Standup Zone Forum
Stand Up Paddle => Gear Talk => Topic started by: supthecreek on March 26, 2013, 08:27:39 PM
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While boards get shorter everyday, I have always held a love for longboards as well as shorties
I have mentioned a few times that I really want to get a good longboard SUP for small days.
I see that more than a few Zoners are of like mind...
So.... what are your Ideas? Lets redesign a longboard style SUP here!
I'll start
1st... I like to work when I ride a longboard, meaning, I like that I have to move from place to place on the board to make it turn... I don't want to surf "fixed stance" I like the classic stylized moves required.
I like to cross step all over the board, switching feet from rail to rail;D
Length - 10' range...
width - 32" for good glide & stability in less than perfect conditions.
Thickness - Thin... thin as I can get it... to keep weight down, performance up
I am open to suggestions on rocker... I'd like to see some idaas
light concave nose for long nose rides... fading to double concaves past the center fin
wide nose
good brewer performance rails, fairly hard and very thin in the tail... hard and thin in the nose
unsure, but I do like chine's in the rail as well
rounded diamond tail around 7" ???
I like a decent amount of tail rocker
I want the tail to stay engaged during long nose rides, so I figure some kind of wing or wings to narrow the tail. Ideas?
A big center fin for thrust and sidebites canted out for hold on hard turns.
I want it light and strong, with a GOOD handle and full board diamond plate deck pad with strong stomp pad.
Maybe a thin pad on the front to keep weight down and traction good.
I see some decent longboard styles out there from the early SUP days, but would like to see some modernization of design. they are all 30" wide or less... sorry youngun's... but I am uncomfortable on 30"... 32" seems to be my number.
My huge 11'2 x 36" Avanti taught me a LOT about the value that a big board brings to the water.... and how very surfable it was.
Your turn...
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I'm 145, and ride a Coreban Fusion Pure. Monster Paint on the front, 9'0" x 29 1/2". Nearly the perfect board for what you describe, at least to me. Scaled down slightly from what you describe but a great board as several on this board can attest.
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If they'd give it a little width, the Pearson Laird would be exactly that board.
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Long clean lines with thinned out rails, low rocker line = glide. Single fin for the old style of long boarding = fun on the smaller days. Wide nose for riddin the tip as we used to call it. I have a 11' x 30" x 4 1/8" wide with a squash tail (rounded square)
tail made by Bill Foote. Lots of fun to get in the wave early and surf off the back foot 60 & 70's style. Using a 9 to 10" dolphin fin works well. Amundson 10' 6" work well, they ride like a classic long board. Wide tail & nose = stability
One day I tried it with just the side bites (Wardog 400) in small mushy glassing lefts, it worked well. Lots of options with boards this big if one learns to us the long rail line. Experimenting with different fin configurations can be lots of fun and improve one's skill in the surf. For myself wider is better on most days.
Nothing like a good cross step to the nose and back while trimming across a section.
Enjoy the Glide !
Enjoy the ride !
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I like 'em.
I have some shorter stuff on order (9'6" Footie (I think it's 9'6" -- mebbe 9'8" or sumpthin) and an 8'8" Simsup, but I too like to wander to and fro, and I like a tail that I'm not so likely to step off. My goto board right now is my 10'10" Foote, I think it's 28 or 29 wide, stable, fun, I can run up to the nose (or at least as far as the logo) and back to the tail several times on one wave. Lots of cross stepping and shuffling. It's a duplicate of my Gecko board (also Foote) with the same dimensions but with a squash tail. I loved that Gecko, but it weighs about 50 pounds now. I used to wonder why I stepped off the back of the yellow board so often when I was going left until I looked at them side by side--"oh--square tail vs. pin tail, what a dummy".
I know everyone has a favorite shaper, but if you want a longer surfboard that handles everything, it's hard to beat a Foote. I go way down on the center fin to get it loose, or bigger when I'm feeling clumsy or I think I'd like to get further to the nose, which is what I've been trying to do lately. I always run side bites on it, and found I can surf it with NO center fin (it fell out) and have a lot of slip-and-slide fun.
Easy on my geezer balance. Definitely a "move your back foot to the rail" design, but I do that anyway.
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Gotta agree with Surfcowboy, that sounds a lot like a Pearson Laird.
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problem for me with the Pearson Laird... and most current good longboard shapes is the width.
I can paddle a 30" wide board, but not comfortably.
I need to find a way to achieve performance while maintaining some width.
But who knows... maybe "primal creek" will be ok with a narrower board soon... but I doubt it :-\
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I'm 205# and love my 11x31 psh. Pieces of 8 has one up your way,
maybe you can give it a try. The board is bigger than the minimum
possible for me, but that only increases the longboard feel. That said,
due to a couple of major repairs, the board is too heavy. Not to surf,
when out in the big stuff I like the weight, just to carry. I'm going to
have the board copied and reduce the thickness a bit. The rest of it
I wouldn't change.
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Creek, I have a 31" wide custom Pearson Laird in the shop with your name all over it :D
http://soposup.com/store/pearson-arrow-11-laird (http://soposup.com/store/pearson-arrow-11-laird)
Or you could call Bob and have him make you one to whatever dims you want. I order 4-5 boards from him every year in a random mix of sizes.
Raf
owner of Soposup
www.soposup.com (http://www.soposup.com)
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Ah, a thread after my own heart. Thanks for starting it, Creekie! Longboard SUPing has been on my mind since the beginning, and even after the Great Shortboard Revolution pushed longboards to the back of the line, I knew it would only be a few years before nostalgia brought em back.
Like you, I think 10'x32" would be my sweet spot -- maybe not in a tipsup, which is one way of going, but in a more conventional shape, yes. Thinned out 50-50 rails or the like, add that to the list.
I actually have a board that conforms to most of the list -- it's a custom Angulo -- but it's a little too narrow for my declining balance skills.
Also, about the nose -- I really don't like the super fat ones, like the one on the Starboard noserider. For me, they tend to get hung up on the wave too easily. And SUP noses are fat to begin with. I just watched Wingnut noseride the heck out of his 11' Surftech board and it has a very pulled in nose. Of course, he could noseride a needle but still ...
Thanks again for the thread!
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raf...
I answered your PM and called... where are you?
I have the day off
You have little longboard waves and offshore winds
The 10'6 x 31 is interesting
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Hey Linter... it will be great to have you back in Linterland... hopefully, it will warm up by the time you arrive. I saw all your pre-dawn buddies exiting the water the other day, when I arrived about 7:15am.
The longboard search is on... let the glides begin!
Meanwhile... I'm looking short SimSUP at the same time ;D
so much fun!
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Sup,
You may be able to go narrower and thinner than you think. What have you been riding? The relatively flat rocker tip to tail sets a lot more board on the water and as long as the bottom stays fairly flat rail to rail under the paddling area, you may find that riding a slimmed down trimmed down model is very possible.
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sorry, I was surfing (duh). here now! ...but only until 1pm today. Kid has some sickness and I got duty at 1pm :(
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What about Stewart for a longboard style SUP? At first i didn't think they made SUPs but then i ran across this Craigslist ad so i guess they do customs...
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/spo/3703166523.html
FYI I'm not affiliated with the person selling the board (or Stewart for that matter) - I'm just a CL addict...
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Back in the early days, many of the gals (and some guys) would ride traditional longboards. On Maui, Gayle and Kent we're standouts on 11' Munoz boards. The upside being, they could spend half the day SUP and half the day trad and only bring one board to the beach. And they rip on both...
http://vimeo.com/1172794#at=0 (http://vimeo.com/1172794#at=0)
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I have the Pearson Laird Surftech 10'6". It is a great board and pretty much
matches the description you made.
It is a bit tippy even though it is 29.75" wide. I do believe this
is because of the V in the tail (and also the pintail shape).
It gives it a kind of a two inch tip on either side. However,
I think the V is also part of why the board performs so well
as far as turning. Also, I think the 11' Surftech version is quite
a bit less tippy than mine.
I think the non-Surftech version which is wider would likely
be a great fit for you. I'd love to try one myself. Of course,
you should demo it (if you do, let us know what you think).
As for walking the board and nose riding, I'm routinely on the front third of the board,
both front side and back side...actually usually up to about a foot from
the front of the board. However, I'm not hanging ten nor five,
I think because its not a true nose rider with soft 50/50 rails
in the back and it is a pin tail which gives the water less surface to hold down
(of course, maybe I'm not good enough yet).
I think if you can only have one board in your quiver,
this is one to consider. Because of the pin tail, you can easily
surf big waves as well as small ones. The only problem is
when it is really bumpy and windy - then the outline and size
is a bit too much....but those aren't very good conditions anyway.
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I agree with Subber on a couple points. I use mine on small clean days (like this morning in knee-waist high stuff), and its like a traditional longboard. With the proper fins, it will perform much better as a nose rider. But it is also my go to big wave board because it loves big, arcing turns, has unbelievable hold, and just basically goes into a whole new gear on anything overhead. These are very good boards in the small stuff...but amazing boards in BIG stuff. Not really surprising considering who these were designed for :P
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Most of the production longboard SUPs I've ridden are too thick. I think most manufacturers are trying to make a compromised board that is good for both longboarding and beginners. I tried a Kings board that was made for one of their contest riders and fell in love with it. The lower volume and thinner rails that you'd get from a custom seems to really work.
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I agree with Subber on a couple points. I use mine on small clean days (like this morning in knee-waist high stuff), and its like a traditional longboard. With the proper fins, it will perform much better as a nose rider. But it is also my go to big wave board because it loves big, arcing turns, has unbelievable hold, and just basically goes into a whole new gear on anything overhead. These are very good boards in the small stuff...but amazing boards in BIG stuff. Not really surprising considering who these were designed for :P
Hey Raf...what do you think are the best fin(s) for noseriding?
I'm up..way up on the nose all the time...just not hanging over the nose,
but I'd like to be. I mostly surf it as a single fin. I do like that
I can steer it from the nose - it is very fun!
Yeah...it handles all size waves very well....and surfs just like
a regular long board.
For others, the tail and nose rails are thinned out - not clunky at all.
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I hear ya on your 30" conundrum. But....
Check out these 3 boards from Coreban:
10'x34 EZ
10'x29.5 Icon
10'6x 30 Echo
The EZ is a high performance big-guy longboard sup. The Icon is also in the HP category for folks over 210lbs. And the new 10'6 Echo is shaped with a pintail, like a California point break LB should be. They are all very lightweight and responsive.
I know a dude who is pushing 250lbs, and can hang 10 on the EZ, then cross step back, stall, get covered up, and then power shwack sections! I've seen it with my own eyes:)
At 200lbs, I personally love the 9' Coreban Fusion, and can get up on the nose, but usually I'm turning/pumping more than anything on that. For LB-style, the Icon is the way to go for me. Set up 2+1, with a nice Wingnut 10" Fin
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If i had room, i would have a 11' x 28.5" x 4" . That would be my longboard choice for really small days. But today i surf small days with a 9' x 29" no problem, noseride and stuff.
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I just picked up a 10'6" Laird Pearson a week ago. I've only paddled it on a smooth river so far. Can't wait to get it into some waves and find out stable it is for me at 220.
It glides great. A lot like the 10' South County Blue Dragon I rode 2 weeks ago. The differences I've noticed are the thinner rails on the Laird allow it to turn real quick. I had to work to spin the So Co when a wave was coming. I loved the glide on both. If the Laird is stable and surfs as good as it pivots I could see pulling it out if I want to up my wave count.
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The Surftech Laird Pearson Arrow 10.6 is good for someone under 210 and it is narrow at 29.5. It has great rails and nice tail for turning.
The South County 10 Blue dragon has thin nose and tail and is only 3.75 on its widest point and to me feels like a Yater spoon longboard. At 32 inches wide it is very stable and feels great on the wave. it also holds real well in the surf and on edge in a turn. It also turns from the nose.
Either one or a Custom like Raf showed us earlier would be great noseriders.
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Any longboard-style suggestions for bigger gents (250+)? I had a super fun session a month ago on a rented 12'1 laird/Pearson (surftech) in some smooth, thigh-high peelers. I was amazed at how quick and easy it was to bring around onto a wave, hook in and and move around on compared to my other 12 footer (starby atlas). What else is worth a look in my size range?
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purely for information, and not sold in the USA. have a look at the longboard sups in the "Caribou" section of a certain red board , loads of specs and photos, c'est bonne.
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for my long board I chose the 10'6 da beach boy C4. its 10 6 x 32 classic long board shape paddles well and actually surfs very well too. but u have to move around on it, you can nose ride it or get back to the the tail and crank it. It has ties down on the nose so you can also fish off it or pack a small water tight bag, great board
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If they'd give it a little width, the Pearson Laird would be exactly that board.
I just had one of these made, at 30 1/2" wide..
(http://i.imgur.com/vA3CMz6.jpg)
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Big old single fin glasses in. Wood nose and tail. 3 to 5 wood stringers. Little flip in the nose and tail. 29 x 10'6 x 4. Very walkable.....8)
Talldude mobile
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What about Stewart for a longboard style SUP? At first i didn't think they made SUPs but then i ran across this Craigslist ad so i guess they do customs...
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/spo/3703166523.html (http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/spo/3703166523.html)
FYI I'm not affiliated with the person selling the board (or Stewart for that matter) - I'm just a CL addict...
I really liked my Stewart longboard that got pinched in Lahina. Fun board to walk on. concave under the nose, transitioning to a double concave to a little V in the tail. Easy to noseride, easy to move around on. Turned at the nose the same way it turned in the middle.
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I have an old Jimmy Lewis Allrounder 11'0 x 30" still living in my garage. I mostly use it as a friend or chick board. Not necessarily in that order. Anyone have much experience surfing this board longboard style? I imagine it does fine.
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It is too bad Robert August only SUP option is the 11'6" surf tech. Back when I was surfing a lot, I got a 9'0" Robert August Board that was made for Wingnut for the Endless Summer 2 but was not used. I rode that board into the ground. Best board I have ever owned-surfing, windsurfing, etc. I wish Robert would make custom sups. A 10' ft 30 1/2 would be perfect in my mind.
I own an Icon and like it a lot but it is not a traditional longboard. Lots of nose rocker and a squash. In some respects it is great but it is not traditional.
I think that a custom infinity slater trout model may be my next purchase.
I find some of Dave K's surf sup videos of when he was with Naish to be some of the best progressive longboard riding around. You can't help but smile watching this video.
DAVE KALAMA SPIN'N AND GRIN'N (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax0aA0lSzHg#ws)
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I agree with Subber on a couple points. I use mine on small clean days (like this morning in knee-waist high stuff), and its like a traditional longboard. With the proper fins, it will perform much better as a nose rider. But it is also my go to big wave board because it loves big, arcing turns, has unbelievable hold, and just basically goes into a whole new gear on anything overhead. These are very good boards in the small stuff...but amazing boards in BIG stuff. Not really surprising considering who these were designed for :P
Hey Raf...what do you think are the best fin(s) for noseriding?
I'm up..way up on the nose all the time...just not hanging over the nose,
but I'd like to be. I mostly surf it as a single fin. I do like that
I can steer it from the nose - it is very fun!
Yeah...it handles all size waves very well....and surfs just like
a regular long board.
For others, the tail and nose rails are thinned out - not clunky at all.
I can't say I get toes over the nose much, so I may be overselling it. But I never ride it as a pure single fin either...always a 2 plus 1. I use a high performance small longboard hatchet and 4.5 sides when I want to surf it hard and big, and then switch to a 7.5 or 8ish flex fin with 3.25 sides when I'm casual and doing more foot work. I'd slap a big old 10" dolphin with lots of area down deep to nose ride it properly. But I'm a big fan of flex fins. So smooth and springy.
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great to see lots of participation on longboard SUP's ;D
pono- my favorite prone longboard was a Hydrohull... I had many of them.... except I broke every one in half... 2 in one day ...... there's a steep price you pay for lightweight performance
Kojack... I had an August "What I Ride"... it was ok when I got too big... but a lot less peformance than the Hydrohull
I paddled the Icon... kinda tippy for me.
Exeter... tried the EZ last year.. not my cup of tea.... down rails all around... plus overall too wide for me now.
joneysan... very coy... I like it! I may... or may not... see red ;)
I like a big center fin for sure... + sidebites for hard turns on sucked up waves.
Funny that so many mention the Pearson Laird 10'6...
I was out at Cape Cod today and this guy walks up and plops down a Pearson Laird on the sand... huh?
Turns out it was a fellow zoner... addapost... he had the 10'6 x 31.... coincidence?
Here is a picture Stoneaxe grabbed off the cam (he came down later and we had a good 3 hour session)
The pic is addapost showing up with his Laird on his head... and me in the water ;D
Last pic is addapost working out with the Laird
Kind of cool how all this ties together ;D
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Just be like the guy I saw yesterday at the Reef. Tiny Asian guy (120lbs?) on an old longboard using it as a SUP.
🙈😳👍👨
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I would give Dave Kalama's new Imagine Shapes some serious consideration. I rode one and would have one in my quiver if they had been available at the time.
Disclaimer, the Brand Manager Adam is a good friend and surf buddy... but the DK longboard-ish shapes are very versatile, without massive noses, but still allow nose riding.
SL
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SL.. I saw those boards in action this last week. Nice thin tail, thin throughout, everything looked sweet. DK rode a few waves on one of his pal's Imagine LB board and was doing spinners with ease.
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Ok... question for everyone that has experience with "thin" boards... especially customs:
How strong are they?
I have broken so many high performance longboards (prone) that I stopped buying them after the day I broke one in half... ran to the local shop... bought a new one... went back out and snapped that one in half... within an hour :'(
That was my Waterloo... I reluctantly went back to heavier, stronger boards.
I simply can't afford to break SUPs... reality of finances... one.. must fund it's successor.
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My custom Pearson Laird is probably the toughest glass board I own. I have taken it in the biggest surf we have here. I use it a lot. I have not had a single ding or pressure dent on it to date. A few spots where I have whacked the rail good with my paddle has some clouding, micro-fracturing of the base glass layer, but the outside remains as smooth and tight as new. Painted production boards would have chipped and cracked all over, prompting me to do repairs. Clear production boards scare me....good chance your epoxy will look terrible after a month in the sun (last year's clear Bic SUPs had this problem).
Customs can be more fragile, but that is usually because they are purposefully under-built to maximize performance.
Raf
Pearson Arrow owner and seller :P
www.soposup.com (http://www.soposup.com)
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thanks raf... love the disclaimer ;D
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Love this thread! After a few years going smaller I am stoked to have just picked up my new custom Nectar from Gary McNabb, and this time went bigger. Looking for glide!
9'0" x 27 x 3 7/8 Full nose and a 2+1 setup. Threw a 8" Larry Allison fin I had in the center box and a couple small side bites. Looking forward to playing with the fin set ups. I haven't weighed it, but it can't weigh more than 15lbs with the pad and fins. Feels very light.
Surfed it this morning for the first time in tiny 1-2ft beach break. Found a few corners a section or two to get up on the nose. I can already tell that this is going to be a great addition to the quiver. The board has some tail kick, but is pretty flat, so it has great glide. Amazingly stable compared to the short boards, and also amazing how this would have been considered tiny a few years ago.
Excited to get her down to San O and up to Latigo this summer!
Southbay
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I have one of these in 12ft - the tail and nose thinned out so it's 185litres volume. Very stable and nice glide on a wave.....just rides through everything and turns well too. Strangely though, my 9ft 6 allwave noserides much easier!
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That Nectar looks great!!! How is the sup scene at Latigo?
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Sweet video ColdSup! The SUP scene at Latigo is a madhouse, Newbs everywhere! It is generally mellow. I only go up there on a solid south swell. Something that would max out the beaches. Watch out for the boils.
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I have been messing around with fin configurations all week. The 8"
center with small sides bites is good fun, but tomorrow is suppose to
pick up some, so I am looking for a set up that will provide me with
better top to bottom surfing.
Just picked up this set from Futures today. Not cheap at $102, but
that seems to be the going rate. It's a 6" hatchet paired with 4.37
inch side bites. First thought was, wow that center fin is thin!
Interestingly it is really fat/thick when looking at it head on.
Definitely never had a fin quite like this. I have a '67 Weber with a
hatchet, but nothing like this. Futures is billing it as a very quick
set of fins, designed for performance longboards.
Can't wait till morning!
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I really want to have a go at a longboard style SUP, I've got this so far, what would be some good rocker numbers for a nice glide and ride?!
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Oh man, just in time for summer. Whiskey I'd keep the nose rocker down and maybe even concave the nose. Tail seems about right there. One thing that I'm interested in as a lightweight is getting to keep the thickness more consistent and carry the volume more through the board like a true longboard instead of putting a bunch of foam under the feet and thickening up the middle.
Haven't really done much in the computer yet but that's one thing that might be worth playing with.
Can some of the other shapers here speak to this? I'm thinking lower volume and keep the rails in the water like my nose rider. If you're making it for yourself you can take it down to where it suits you and that'd probably bring the effective rocker down too.
Thoughts?
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The summer ripple rider!
Thanks Cowboy, I was thinking the nose rocker could do with coming down a bit. Yeah, I'm making it myself so I can tweak it a bit once I get the blank cut, a decent nose concave is the way to go, then blending into a double out the tail I was thinking.
I weigh about 79 kilos, is that lightweight?! I did think about making the thickness more uniform, especially into the nose, don't want to lose manoeuvrability though.
If any shapers out there have any input, that would be quality.
It's a beautiful Bank Holiday weekend here, no swell, but I'm off for a paddle!
Enjoy!
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I weigh about 79 kilos, is that lightweight?!
On a teeter-totter, I'd launch you like a pumpkin. :)
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I weigh about 79 kilos, is that lightweight?!
On a teeter-totter, I'd launch you like a pumpkin. :)
We should join the circus! ;D
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Americans use teeter-totters to launch pumpkins?
I've for a lot to learn about your culture.
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The more advanced pumpkin tossers among us use either a Trebuchet or a properly scaled-up potato cannon. In either case the danger is substantial. An acquaintance of mine owns a pumpkin patch and until recently had a 45 foot trebuchet that easily tossed a pumpkin the size of my head (monstrous) over a quarter of a mile. He disassembled it in the name of world peace. Pumpkin tossing, or more accurately, pumpkin chucking, is indeed a "thing" in american culture.
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As a certified geek, I would love to spend an afternoon tossing pumpkins with a trebuchet!
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Not sure what your ideal volume is but I just put a few tweaks on a board design I'm playing with and its about 3.5" thick 8'10" X 28" and is hitting 102L. I'm considering cheating it down even more but I'm not sure.
I gotta go find that old volume thread and check the math. But the point I'm making is that my 9'6" "prone" longboard has the rails covered when I'm paddling. I can't see why my standup longboard shouldn't as well.
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I am still researching my ideal volume, but my findings suggest around 100L is my sweet spot! Most recent board is about 90 I think, maybe a touch less and it's a little frugal on the float for me!
This one was 7.5' x 28" x 4"
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That outline looks lovely. I wonder what it would look like beefed out to 115L.
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That outline looks lovely. I wonder what it would look like beefed out to 115L.
I'll give it a go and get back to you! I do love this template.
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don't forget to make the rails 50/50 for the true longboard experience.