I just broke yet another board, so I'm in the market again for a new one. And I have a loooong history of buying the wrong board so I'm trying to avoid that this time around.
The main place I sup is a pretty heavy, fast and often large freight train. Its a great wave but there's not a lot of opportunities for turning, it's mostly just a rush to make the sections, but you do get lots of chances to get up high on the wave under the lip for that awesome burst of speed. And sometimes there's the chance for the odd cut back. It's usually at least overhead and pushes toh when we (Northern California) get our meaty swells.
I've been surfing it on my beloved old Naish Nalu, which was 10.6 x 28" (not 30" like the new Nalus) but I just broke it. That board surfed this wave soooo well. Nice early entry, and grabbed the face so well on the backside drop. It wasn't exactly a lip smacker but it had enough turning for most of the way I like to surf (though a little more turny would be nice).
Before that I was using a 10.6 x 30" Nalu, which also did a good job but there was a big difference with that 30" width compared to the 28" and I thought it was a bit too much board. The wave broke that board too, and before that it broke a Hokua that I borrowed from a friend. It's been an expensive wave for me!
Anyway, I'm leaning towards a Jimmy Lewis for the increased durability. My friend kills it out there on his 10.8 Hanalei. But watching him turn it before catching a wave, it's like turning a battleship. I'm wondering if this is likely to be too much board? But he usually rides shortboards so he might not be used to weighting the tail to pivot.
I'm also wondering if a Stryker might be a good one to consider? And the Qwad? I grew up skateboarding so I tend to be drawn towards thrusters, but I haven't tried the Qwad.
I paddled a Stun Gun the other day and wasn't a fan, I like more longboardy glide and early entry.
Anyway, thoughts?
The 10'6 Nalu was a low volume, not very stable board, so I'm assuming stability is not the issue. It would be good if you could try an L41. They are made for speed. I've never gone faster on a board than with my L41 8'8". Kind of bitchy to paddle, but I suspect you're taking off in the pocket in a critical wave, not paddling like hell to catch something.
When you put the L41 on the rail hard, at least half the board is out of the water, and you're on a straight rail, with two thrusters hooked up. It books. You're in NorCal--go visit Kirk.
Thanks for the tips. I'm pretty comfy on tippy boards. I thought the 10.6 x 30 Nalu felt super stable. The 10.6 x 28, on the other hand, felt really tippy for awhile, but by the end of our 2 months together it felt like a rock.
As far as takeoffs, for this wave being right under the lip doesn't always work. There's consequences for misjudging and it's tough to be in the right spot, so early entry (and paddling hard) is nice and is the difference between 3 rides in a session and 20 at this spot.
And I should add, I'm 6' and about 210 pounds. And I should also add that the other wave at my local spot is a bit of a mushberger (though often a sizey mushburger), so ideally I'd love a board that works passably on that wave too. But the freight train is the priority.
And where is Kirk? 101?
You are almost in my weight category, but I've got a +30 lbs load and and a few inches taller. That 10'6 x 28 Nalu is a great board. I've surfed many times and own an original 11'6 Nalu. I was searching for a durable mushburger special recently myself. I ended up getting a 10' x 29" Coreban Icon. I run it as a quad. I'm an old skateboarder as well, so I tend to stay away from classic longboard shapes. I not sure the L41's are not known for their 'big wave' characteristics, but the newer channeled ones might be better? They might be fine in big musher though? I feel the Icon is the closest board to the Nalu. It has the performance of a fun board and the glide you need to make the sections. I prefer slightly narrower boards to go rail to rail faster so 29" works. The rails are thinner and it has a domed deck. For me it's a little tippy side to side, but floats me fine. I think the construction is on par with the Naish boards.
http://coreban.com/Products/the-100-icon/
The Sunova Speeed is right in that range as well. Straighter rails for glide but a performance tail. Enough said about this board ;)
The 10' Laird Surfer / Hybrid is in that range as well. A little less volume. I don't know about the durability? http://www.lairdstandup.com/product/surfer-hybrid/
While I love the way Naish boards surf, I can't imagine buying another one. They're just too fragile. I wish they'd make that shell a little thicker, it really is just a tiny little eggshell.
Lots of boards will work (LOTS of great designs) but what you need is OUTSTANDING construction and light weight for high performance wouldn't hurt.
I can suggest 2 boards that fit that bill PERFECTLY
Sunova Acid 8'10 0R 9'1 No other SUP slots into steep fast waves like the ACID
Construction is Very light with practically BOMB PROOF construction
(you can for a very nominal fee "Adjust" Sunova designs to PERFECTLY fit your ideas
Fanatic ProWave 8'9 or 9'2 a more traditional Design FAST and loose in both fast steep waves but also can generate speed for mushy waves and although heavier than the Sunova the Fanatic is very durable in both HRS and LTD
These are by far the best shapes/construction I know of for FAST?Steep waves
Check'm out and Let me know your thoughts
JimK
Extreme Windsurfing
If you're in NorCal why not a board from Jeff Clark? Old school tech complete with stringer. This is a custom that goes fine on a wave like you describe. 10-4x29
Get in early and easy to control at speed. A lot of boards will work, this is just one.
(http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s672/jayspics09/imagejpg2_zps0f04dbac.jpg) (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/jayspics09/media/imagejpg2_zps0f04dbac.jpg.html)
Quote from: wrybread on January 12, 2016, 01:08:01 PM
While I love the way Naish boards surf, I can't imagine buying another one. They're just too fragile. I wish they'd make that shell a little thicker, it really is just a tiny little eggshell.
I matters what Era of Naish you have. I have seen an 11'4 Nalu that a friend bought used and it had pressure digs all over and it was discolored. He said it was a rental board. My Nalu is 8 years old and been through the ringer , slammed on shore and dragged across the rocks by my kids. It's still in great shape.
My understanding was you wanted a board for big mushburgers, and needed to make sections.?
L41 Kirk has been spending a lot of time lately on a board that looks a lot like this one, only 28" wide.
https://www.facebook.com/L41Surfcraft/photos/a.366962713365039.83365.322135507847760/1023731141021523/?type=3&theater
He goes out on a lot of boards for testing, I presume, but has been surfing longer boards lately.
It seems to be the kind of thing you would be looking for and I am sure he would a custom shape./build.
I like it. Kirk is expanding his line in a popular range. No doubt Jeff Clark's board will get you big wave speed you're looking for. It's no Nalu, more a big wave gun. Maybe that's what you need. My idea of a mushburger is a big bump with a weak crumbling lip. They are not usually that fast even when they are big. Not exactly a gun wave.
Jeff Clark is an awesome idea. Will head down to his shop tomorrow.
I just flat water paddled a 10.8 Hanalei, feels like such a tanker. But hard to tell on flat water of course.
My main priority isn't mushburgers. The main wave this is for is a fast crazy barreling freight train. But since these boards are so expensive I'm trying to find something that I can also surf enjoyably on big mushburgers. But the priority is the hard breaking wave.
You're going to need two different boards....... at the very least.
> you'll need 2 boards
The 10.6 x 28" Nalu that I just broke surfed both breaks in question awesomely.
I know there's tradeoffs, just trying to make the compromises as intelligently as possible.
And I have a big giant longboard for the really small days.
Quote from: wrybread on January 12, 2016, 04:59:05 PM
> you'll need 2 boards
The 10.6 x 28" Nalu that I just broke surfed both breaks in question awesomely.
I know there's tradeoffs, just trying to make the compromises as intelligently as possible.
And I have a big giant longboard for the really small days.
You definitely should demo some boards before purchasing...if you ever make it down to Santa Barbara, we have a pretty big fleet of demo boards...
I'd suggest our 10'3" x 29.5" Mahalo for starters...
BTW, I went to college and lived 10 years up in Humboldt...I think I know your venue...we used to go down there around PA for surf trips...;-)
I'm in my 11th year of standup...I don't run from barrels...and, I haven't buckled one of our boards yet...
All boards break...wrong place right time...right time wrong place...but, we haven't had one of our wood veneer production boards buckle yet...in fact, our 11'1" One World was the only board to survive multiple trips to one of our mysto reefs that was featured awhile back in the mags...
I'll put our California, USA made vacuum bagged wood veneers with Ballis-Tech (ballistic) glassing up against ANY Cobra factory board for strength and durability...let alone performance...;-)
We've got some of the most core riders from Central Cal all the way up to Canada riding them...actually, we've shipped a bunch up to Alaska wave riders, also...
http://blog.surfingsports.com/sup-sports-board-overview
All of our boards are configurable to your exact specifications with very fast turnaround times...
http://supsports.com/standup-paddle-boards/california-custom-series
I would also add that with a quad + 1 setup and the detail we take to make sure that the included high quality fin set matches the rider and venue, you will be able to optimize the board to the type of wave...hollow or mushy...
If the "Freight train" wave is your priority this board would work. You might be able to save some money and find one used. I have the 12 foot PSH gun which is a great board but probably too big for you?
http://paddlesurfhawaii.com/the-boards/progressive-series-stand-up-paddle-boards/10-6-gun-ripper/
Another one to consider, I been really loving my 9'6 Focus Classic in their new Core Flex construction.
A performance longboard that can take on big and fast and and slow and mushy mushy, no probs.
The Core flex construction feels smooth and snappy. very durable, best strength to weight ratio I've experienced, looks sharp too!
I'm 5'11, 180lbs, and the 9'6x29" feels perfect, but they also make it in 10'0x30. I'm in NorCal (Oakland) I surf anywhere between Bolinas to Santa Cruz, I'm happy to meet up if you wanted to try it out. Nothing like being able to try before you buy.
Wrybread,
I think your own, initial, conclusions were a step in the right direction, Jimmy Lewis makes the most durable boards for the wave you've described, and they ride a heavy wave very well. When I mean very well, I'm talking about a smooth ride. That construction is not as stiff as other production boards I have ridden, and on a fast, critical wave it really helps stay in control. My favorite ride for large, angry waves is the Stun Gun, we have the 8'2", the 8'7" and the 9'2" for paddling into waves that require high entry speed. I use to own a 9'5" Striker a few years back, I bought it thinking it would be fun to mess around on when the waves were waist high and down. However, it ended up being the most competent board in the quiver. Back then I had a Starby 8'2" Widepoint, and a 8'10" Widepoint, the Striker was superior. That started me on the JL path. I own boards from several manufacturers, JP, Infinity, Imagine, and I love them all for their different attributes, but if you need a board to tame a large, fast wave....Jimmy Lewis is your man......in my humble opinion.
This all depends on what your definition of 'Big' is.
Big to me starts at 15 feet. What this means is that my 10 foot board starts to feel small.
Over 15 feet the waves are typically longer period and moving very fast. There is nothing like getting into an 18+ foot wave early without a death defying drop. The only way to do this is with a 'big' board, I prefer a 12 footer.
I have been surfing countless times when people bring out there 9' 6" and cannot catch big waves. Then they go deeper inside and eventually get pounded, or worse buckle their boards and don't return.
Durability??? This is my Jeff Clark board that has been broken in half once and buckled 4+ times and had the fin boxes blown out . . . 6 years later it is my go-to board in anything that is consistently from 9 to 15 feet.
This is what it looks like to 'get in early' on waves over 15 feet. 12' board required. The waves a simply TOO FAST to catch comfortably on a 10 foot board.
You will paddle your a-s off, be completely winded and then find yourself air dropping off off Godzilla beak.
These larger boards are highly specialized good for very large, and also very small waves (like 2 to 4 feet).
At a place like Mavericks the minimum size SUP should be an 11' 6". Unless you want to catch them in the bowl, like Garrett Macnamara, then you should be fine once again with a 9' 6" 8)
I totally agree with Beascho That for huge ways Custom is the ONLY way to go And it needs to be from a reputable shaper that has an intimate understanding of that wave.
but for general bigger waves it is hard to beat a production board for durability (your Naish held up pretty well till the end) and proven shapes Not to mention warranty and price.
OR you could split the difference and go with a Sunova semi custom and get the best of all worlds
Again just my thoughts
JimK
If you want to pick up another 28" Nalu, PM me. I have a buddy who has one for sale pretty cheap.
Stock boards not working:
I have a 10'1 gun and 9'6gun, both Joe blairs. Super durable. Ive used the 9'6 on big days at Hanalei and avalanches. I was fine on that size,,but the conditions made it easy. I like the 10'1 for all the reasons beasho said. For down the line surfing, in big stuff I like the quad set up in a 10ft board or above. I personally like the extra width on Joes boards,,the thin rails make up for width. Sup is so superior in big waves,,,good to see guys charging all over the globe now.
Give Joe a look though, 1200 or so for a custom board,,and it surfs really well
Thanks for all the awesome tips. I'm a little worried about going the custom route just since surf season is already half over, and with the usual delay or two I wouldn't have it until its too late. Maybe that'll be my Spring project.
And of course "big" waves are super relative, especially in the internet era when we all see what big Mavericks / Todos / Jaws looks like. I'm not talking about those waves, and Garrett McNamerra I ain't. But I love to go out right up until our break maxes out, meaning you can't paddle out anyway and its closing out. But I'm often the only taker or one of the very few when it gets big, and I love being out on those massive days when the Coast Guard is checking on people to see if they need a rescue. Monday was a good one, the buoys were 13 @ 20 and it seemed like every set was bigger than the last. Easily pushing TOH and sooooooo clean. One of those days you can think about when you can't sleep and you fall right to sleep.
And for whatever its worth, my 28" Nalu has never felt undergunned, but maybe I'm just used to it and the tradeoffs. It definitely feels like a dangerous amount of board when I flirt with the barrel, but I can't imagine a SUP not feeling like that. Would be great to try something more purpose built for the conditions.
And there's a nearby reef that absolutely jacks on big long period swells, and I'd love to go shoulder hop that on some big clean swell sometime...
And agreed, SUP frickin rules for big waves. Its like having super powers. Being able to see much better, and cover ground, and fight currents, and have all that extra speed on the takeoff, makes big waves soooo much easier. After running out of SUP boards on Monday I paddled out on my prone board and even just paddling 50 yards to adjust for position was a chore. And you have to do that *all the time* when its big. On a SUP that's nothing.
You have a point about customs. You will miss the entire season waiting for your board. I personally would go find one of Clarks boards in a shop. You won't be disappointed.
I agree with all your points, we used to tow a lot. I loved rolling into stuff early,,stalling and getting sucked into the middle of mother nature,,so.cool. sup allows for the same set up, minus all the gas and gear. I'll jump to my belly and paddle into a few,,seems to keep the grumbling off my back,,but it's such an inferior way in mind to surf big stuff. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
+1 to talking with Kirk (L41). His turn-around time is pretty good and his boards can take a serious beating (put on carbon rails). Send him your size, riding style and typical break and he'll set you up. His bread and butter are the SIMS shapes, but he does a lot more.
denton's cove! nice!
Quote from: wrybread on January 12, 2016, 11:32:40 AM
And I have a loooong history of buying the wrong board so I'm trying to avoid that this time around.
Wow I sure can relate to this statement!
For me buying off the shelf boards was a very expensive and unfruitful way to go about finding the right board. That all changed when I went with a local shaper and stuck with him even when I received boards that didn't work for me. Every once in a while I am tempted by the siren song of the immediate gratification of an off the shelf board and then I remember how much more I enjoy custom boards, even with a long wait.
I am wondering where your quiver and your surfing would be today if after breaking that first board you committed to a local shaper and custom boards built for you and that wave?
I echo the recommendations for shapers Clark or Kirk and Stretch had some SUP guns at the factory a couple months ago, I suspect any of the three will provide you with an amazing experience that will be worth the wait. Maybe they will have a demo board to get you through the winter?
Good advice Clay.
I've had a few custom boards (never a SUP) made over the years, but have never really developed a relationship with a shaper. And its always irritated me that SUPs are more like kayaks in the limited variety of make / models (big companies make them, and in any given lineup most people have the same brand boards) than old school shapers responding to regional preferences and cultures. So that does it! I'm heading down to Jeff Clark's new SUP shop tomorrow. I'm hoping I can buy off the rack to start, and then get a custom v2 board made once I know the changes I need. Thanks all for the nudges and great advice.
My one nagging fear at this point is that I'm hard on boards, especially out of the water, so getting a foam / glass board scares me a bit, compared to the relative indestructability of, say, a Jimmy Lewis.
But please feel free to comment if anyone thinks of any other suggestions or opinions on any of the above.
The Shaper Surfer relationship is very important.
http://thesterlingspencer.com
+1 re L41 durability--my s3 is near perfect after more than a year, as is my widepoint after several--my AW carbon is a complete beater, after 11 months only. i assumed the L41 would be the weakest of the bunch--wrong--it's been very tough
I'm hard on boards OUT of the water. Clumsy and bad shoulders--they give out a lot when I'm picking the board overhead. The L41 is easy to keep pristine because it tosses around like a shortboard. No long nose or tail to whack. I think I'm going of two years with mine without a repair. That's a record for me. My Foote 10'4" doesn't have any repairs either, in fact it hardly has a mark on it, but that's because it's bulletproof and has RSPRo on the rails. It's fast, but not as fast as the L41, which is just a little bullet--once it's in the wave. total dog otherwise, like paddling a manhole cover.
similar sense here, pb--L41 is great in the wave, very fast down the line, but noticeably more challenging to paddle in and around--and i, too, have rsp on it--i really enjoy this board on nice smoother days--the relative paddling challenge makes it my second choice when im in 15+ lbs of rubber, and if it's windy/sloppy
i have rsp on my AW ltd carbon and the rail under it is perfect, and the uncovered part of the rail is a disgrace--completely chipped from the end of the rsp to the nose, all in many spots on the nose--and it dings easily, too--paddle whacks that might slightly dent my other boards chip the paint, if any had remained on it in the first place, and tend to crunch/powder the carbon layer--i was going to ignore, but when beginning repair of an serious ding (a paddle whack that left a straight line 4 inch crack--wouldnt have even been a problem on my other boards), i sucked on some of the crunched spots--well, they were all leaky, so i had to cut them out and repair 3 add'l dings--lame--disappointing--i hope fanatic has improved their carbon skin, and reformulated their paint---clearly something was wrong with the 2015 in the bond btwn the paint and the carbon skin-and the carbon skin has proven weak also-and the damned thing came in at appx 21lbs with stock fins no leash--very heavy for a carbon board, and only a couple pounds lighter than the aw hrs which ias much cheaper and more durable--bummer pricey board that ill not be able to sell, it looks like such crap now--saving grace is i love the ride, and it's a great winter board for me at my suize--but wow has the construction been a total disappointment
oh and i had to peel of a bit of rsp to access a ding--the paint barely resisted--all the paint under the rail tape pulled right off, as did a bunch that extended beyond what had been under the tape--left a jagged mess of chipped paint--i have pulled back rsp on all my other board, same as with the aw, with a touch of warmth from my heat gun, and there were no paint issues--the 2015 is paint is crap--whatever, ill be done with repairs in time for the weekend. sunday in these parts should proved nice waves for spots that can handle a bit of west in the wind
I've had similar experiences with the rails on my 10.6x30 Naish. The shell itself holds up alright to chipping (it chips but doesn't seem to be a biggie), but it has artwork stickered on the rails! What genius thought that was a good idea? Even the best paddler knocks their rails from time to time, so its absolutely guaranteed to look beat up after just a few sessions. I tried putting rail tape over it, but once that started peeling I stupidly pulled the rest off and it pulled off not only the stupid artwork but also chunks of gell coat or whatever its called on a SUP.
Crazy.
And don't get me started on the Pau Hana boards. When I first started SUPing I borrowed a friend's pristine Pau Hana "Noserider" to see if I wanted to buy it. I think she'd been on the thing only once, and probably mostly knee paddling. It had logo design on the rails too, and being a newbie at the time of course I bumped it a few times, and then the board didn't look so pristine anymore. And the ridiculous laser cut deck pad peeled too, so I was forced to buy the stupid thing even though I could tell even as a SUP newbie that this thing wasn't actually meant for waves. That board almost turned me off to SUPing, since I thought all SUPs sucked that badly. And she got me good on that one, $1000 for that piece of crap. In her eyes I'd broken it, so I was buying it, nevermind that I completely babied the thing. Oh well, its good to keep around for people with no SUP experience, and I have fantasies of taking it out salmon fishing sometime.
Behold the ridiculous deck padding and logo placement of the Pau Hana boards:
https://cdn-img-1.wanelo.com/p/583/3d0/b91/c487ed1c7c22105c6f03b33/x354-q80.jpg
A monument to stupidity and the tendency of some board manufacturers to make their boards only to look nice on the rack.
Interestingly my older Naish (the sadly discontinued 10.6x28) didn't have anything stickered on the rails, and it has a couple of little chips on the rails but its much less prominent when there's not artwork getting ruined.
Anyway, I'm curious about the L41, though it sounds like a vaguely similar board to the Jimmy Lewis Stun Gun, which I didn't like. The board itself is obviously great but its not really appropriate for where I surf, where I have to paddle a good 1/2 mile to get outside on some days, and I'm spoiled and love to get in nice and early. Love the description that its like paddling a manhole cover, I know exactly what you mean.
L41 is custom and kirk is attentive--least that was my exp a year ago
Quote from: wrybread on January 13, 2016, 08:59:11 AM
... I'm a little worried about going the custom route just since surf season is already half over, and with the usual delay or two I wouldn't have it until its too late.
While that may be true for some SUP companies that can build custom boards from what some people are saying...it certainly isn't true for my company...;-)
We have a board going to Tony on the Oregon Coast...11 days from the time he ordered and I started working on the CAD file...
In fact, we have powered boards out in 1 week if the planets align...it's shocked a couple of clients because they were still getting their funds together...;-)
http://blog.surfingsports.com/2016/01/california-usa-built-sups.html
We keep lots of CNC cut EPS foam blanks in stock...if the board order is close to one of those then you can save a week or two at the longest waiting for the close tolerance machine cut to get delivered...our vacuum bagged wood veneer boards glassed with a clear cloth material similar to Kevlar and Powerline stringers, take more time...but, still we are kicking these out within 3-4 weeks if we have a blank that's close...and, there isn't a stronger build out there that I have seen in my 11 years of selling SUPs...
http://supsports.com/standup-paddle-boards/california-custom-series
We have a couple of those going through right now on record pace...just came out of the vac bags yesterday after having the wood veneers applied for Mike on the Oregon Coast and a local guy, Brian, back for another custom...in fact, we have lots of repeat clients for our custom boards...as well as our production boards...
http://supsports.com/customer-testimonials
Frickin awesome Wardog. I'm borrowing a friend's JL Qwad this weekend, if I can secure a loan for a couple of weeks I'll be giving you a call.
Quote from: wrybread on January 14, 2016, 10:17:08 AM
Anyway, I'm curious about the L41, though it sounds like a vaguely similar board to the Jimmy Lewis Stun Gun, which I didn't like. The board itself is obviously great but its not really appropriate for where I surf, where I have to paddle a good 1/2 mile to get outside on some days, and I'm spoiled and love to get in nice and early. Love the description that its like paddling a manhole cover, I know exactly what you mean.
A lot of the talk is about Kirk's SIMS shape. He'd talk with you about your needs and would shape a board to fit them (he also makes longboards, guns, shortboards, etc). My L41 is the most solid custom board I've ever owned (SUP or surf). I'm pretty sure Stretch does his glassing. Put on carbon rails and a carbon deck patch and it will be rock solid.
A few of my friends ride SUPsports WD/Stokes. My buddies' boards are too big for my 145 lbs frame, but I really like the shape and rocker on them. One is over 220 lbs and uses the 9'6 x 32". He loves it. Get the right length/width/volume and one of those could be a good option to consider too (from what I understand what you are looking for). I've tried three different constructions and some were definitely better than others (cough....go cali built...cough).
I hear reluctance, I'd sure be hesitant to pull the trigger after breaking 3 boards. Choosing a SUP is challenging and I empathize with your dilemma and sincerely hope you find a great board.
I can recommend carbon rails, I already gave my new Stretch a few good paddle whacks and not a scratch, definitely a great upgrade.
SUP seems so relatively new and unknown to me that I was very reluctant to get a custom, especially since the resale of sups in norcal is so slow. Then I had an experience that convinced me that a custom SUP is the best for me. I demoed a production 8'4" simsup and although I loved the light weight I flailed around for 2 hours and didn't catch a single wave. So I asked Kirk and he recommended I try the 8'8". I didn't think 4" would make much difference, and I was wrong as I was very stable on that board and had a really fun session. But the tail seemed so wide and the board a bit clunky so I was hesitant and waited for a used one, fortunately I found a used custom that is 5 litres smaller and the same shape. Wow! Huge difference from the production version, the custom feels so alive and responsive. First SUP session I had that I thought wow I want to try this in the winter.
I wish I had gone custom sooner I'm sure I would have made the transition from prone to full time SUP a lot sooner if I had the custom boards I have now.
I hope this helps.
Thanks all, this has been a great thread. I was in a rush to have something for this swell so I picked up the jl hanalei. Had a nice warmup session two days ago before the main swell got here (but still some fun ones, buoys 10@12) and promptly got one of my best rides of the year. Rides a lot like my nalu but a good notch faster so I kept making sections that I thought were going to be road blocks. And gets in almost criminally easy. Two stoke takeoffs.
Then yesterday I was out in probably the biggest waves I've ever been on, buoy pushing 15 @ 22. Some amazing forerunners to the giant swell. It's a weird swell, very very clean but weirdly slow breaking and soft. Almost like an open ocean swell, and so big that it's crumbling waaaay outside. Very challenging to get into. Of the 6 takers (all prone but me and my friend) most got skunked but we managed a couple. I got my one and done set wave and called it a day.
My other friend broke his board on the paddle out (a Sic "carbon" that upon examination had hilariously little carbon), and I got caught by a few that probably would have broken my nalu again, but my jl is still in one piece and looking beautiful. It's going to take me a little while to get used to its battleship-ness, but that (with smaller fins) plus a smaller and more playful board for smaller days should make a great quiver. Wardog, we'll be talking.
And a shout out for Stay Covered leashes. I got the 10' heavy leash and it took a beating and didn't snap.
Quote from: wrybread on January 17, 2016, 08:06:37 AM
Then yesterday I was out in probably the biggest waves I've ever been on, buoy pushing 15 @ 22.
OK That's big. 8)
Great stuff glad you were getting it. Maybe again today 17 @ 18 feet +?
At this point it gets serious and I am going to emphasize
You're crazy unless you:
1) Switch to a Waist Leash
2) Use an 18+ foot leash
3) Wear at least one form of flotation - An O'Neill Gooru under your wetsuit for example
The other day I was out at Mavericks. I counted 9 out of 10 guys with float. The lineup now give guys grief if THEY ARE
NOT WEARING FLOAT.
Most use CO2 driven float but think of Garrett MacNamara trying to engage his flotation with a disconnected arm. FLOAT SHOULD BE ALWAYS ON.
I got pummeled recently after catching a wave, riding and then having it close out at full speed. This was a big wave, not Mavericks, that my TRACE recorded at 32.7 mph. Crashing at speed is one of the worst situations because you travel underwater further, and for longer. I was fine after the first wave. Then the second wave hit. I dove under, was dragged and came back up pretty whipped. Then the 3rd wave hit, I was dragged, running low and came up
cooked. Then the 4th wave hit. I was beyond cooked, taken down and all I could do go fetal and chill letting my leash pull backwards and me up like a fishing lure confident that my float would bring me to the surface. Fortunately the beatings ended at 4 and I paddled to safety. I almost called it a day, you know when your vision turns a little foggy and it feels like the saltwater foam has saturated 1/2" into your skin. I paddled back out and caught a few more but without float I would have been finished, or worse.
Oof yeah I know that foggy vision that you're talking about after a good beating.
And ditto on the floatation, everyone here wears it and helmets (well, most do) when it gets to size. I've been experimenting with wearing my 7 mil dive suit and it's 7 mil hood vest. That's suuuper buoyant and comparable to a pfd. Really nice to cork up after a beating. Takes some getting used to get under the wave but it's doable. I started the dive suit method when we had that freezing weather with the icy NE winds a few weeks ago, and it was great for that, but it sucked yesterday. I had to go swimming to cool off. And I had so much adrenaline that my arms were getting tired and shaky and the decreased mobility of the thick suit wasn't helping. Next time, traditional pfd.
Interesting about the waist leash, I'll look into that. Got a brand recommendation?
And yeah on giant swell today but I dont think we're going to get a wind window. Tomorrow though is looking promising. I love MLK swells!
While we're on the subject, add this to the list of safety gear on big days: a whistle. Hell it's a good idea on any sized day. If you're hurt on the inside it might be awhile before someone notices unless you can signal.
I've tried a few of the small whistles and these are by far the loudest I've found:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0011E93XE?vs=1
QuoteAn O'Neill Gooru under your wetsuit for example
Do you have a special wetsuit made for that?
I know it would be better under the wet suit but Can it be worn on the outside?
fyi
Totos Santos big wave tour is live rite now (9:30 Sun)
http://www.worldsurfleague.com/events/2015/mbwt/1340/todos-santos-challenge/live
Most of the prone paddlers at my spot wear their pfds under their wetsuits, but I think that's largely because it's a lot different to be lying on the thing. You'd want the doodads covered by something. All the SUPs just wear regular over the wetsuit pfds.
Interestingly the day before a big swell lots of folks are wearing their helmets and pfds to get used to the feel of paddling in them.
I wear float a lot now. I cut down my Gooru to leave more belly exposed, it was limiting my diaphragm movement and making it tougher to get a full breath. All too familiar with the weird vision thing. I get dark areas to the sides and foggy in front. This morning I looked down while lifting my coffee and refilled the cup from my sinuses. So I got that going for me. Freshness worth a second cup.
Quote from: Tom on January 17, 2016, 09:45:55 AM
QuoteAn O'Neill Gooru under your wetsuit for example
Do you have a special wetsuit made for that?
I know it would be better under the wet suit but Can it be worn on the outside?
I am 5' 8" 180. I buy the XXL Short suit and it all seems to fit inside the suit.
Looks a little goofy outside, other people do wear them like that (but who am I to judge). Under the suit is sleek, streamlined and makes you look like Mr Incredible with abs. The other side benefit is warmth. Because you are wearing the vest you can get away with a thinner, less expensive suit. I wear the following set-up regardless of size, from 2 to 20. Beyond that I put on another life jacket.
https://vimeo.com/59367681
About how high are you guys floating with this extra float?
I recently got a 5mm front/3mm back triathlon farmer John.
It is closed cell and really floaty. I put a 2mm closed cell
Matuse front-zip top over it.
I float - bob - pretty high - my mouth was about 5" out of the water.
My shoulders were at least an inch, maybe two, out of the water.
I was thinking of getting a Gooru-type vest. But maybe I don't need
it with that setup.
Quote from: Subber on January 17, 2016, 01:01:36 PM
About how high are you guys floating with this extra float?
Waterline about 2" below my shoulders sitting vertically in the water with Gooru and rib protector.
I broke my leash last week in big conditions and it sure is nice when you are swimming in with float. There is NO concern that you will drown. Just take your time, turn and face the next boomer, dive under and then continue towards shore. Low stress.
Under the wetsuit is better if you can. I've had over the wetsuit nearly ripped off. Came up with it pulled partially over my head. It was tight too. Didnt matter. Rag dolled can do amazing things.
Quote from: wrybread on January 17, 2016, 09:35:56 AM
While we're on the subject, add this to the list of safety gear on big days: a whistle.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0011E93XE?vs=1
The guys in the lineup are going to love me. I have already added a camelbak, so this whistle will stow nicely.
My other trick is to bring 2 Cutie oranges every time I surf, stuffed into my suit. After ~ 7 waves I eat one. It ALWAYS gives a boost. Like a natural gel pack. I eat the second when I think I am more than half way through the session. People often comment "Where's the red and white table top? Would you like a scone and coffee with that?"
Awesome idea about the oranges. And camelback.
Quote from: DW on January 18, 2016, 04:54:48 AM
Under the wetsuit is better if you can. I've had over the wetsuit nearly ripped off. Came up with it pulled partially over my head. It was tight too. Didnt matter. Rag dolled can do amazing things.
I wear it under the suit as well. This summer while getting drilled in only the gooru and shorties I had the same experience, terrible. It was half pulled off over my head and I'm under water trying to get up. I now pull a loose fit Lycra surf shirt over it, so far no repeats.
Quote from: Beasho on January 17, 2016, 01:25:27 PM
I broke my leash last week in big conditions and it sure is nice when you are swimming in with float.
Do you have a solution for the paddle? I recently had a long swim that was considerably longer due to the paddle carrying hampering my stroke.
I read of little paddle leash that you attach when needed and just then just swim in pulling it along.
Quote from: surfinJ on January 18, 2016, 09:11:47 AM
Quote from: DW on January 18, 2016, 04:54:48 AM
Under the wetsuit is better if you can. I've had over the wetsuit nearly ripped off. Came up with it pulled partially over my head. It was tight too. Didnt matter. Rag dolled can do amazing things.
I wear it under the suit as well. This summer while getting drilled in only the gooru and shorties I had the same experience, terrible. It was half pulled off over my head and I'm under water trying to get up. I now pull a loose fit Lycra surf shirt over it, so far no repeats.
Quote from: Beasho on January 17, 2016, 01:25:27 PM
I broke my leash last week in big conditions and it sure is nice when you are swimming in with float.
It has a couple of eyelets that you can use to attach to your boardshorts.
I picked up a Gooru for a slightly different reason. After the dfib box was installed I was nervous about prone paddling out. Used it all summer and enjoyed the extra float.
Have used it in bigger surf and it sure is nice to float and bob around and BREATHE after going for a swim..
Quote from: surfinJ on January 18, 2016, 09:11:47 AM
Do you have a solution for the paddle? I recently had a long swim that was considerably longer due to the paddle carrying hampering my stroke.
I read of little paddle leash that you attach when needed and just then just swim in pulling it along.
Add a loop to your boardshorts to push the handle through. If you put the loop on the side the paddle doesn't interfere with kick. You can also use the key loop in the pocket of most shorts or even just the laces for the shorts to tie the paddle to you. Works OK. Better than my old method of shoving the handle through my shorts.
A loop on a wetsuit can be added by anyone adept with a sewing machine or just use a needle and thread. A dab of Shoe Goo on the thread keeps the neoprene from tearing. Or use an NSI flexible loop and just stick it on. That glue sticks to anything as long as it's dry.
Boardshorts? What's that? Is that some sort of wetsuit undergarment?
Just kidding.
+1 on it being super nice to have floatation on those long swims. I've been trying to hone a sidestroke with my paddle out in front held by the front arm, with the blade upside down and holding me up. Works ok but still sloooow.
Well another day another broken leash. Had to swim all the way in and for a moment I thought I lost my new board!
Anyway was talking to one of the super badasses at my break today and he had a good point about wearing his pfd under his wetsuit: it catches less water that way. No parachute effect.
I was wearing my kayak pfd today for the first time, which is a bit floatier than I'd like, and it had me pretty paranoid about getting caught inside since it's so hard to get under them. So I was staying way wide of the crowd. And of course the moment I paddled in front of the crowd a cleanup set came and sure enough dragged me much farther than usual. Oh well, at least everyone else got dragged too.
Anyway, wondering if anyone has found a pfd that's good for surfing? For me that would mean:
- not a lot of straps
- not too floaty
- black
- maybe fits under a wetsuit
I haven't seen anything that's perfect, but the Da Kine vest looks pretty good. It looks especially good on the lovely Brazillian charger whose name I forget. If I wasn't thirty years older than her (Hmmm, probably forty) I'd certainly remember it better. Zipper in the front, which is great for a little cleavage, but that may not be what you're looking for Wry.
(http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/server700/70a5c/products/499/images/4178/Dakine_Surface_Impact_Vest__18748.1452625663.1280.1280.jpg?c=2)
Pono's pic of the Dakine is the one I use. I had one, it was stolen, then went to an O'Neill pullover. I missed the Dakine, and the O'Neill just wasn't constructed as well, wore out pretty fast. I am now back to another Dakine: floatier, better construction, and the zipper is excellent.
I'm looking to double the float, that looks like the ticket. The way you float in the blue water isn't the same as in the white water of the impact zone.
And thanks for the leash tips, super easy fix Pono. Next time I'll be ready.
I wear the O'Niel Techno Comp, now called the Gooru Tech Comp. It comes in black.
http://us.oneill.com/shop/wetsuits/mens/wake-waterski-vests/
.
My wife has a dakine that is not in any catalog and never was. She bought it on a surf trip to Oahu. It's a real deal special big wave vest complete with handle sewn behind neck for sled driver to grab. It has lots of serious buckles. It stays put.
Well, yesterday evening I definitely saw some limitations to my 10.8 Hanalei in big surf. It wasn't huge but it was super unruly. The buoys were about 15 @ 17, but I'd say the surf didn't quite feel as big as you'd think from those numbers. The big issue was the wind, which was absolutely howling side/offshore. It was more side than off, and making a *lot* of bump, and when taking off I just couldn't generate any speed. With the big long period waves I just couldn't get enough speed to catch them. I've been out in those conditions (minus the wind) a few times with my 10.8 Hanalei and could catch them passably, but the bump and 12+ knot headwind was a total dealbreaker.
I was with two friends though, both on 12' Paddle Surf Hawaii guns (good tip @lopezwill), who were paddling into them like it was clean and glassy. It was pretty unreal to watch, they'd hardly even have to paddle hard. I'd be watching and thinking no way is he going to catch that wave, and next thing I know he's flying down the line and making sections. I literally couldn't catch a single wave.
Anyway, looks like my hopes of a 2 board quiver just aren't going to happen.
And on a sidenote, anyone know of a 12' PSH board for sale?
Quote from: wrybread on January 23, 2016, 12:07:21 PM
I was with two friends though, both on 12' Paddle Surf Hawaii guns (good tip @lopezwill), who were paddling into them like it was clean and glassy. It was pretty unreal to watch, they'd hardly even have to paddle hard. I'd be watching and thinking no way is he going to catch that wave, and next thing I know he's flying down the line and making sections. I literally couldn't catch a single wave.
It's interesting to read a perspective and relate 100% to the opposite view.
There have been numerous times when I am out on my 12 foot PSH gun catching waves exactly like you describe with guys on 9 and 10 foot boards scratching and catching nothing. The 12 foot board just glides in like a Cadillac. It is not necessarily easy, rather the board has a higher top end. You will feel it at the end of the day and it definitely takes more energy to get a board to ~12 mph to release than just 8 mph (with a 10 footer for example). The other thing I learned this fall was to bend my knees. The 12 footer has such a big footprint, and you are going so fast that it all tends to bounce around a lot and will throw you.
Paddle hard, stay low and the world is your oyster.