a fully weighted wakesurf boat to teach us how to foil surf? In other words the rope doesn't make us fly, it's catching the wake that gives us enough speed to lift off and fly??? I can think of plenty of potential problems, maybe the most obvious is running into the boat?
Has anyone tried this?
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I went out again this morning, my second paddle session on the Go Foil and caught a bunch of mellow waves. I was actually able to foil for 10-15 seconds a few times and it was super fun.
I'm no expert by any means but here are some of the things I learned during my first two attempts: the foil does create extra lift and can make it a little easier to catch a wave before it gets steep even on a shorter board. You do need enough speed to create that lift though, so it does have to be about steep enough to catch on a longer SUP.
Your feet need to be balanced right on the center line of the board. My back foot is just behind the mast, my front foot stays pretty far forward, right in front of the handle of my 8'0 and I have a really wide stance. You have to pump it a bit and lift up the front foot to get it to foil but as soon as it starts to lift you have to lean forward and really put pressure on your front foot to keep it flying level.
I highly recommend practicing this while towing behind a boat or jet ski before attempting to do this in the waves.
I repeat: the hardest part is to keep the foil flying level and as the board speeds up you really have to lean onto your front foot.
Once you are foiling, it speeds up and there is almost no drag, an amazing sensation and it does not take much of a wave to keep it going once you are foiling. If you go straight down the face, you just outrun it and drop off the foil so the trick is to stay high on the slope and go down the line diagonally and you start to move significantly faster than the wave. The waves I was on were sloppy and barely breaking but I had a blast and felt like a grom catching his first wave.
The foil adds drag to the board when paddling but it's still pretty easy to paddle even over longer distances. It adds a little stability but to start you should use a board you could easily balance and catch waves on without a foil. The foil is 24" deep so you have to watch where you go and it will not work in really shallow spots. I have a prefect wave for this close to my house with mediocre sloping/ reforming waves that go unridden most of the time and I would not attempt to use it at a busy break.
By the way, PonoBill, if you put the board on the side the foil sinks, it is quite dense and does not float.
Clay, I think surfing it on a wake would be challenging, it seems to need a good slope on the water to make it work and it would be hard to keep it in the right place at the right speed I think. I'm sure it could be done by a very skilled rider though.
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Thanks for the report Robert and glad to hear you are getting it wired.
I asked a question and YouTube sent me answer. At 4:37 in this video they are towing behind a pontoon boat. He eventually gets into the wake and lets go of the rope, to my eye his riding goes from struggling to doing really well. Most videos I have seen of someone being pulled by the rope scare the crap out of me, it seems like the foil has a really narrow balance point and the slightest pull on the rope can upset the whole apple cart. Once the rope is ditched it seems all that changes and a natural balance seems to take over. At least this is how it looks to me. Again I have never foiled just going off how it looks.
https://youtu.be/cNYg_hkaCLo
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Great video but a dang loose definition of "have a blast." ;)
Not to be a hater but "a blast" = "do frantic squats/pumping?" Only for Zane.
I'm gonna say you need a little more than a party barge wake. But in good news, looks like just a little more would get you there.
Clay, the reason not to drop the rope while getting the feel down is that picking you back up and getting you going again after you drop off foil or dip down is a real hassle. Better to just play at the end of the rope for a while.
In good news (or a strong reality dose) a single 10 min on foil behind the boat will be more ride time than we get in half a year of surfing. I'll bet you get it fast relative to learning to surf. Then when you drop that rope you can glide as long as the driver will drive.
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Saw video online from that same Starboard meeting in San Diego of those guys foiling being towed by a bicycle and then by a windsurfer. Crazy stuff!
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Aloha Foil Fans,
Just some thoughts from a first time foiler here on Oahu. I was a bit hesitant on which board to mount the tuttle in and after speaking with Zane, he said to go as short as possible so I went with my 7-7x27 SB Pro and had the tuttle inserted 20" from the rear of the board per Alex Aguera.
My first session was just a paddle test, I wanted to get the feel of pure paddling before I tried some small waves. The board felt solid, maybe more stable than the quad setup. I was hoping to try it behind a boat/ski first but when armed with a new toy, I had to just give it go asap!
Got lucky on my second session which was today, smooth waist/chest high and nobody out. I used all of the info available so far via videos as well as tips from this forum and Zane…weighting the front foot, trying to center the back foot over the mast and pumping.
I caught at least 3 fun glides but I couldn't tell how high I was off the water. It didn't feel like 2 feet though, maybe 6-12 inches. They were probably 5-10 seconds with a great feeling of silent, frictionless gliding and also a low humming sound. I did fly off the back a few times which I believe were due to front foot placement/weighting. It shoots up high out of the water and thus pretty dangerous!
Pumping turned out to be the most important element to me so far. Waves I couldn't get into sup surfing the 7-7 were now doable just by some good pump action. I haven't had to pump a lot while surfing so this was new to me but it turned out to be instinctual and necessary once I got the hang of it.
One other note, must of the guys foiling in the videos either have no leash or a coiled leash. I used a regular 8' leash and it found its way tangled in the foil a couple of times. I'm going to get a coiled leash asap.
Anyway, I hope that helps a bit and I'm looking forward to more insight and reports from everybody.
-Scott
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Cool. I'm close to entering the SUP Foil arena. Go Foil came a week ago. Tuttle box a few days ago. It will be mounted into a Naish Raptor 7 X 28. ( I weigh 155 ). Handful of friends in my area doing it now. So, I'm watching , learning.
They and myself have been riding foils using kites for the past couple years. So, I know the " foil feeling".
That said, SUP foil is a different thing with the pull of the kite being eliminated. Front foot pressure is very important.
They are all using coiled leashes. Haven't really seen any haters from surfers so far. Just amazement and asking questions about it.
Brave new world..........
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We are slowly learning to use our foils. Here are a few short videos of Sam Pa'e, Jeff Chang and myself using the foils on the East, South and West sides of Oahu. Once you get the hang of flying over the surface, it's really an amazing sensation and totally addicting.
https://youtu.be/almFi6yvmX8
https://youtu.be/_tpRE7NB39c
https://youtu.be/qV_TDRTh36w
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Robert, about how many waves did it take for you to get your first solid ride?
That just looks like too much fun.
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Robert,
Can we get the crash reel?
I think that would help us understand the process better.
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Awesome!
Excellent takes. That first shot with the sunset behind is sweet. Nice riding. Sometimes strapped, sometimes free. Please share the challenges
Loved that short punk and fast session (2nd vid)! It’s ridiculous that your t-shirt isn’t even wet. Just ridiculous. Cool tunes, footage and fun in the last vid.
Seeing you guys having fun learning new stuff in water and waves while it's pow season here makes it really feel like a small shared blue planet. Thanks.
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Thanks for the comments. We will have another "learning to SUP foil" video coming out soon that will have lots of crashes and we talk about the challenging learning process. Check the first two "learning to foil" videos in this thread for the crash reel. We foiled behind a jet ski four times before even attempting to foil in waves and that helped a lot. I have only done it in waves about 10 times now and am able to get long rides already, so it's certainly not impossible to learn if you persist. The GoFoils are quite forgiving and are easier to learn on than the kite foil we were using at first when towing behind the jet ski.
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I have not tested it but I'm sure it would sink, it's pretty hefty.
Alex Aguera said the Go Foils will float, which is a good thing if something breaks. My friend had F-One foil which sank after the mast broke.
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I just got my Maliko Foil and am waiting for a windy day to try it in a downwinder. I have it mounted to a 12'6 x 28 Bump Surfer and mounted the Tuttle box so I can chop off 2' from the tail if needed. I did try it in some onshore slop and was able to get it foiling a few times, so I think this setup will work for downwinders.
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cool good to see the maliko foil I'm havnt heard a word since Christmas about mine that was due to be shipped :( looks like a very flat foil compared to the kai?
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Looks like a lot of square inches and a pretty long fuselage.
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I ordered the Maliko Foils last summer and finally got the first two and we are still waiting for the rest of the order. I think they are slowly getting up to speed on production but still not enough to meet the demand.
The fuselage on the Maliko Foil is the same length as on the Kai Foil but it does have a bigger surface area (both the front wing and the rear stabilizer) and the front wing is flatter with less curve.
I rode it again today and got some pretty long rides, I think I'm almost ready to try it on a downwinder.
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Robert, that's a sweet rig, board and foil.
Curious to see how the placement goes. This seems really sensible to me but like a lot of things the real world tests will tell the tale. But the mid position just seems more likely to be able to recover from a touch and go like you'd see in downwinders.
Can't wait for the videos.
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So stoked Robert is doing this. Riding shore waves is great but I saw Kai last April out in the open ocean and know that's the end game.
Did my first try yesterday in very small surf. 27" by 8'6" board was tough for me to even stand on initially but after about five attempts I got up and started paddling. Kept the board down on the water but felt it release on the little bump. The boys told me to keep my weight forward and not lift too soon, working my way into the lift. So I never lifted. Will try a wider board like Sam's and hopefully find a comfort zone I can work with. The guy I borrowed the board from is good on 27" and he's the same weight as me but very fit and 25 younger. It was one of Dave's board and it had a little smile face up on the nose, which made me smile.
Getting front foot centered is important as soon as the board starts to get pushed. Back foot too but most guys already have that down. I'm trying to visualize being centered once I eventually lift as I've seen guys that weren't and the consequences are immediate. I've heard of a hybrid foil coming out soon between the Kai and the Maliko. I'm jazzed.
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Back to Robert's 12' I think it's great because although it's apparently more ideal for 'pumping' what happens to a shorter board when the wind dies. Well you know what happens. You're paddling a potato chip with a brick under it. So I think Robert is right on. Finding the right length trade off will be the big experiment.
Kai was on a sawed off race board last april when I saw him on a dw run. It was 10'. Robert is very strong and might be able to go lower than this 12' but that length seems about right to me. I'll be very interested to see how it works for him... once the wind returns.
In a perfect world the wind would crank from start to finish but as we all know that is very seldom.
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I agree and I trust Robert's hours on the water as well.
Interesting about the front foot staying centered. I wondered if that L/R orientation was critical or if the foil stabilized you.
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I agree and I trust Robert's hours on the water as well.
Interesting about the front foot staying centered. I wondered if that L/R orientation was critical or if the foil stabilized you.
Nope. No stabilization if you're off center. I've been out on the surfski watching, even riding the same waves with these guys. Anything off centered results in a turn. It's so very sensitive. Think Flyin Wallendas with your blade in front like a balance pole. You're gonna flip Cowboy. It's unreal. You can turn nothing surf into lemonade every day of the week.
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Right, even if your weight is slightly off center you will not be able to control the foil once flying so the foot positioning is very important. I still tend to stagger my feet a bit with the front foot a bit to the left and the back foot a bit to the right of the center line and that seems to work too. I think having straps would help me place the feet more on the center line.
I added a tail pad to my board yesterday which helps me place the back foot in the right spot and protects my shins from the screws. The photos are from this morning, surfing tiny waves in Waikiki. The foil make surfing small waves fun again!
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Those arch pads are a great idea to get the center line.
And HM, I agree. I really want to make use of all the "almost" waves we have here. So many little coves that you can paddle to that get a bump but not a real break. I intend to make my own spots all up and down the coast here.
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Whats the logic behind coil leashes on foil boards? Do straight leashes just get tangled in the foil?
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Yes, straight leashes get tangled around the foil easier than coil leashes, that's the main reason.
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I practiced riding the 12'6 with the Maliko Foil yesterday and had a good time. The longer board makes it much easier to catch rollers and the bigger foil has more lift and can be a bit challenging to keep from coming up too high at first. I like this photo where you can see the water moving over the foil.
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Whats the logic behind coil leashes on foil boards? Do straight leashes just get tangled in the foil?
Dave clips a few 'break away' loops of the leash on the side of a knee attachment. Robert is using a coil leash on his ankle in these pics. Both are good but I think I'll go for the loop method initially so that board is farthest away from me during a fall. Robert already has a fair amount of time in the saddle so he's confident with the coil.
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I practiced riding the 12'6 with the Maliko Foil yesterday and had a good time. The longer board makes it much easier to catch rollers and the bigger foil has more lift and can be a bit challenging to keep from coming up too high at first. I like this photo where you can see the water moving over the foil.
Thanks for the first report Robert. Looks good. Can't wait to hear from you after a DW run. Somewhere will be the trade off point of still being able to continue paddling without wind and glides but short enough to handle when conditions are good and lifting.
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We finally received a shipment of the GoFoils...both Kai and Maliko models...
First impressions...nice finish work...and, nice protective cases...no problemos with fitment...
Can't wait to give them a go...especially, after attempting to SUP surf foil with my Horue WindFoil...;-)
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Wardog, Can't wait for your report on riding the GoFoil.
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Looks like I came by your shop about a month too early. Those are nice looking parts.
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Looks fantastic! Can we get a "first impressions" review of the Kai vs Maliko for those of that are in the market for our first foils?
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Any chance of posting up the rough measurements of the 2 foils ? Just mulling over making a wood one ?
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Looks like I came by your shop about a month too early. Those are nice looking parts.
Yeppers...nice parts...closer to purty than not...;-)
Fitted bags for mast and wings...YKK zippers...nice finish work...fitment went as well as deep Tuttle goes...
One of the kids that I sponsor, Aryeh, took his Kai foil out for 1st time in some weak waves this P.M.
He done purty good...;-)
He rips on one of my custom 6'8" Jammers, too...
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,29202.msg314216.html#msg314216
To be continued...
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That last shot is exactly what I fear doing if I try foiling.
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So I've seen some new ideas in board shapes coming out with the foil gang. Primarily with nose rocker to handle any sudden dives. Otherwise they're rather unsexy shapes and that's fine since they only need to catch the wave at first and then they're out of the water.
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That last shot is exactly what I fear doing if I try foiling.
Zackly why I included it...see safety warning and liability disclosure attached below...;-)
Foiling is definitely not for the meek...get prepared for an arse whuppin' worse than learning kiting back in the early 2 line days...;-)
I'll see if I get time to dig up some of my wipeouts from last Summer WindFoiling @ 20-30 mph...holy shmoly!!!...;-)
I did have an impact vest and helmet...even booties...waaay too much lift for the conditions...but, very thrilling no doubt...and, don't even attempt to SUP surf a meter long WindFoil in beach break waves like I did...;-)
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Hence GF2. I like the design of the Gofoils a lot though. I think they get a lot done between 5 and 10MPH,
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Woohoo that was fun!!!
Catch a wave on a foil and you are definitely sitting on top of the world...until you get bucked off...;-)
Surf foiling in small waves is actually kinda tame compared to wind foiling in high winds...which has to be right up there with bull riding at times...;-)
https://youtu.be/TII7IfxIvwY
https://youtu.be/0ojanBvBp1M
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Evan from Standuppaddlesurf.net put together this video about foiling with the Maliko Foil on a downwind board:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMUKsJ3UxNs
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Evan from Standuppaddlesurf.net put together this video about foiling with the Maliko Foil on a downwind board:
Robert this is super informative. For those of us interested it leaves us WANTING MORE.
I am most interested in:
1) The earliest takeoff possible
2) Maximum speed after than early takeoff
I am projecting this into a big wave environment. I want to get in early and swing wide, really wide. There is no need to mess with the critical section of the wave if you can prosper in an unmolested playground clear of screaming children and swollen diapers.
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Hi Beasho,
I was just looking at your other thread, good to hear that you "pulled the trigger" and will be able to share first hand knowledge soon. For surfing bigger waves the Kai foil is probably the right choice for you.
Regarding speed, i'm not sure at what speed I'm taking off at on a wave but you do need a wave that is just about steep enough to catch on a regular board. Once you fly on the foil though, friction goes way down and once you get the hang of it you can keep it going with very little push, so yes, getting way ahead of the lip and riding the soft shoulder of a long wall is the best place to be on a foil. The speed on a steeper wave is too much to handle as the foil creates too much lift and wants to come out of the water no matter how much front foot pressure you apply.
For me a good speed for towing behind a jet ski with the Kai foil is about 12 mph and I can create enough pull by angling away from the ski to fly the foil. For my friend Jeff it takes about 14 mps to foil behind the ski. So the takeoff speed depends on the person and obviously rider weight.
A smaller board is much easier to control when flying, I just posted a youtube video where I'm using a 5'6 fish with the Maliko Foil and getting towed into the wake of our surf charter boat on our recent Mentawai trip, I'll start another post for this as well:
https://youtu.be/BvB-iYHjqw4