Standup Zone Forum
Stand Up Paddle => Gear Talk => Topic started by: fiftyfive on April 11, 2011, 08:56:09 PM
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Lots of pumps around ;D, but not many can inflate the C4 iSUP to 15 psi ;)
Which one can do it? :o
Which one is the best? :-*
and
Which one is the most durable? ???
It is essential accessory, kept in a dark. 8)
Can make or brake your day, you start and finish with it.:-\
Opinions , please.:D
Thanks! :)
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I have three MANUAL pumps for my ULI, and I hate them all. I finally rigged an attachment to any air compressor. When we are on a trip, I'll drive looking for a gas station with an air pump. I put a regulator inline, and set it to 20psi, and SHAZAM! I've had it nice and firm for a couple of years now. :)
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The K100 pump is fantastic. Pump with the c4 pump just until it gets a little difficult then use the k-100 pump to take to high pressure.
Jill
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what about a small pump for travel ?
i dont mind if it takes a while to pump up to pressure
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I have three MANUAL pumps for my ULI, and I hate them all. I finally rigged an attachment to any air compressor. When we are on a trip, I'll drive looking for a gas station with an air pump. I put a regulator inline, and set it to 20psi, and SHAZAM! I've had it nice and firm for a couple of years now. :)
Eeho-o-o-o! Super! Very, very smart. I like that! But, how to get connected? Will you show some pics of the regulator/adapter, please. And what are the names and models of your pumps, so I can avoid them?
Thanks for the idea!
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The K100 pump is fantastic. Pump with the c4 pump just until it gets a little difficult then use the k-100 pump to take to high pressure.
Jill
Thanks JillRide45!
Do I need a special adapter to connect the K pump-100 to the C4 valve? Can I use just one K pump for full inflation, so eliminate using two pumps? Can the K pump-200 do it? Or K pump-100 can do it all the way?
Thanks!
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The K100 pump does not have the C4 valve adapter. All you do is place the K-100 tip over the valve of the C4 and start pumping. The normal valve lock adapter is just used to hold the flexible tube in place on the larger floor pump. The K-100 pump does not have a flexible hose.
Can you use just one pump? The absolute best setup I have found is the C4 pump for quick large volume initial air, then the K100 for top off. For overnight trips the K-100 is easily carried on the board with a patch kit inside the travel bag. There are basically 2 companies that make inflatable top-off pumps, K-pumps and Easy Pumps. The pump ULI supplies with their boards is the Easy Pump that is modified to be a floor pump. This Easy Pump is the model comparable to the K-100 pump. The thing I do not like about this set up is it takes forever to get the ULI up to 12psi with the Easy Pump. Really need a higher volume or dual action pump for the lower pressure.
As to will the K-200 do it. Looking at the Specs the K-200 and K-100 should have the same resistance (both are 3" in diameter), but the K200 is 11" longer so more volume/stroke. You really would have to give it a try. I find I would not want to carry anything longer than the K100 on the board.
I hope this helps. Cheers, Jill
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Hello JillRide45,
Thanks a lot for the great description.
I red a lot of your postings. I can see the experience and knowledge.
I will follow your expertise and will go for the K pump-100. It looks like the best choice for use with sup.
Your input always appreciated. Thanks for being around.
Would've been great paddling in your company and partnership!
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Ok, it ain't pretty, but it gets the job done fast. More paddle time, less blisters! ;D
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Hi TallDude 1,
I really liked that !! Cool !! ;D
Very good creative job !
Ren
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I have three MANUAL pumps for my ULI, and I hate them all. I finally rigged an attachment to any air compressor. When we are on a trip, I'll drive looking for a gas station with an air pump. I put a regulator inline, and set it to 20psi, and SHAZAM! I've had it nice and firm for a couple of years now. :)
Interesting. How old are your ULI pumps? I got an ULI a month ago and found it easier to inflate than I was anticipating.
What about contaminants in the compressed air? ULi suggest you not use a compressor due to the likelihood that oil/lubricants/etc and other contaminates will enter into the board and harm the interior material and valves (or something).
Anyway, whatever pump came with our new ULI seems to work fine. No problem reaching 15 plus psi.
David K
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Hi fiftyfive,
If you are in So Cal drop and by and try out the K-100 pump. We are in Irvine if you want to try it out.
Just PM me.
Jill
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I have an old original ULI 'Steamroller'. No kevlar stringers. The original ULI's are tanks. Perfect for whitewater SUP'n, which I want to try this summer. Mine is probably 5 years old. I bought it used 2 years ago from a guy I know. The newer light wieght inflatables are no so durable. My friend has a few of the newer light wieght ones, and has had some leak issues due to wear and tear. You have to treat the new ones just like a glassed board. Mine, being the older heavier style, can a beating like letting my kids drag it across the rocks to the beach. I leave it inflated pretty much all year, and it may drop 5 pounds of air in that time. I don't really worry about a minute amout of pollutants that might get in from a compressor. It would be mostly water mixed in with the air, with is just a result of compressing the air. Two of my pumps are an old and a newer version of low pressure ULI pumps. I have a high pressure, low volume ULI pump (mfg by E Z pumps) as well. I just found a great link to pumps and pump parts. Not that I plan to do any manual pumping myself..... ::) http://www.whitewaterdesigns.com/home/wd3/smartlist_76/ez_raft_pumps__values.html (http://www.whitewaterdesigns.com/home/wd3/smartlist_76/ez_raft_pumps__values.html)
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Here is a great explanation of the difference between the EZ pump and K-100 /200 pumps. I got this from
http://www.theboatpeople.com/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=244 (http://www.theboatpeople.com/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=244)
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The smallest of our three K-pumps, they K-100, looks very similiar to the EZ Pump but without the handle harness. It has a more comfortable mushroom shaped plunger grip and is the same outside diameter as the EZ, but about 1/8" larger on the inside. If you are looking for a mongo-heavy duty pump that you can drop out of an airplane, the EZ Pump is unsurpassed. For most folks the K-Pumps are an excellent option though, since they pump with even less resistance than the EZ Pump.
The K-100 and K-200 models have the most effortless action of any manual pump made. This is due in part to them having no check valve, with the reasoning that almost all modern inflatables already have one-way valves for air inflation. If you need one equipped with a check valve, it's no problem, just let us know. Or, go with the EZ Pump, which does have a check valve. All K-pumps come with a semi-waterproof stash bag like the EZ Pump.
Each K-Pump has a two-year warranty and an extra O-ring hidden inside the front end of the main body. They also come with a soft-tip adaptor and two rigid tip inserts to ensure they will work with almost any boat. ALL barrel style pumps should be re-lubed once per season, or more often if your usage is heavy.
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Hope this helps. Jill
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You know...
I have had the older Uli (sold) and the newer one (GL2).
I had been looking for an electrical pump for quite a while in the past ...exactly to avoid the possible "things" that can go into the board when using the heavy duty compressors.
I personally find that the new Uli Pumps work really WELL !!
But I do admit that "pumping" for about 15 minutes is not the best "warm up" exercise at all ! :(
But compared to the older (higher volume - Gray) ULI pumps, this one takes the board EASILY to 20 psi ! I have to pay attention to not go over it ! I tried to keep between 18PSI. (see picture)
But I do keep the Old pump around !! Main Reason... The double action !
It has more volume and pumps on the way Down and Up ! ;D
PLUS, it helps deflates the board to almost a vacuum, what makes it really easy to fit on my travel bags ! ;)
My experience has been that it takes a LOT OF time (and pumping strokes) to get to around 8psi.
That is when the board takes form and get "firm".
Also it is around that psi that the double action pumping on the UP stroke will become hard.
But after that, switching to the new Uli Pump, it gets to a higher psi pretty fast !
When I was looking for an electrical pump, I was just looking for something that would bring it to about 5 or 6 psi.... which as I said, I consider the "pain" part.
It ended up that "any good" electrical pump was TOO Expensive, and I still had to use the manual pump any way ! ???
So the solution has been ... I keep it inflated most of the time !
I just deflated if I am traveling ... whether by plane, or by car. It is easier to carry it this way...and safer for the board too ! :)
Well.. those were my 17 cents !
Ren
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Hi fiftyfive,
If you are in So Cal drop and by and try out the K-100 pump. We are in Irvine if you want to try it out.
Just PM me.
Jill
Hello Jill,
Thanks for presenting me with the opportunity to try the pump. I would've done it with great pleasure, but with immense regret, I have to postpone it, probably for good, as I am way, way east - in Toronto, Ontario. I am so sorry.
I appreciate your kindness.
Will continue to read your posts with interest.
O, you just post another message.
Thank you, Jill.
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Hey Ren,
I do still manually pump the ULI sometimes (in a bind), and if it's completely deflated I'll do the two pump thing as well. Two way to start, then the high pressure pump to finish. Once you get to about 13 or 14, you have to do the 'drop the knee' move with each plunge. Love that!!!! Oh yeah, wear some gloves...
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Ok, it ain't pretty, but it gets the job done fast. More paddle time, less blisters! ;D
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Hi TallDude1,
Awesome creation. You are a mechanical guru.
What options do I have?
1. To forget about.
2. To buy one from you.
3. You, possibly, let me know, what parts did you used and where I can get them.
Any hope? Unbelievable stuff!
And thanks for the picture. I never expected to see such a complicated adapter. How can be done simpler? Is it possible?
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Here is a great explanation of the difference between the EZ pump and K-100 /200 pumps. I got this from
http://www.theboatpeople.com/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=244 (http://www.theboatpeople.com/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=244)
-----------------------------------------------------
The smallest of our three K-pumps, they K-100, looks very similiar to the EZ Pump but without the handle harness. It has a more comfortable mushroom shaped plunger grip and is the same outside diameter as the EZ, but about 1/8" larger on the inside. If you are looking for a mongo-heavy duty pump that you can drop out of an airplane, the EZ Pump is unsurpassed. For most folks the K-Pumps are an excellent option though, since they pump with even less resistance than the EZ Pump.
The K-100 and K-200 models have the most effortless action of any manual pump made. This is due in part to them having no check valve, with the reasoning that almost all modern inflatables already have one-way valves for air inflation. If you need one equipped with a check valve, it's no problem, just let us know. Or, go with the EZ Pump, which does have a check valve. All K-pumps come with a semi-waterproof stash bag like the EZ Pump.
Each K-Pump has a two-year warranty and an extra O-ring hidden inside the front end of the main body. They also come with a soft-tip adaptor and two rigid tip inserts to ensure they will work with almost any boat. ALL barrel style pumps should be re-lubed once per season, or more often if your usage is heavy.
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Hope this helps. Jill
It certainly help. Great info. I need it badly. Thanks Jill.
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I'd use a tank of nitrogen and a regulator. No water vapor, so temperature changes would have a little less effect. Not very expensive, I have a couple of them in Nero, my race car trailer, for filling tires and running the air tools. They're left over from when I raced a Radical with air jacks to pop the car up for tire changes in endurance races. Last time I bought some the small ones were about $80 to buy and $20 to fill.
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Really I do not know what the complaining is about. I have a 14' ULI that I manually pump up! Takes forever with the ULI pump, by the time you go from 0 - 17psi, you are ready for a break!
Fiftyfive, you might want to just catch a flight down here to try out the pump. It is to be about 80 at Dana Point by Saturday. Got to head out and play so buoy tag before it gets too hot.
Cheers, Jill
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fiftyfive,
I'm working on a simplified version you can assemble yourself. It's basically an Air filler valve ($2.), screwed into a low pressure (air brush) regulator ($29.), into a tube (? got to swing by a hardware store) which you insert into your existing pump hose ($0.), and seal that with a pipe clamp ($2.). There might be a reducing coupling to make a change from 1/4" fittings to 1/8", not sure. I'll send a picture when I get all the parts :) I need to make a new one anyway, because I used some of the parts off other tools of mine that need to be put back.
TallDude
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Hi TallDude1,
I am already researching how to make one. Cannot wait for your new simplified version. It would be wonderful., if you let me know, please. What a "smart" guy I am, and what a nice guy you are to shear your inventions. Will I be able to use my portable car electric pump (stupid question) with your adapter? That is what I want to achieve. What is the small silver box in front of the low pressure air regulator - air filter valve? Thanks a lot.
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Really I do not know what the complaining is about. I have a 14' ULI that I manually pump up! Takes forever with the ULI pump, by the time you go from 0 - 17psi, you are ready for a break!
Fiftyfive, you might want to just catch a flight down here to try out the pump. It is to be about 80 at Dana Point by Saturday. Got to head out and play so buoy tag before it gets too hot.
Cheers, Jill
Hi Jill,
Catch a flight, eh. I like the idea. And very kind of you. Thanks, Jill.
Please, do not tees me. Here the forecast is rain and getting colder for saturday, when is the first for this year wind/kitesurfing swap. I plan to check it out.
14' uli, eh. I love that one. Racing or cruising on it? Is it good for racing?
Hey, I rather wait until you invite me to try your 14' uli. But never been on a sup yet, it will take some time until I learn and get ready for a 14'. BTW, when you decide to change boards, I'll buy this one from you. Remember me. How do you like it? Is it going fast? Did you talk about it at the forum? Do you need experience to ride that kind of sup?
Your posts are interesting and very informative. I do not have to ask for details.
Always glad to see a post from you.
Thanks, Jill!
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TallDude....
Please keep me posted also on your "new adapter" !
As I said on my first reply.. It looked really cool what you already had.
The "new and improved one", I guess will be even better .. and simpler !!
Thanks .. looking forward to see it ! ;D
Ren
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Ren,
The missing link to make it very clean, is the twist nozzle end. My first (thrown together) model has some issues. The presure regular I used is for 0 to 200 psi. These are the cheapest availible, but not so accurate in the 0 to 20 psi range. The cheapest I could find in a lower 0 to 60 psi range was a Badger model 50-054 airbrush regulator. The hose clamp connection to the pump hose on my original assembly, is not an air tight connection. The brass tube that slides into the hose fits tight thru the nozzle ring, but it's not that tight in the hose line where I clamped it. It leaks a little. I could just cut off the end of the hose and get a tighter fit, but it would no longer work on my hand pumps. I could call Jim at ULI, and have him ship me another hose, or pick one up next time I head down to San Diego. I did find what I think is the right size twist nozzle online, but there are no serial or part numbers on any of the connectors that I have. Hate to waste $$ guessing. I'll probably just get another hose for ULI and cut it ???
TallDude
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Tall Dude:
Great description of the "drop the knee" technique! And good suggestsions to use gloves. (I wrap the 2" web strap around the bpump handle, but I've blistered my hands more than once, and it's a b1t3h to paddle the boad when I give up at 11 lbs.
I have a Sevylor, which states 12 lbs max. I want to try to get it to about 15, but the standard pump is a palm buster. I leave it pumped up, and top it off every day or two. It's really hard to use when it's not rock hard. (The board, guys, the board)
Pono Bill: Greta idea about the nitrogen. I think I might try a paintball tank, and see if that gives me the gas volume I need.
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Ren,
The missing link to make it very clean, is the twist nozzle end. My first (thrown together) model has some issues. The presure regular I used is for 0 to 200 psi. These are the cheapest availible, but not so accurate in the 0 to 20 psi range. The cheapest I could find in a lower 0 to 60 psi range was a Badger model 50-054 airbrush regulator. The hose clamp connection to the pump hose on my original assembly, is not an air tight connection. The brass tube that slides into the hose fits tight thru the nozzle ring, but it's not that tight in the hose line where I clamped it. It leaks a little. I could just cut off the end of the hose and get a tighter fit, but it would no longer work on my hand pumps. I could call Jim at ULI, and have him ship me another hose, or pick one up next time I head down to San Diego. I did find what I think is the right size twist nozzle online, but there are no serial or part numbers on any of the connectors that I have. Hate to waste $$ guessing. I'll probably just get another hose for ULI and cut it ???
TallDude
Talldude...worries me that the end of the hose attached to the Uli board is fixed to it. If something goes wrong, the board can get damage pretty fast. :-\
I wonder if there is another way that this can be done. I will check around too !
If that is possible then you can use any hose you want. ;)
Great JOB !
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Basically, Your just using a standard tire filler, with the regulator as a safety check. A friend of mine who has more ULI's than anyone else I know (I think 5 or 6), fills his with a compressor (where I got the idea) too. He just has a air filler valve hooked directly too the ULI hose. He stops and checks the pressure with a dedicated ULI guage that just plugs straight into the board. He paddles for ULI, so he has accessories that I've never seen for sale anywhere. Jim from ULI told me I could pump my older ULI up as high as 20 psi. I don't think the seams on the new thinner light wieght ULI's can handle that kind of psi, but don't know for sure. The Seylor's are a thinner material as well. I definitely wouldn't go to high with them. As far as just using any hose, your right. I was just thinking, I could use some of my air hose disconnect fittings, and still be able to use the same hose for my manual pump. Just put it in line on the hose.
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Basically, Your just using a standard tire filler, with the regulator as a safety check. A friend of mine who has more ULI's than anyone else I know (I think 5 or 6), fills his with a compressor (where I got the idea) too. He just has a air filler valve hooked directly too the ULI hose. He stops and checks the pressure with a dedicated ULI guage that just plugs straight into the board. He paddles for ULI, so he has accessories that I've never seen for sale anywhere. Jim from ULI told me I could pump my older ULI up as high as 20 psi. I don't think the seams on the new thinner light wieght ULI's can handle that kind of psi, but don't know for sure. The Seylor's are a thinner material as well. I definitely wouldn't go to high with them. As far as just using any hose, your right. I was just thinking, I could use some of my air hose disconnect fittings, and still be able to use the same hose for my manual pump. Just put it in line on the hose.
Any update on how your pump is working? I recently purchased an 11' Uli and I am gassed by the time I am finished pumping it up.
I received an extra pump fitting from Jim at Uli so I am going to try to figure out an alternative to the hand pump.
Has anyone had any experience with any of these pumps:
http://www.boatstogo.com/electric_pump.asp (http://www.boatstogo.com/electric_pump.asp)
The only issue I see is the Uli valve as it is different than the valves on other inflatables. There isn't a bar across the Uli fitting to push the red pin down to allow free air flow.
Any help would be appreciated!
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The K100 pump is fantastic. Pump with the c4 pump just until it gets a little difficult then use the k-100 pump to take to high pressure.
Jill
Jill, thanks for the tip on the K100. Picked it up today & works killer where the C4 pump starts to fail. Definitely recommend as well!
Chris