Author Topic: kneeling on a SUP  (Read 10942 times)

rkdjones

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kneeling on a SUP
« on: July 16, 2009, 12:03:32 PM »
I'm a lake paddler.  It is nice to paddle around on glassy water before the motor boats turn the lake into a washing machine, or the wind comes up and makes every stroke an effort.  Of course, when things get bad I just kneel and paddle for more stability and less wind resistance.

I recently made an inclined kneeling seat that I can just sit on my board and I use a canoe paddle.  I found it to be a pleasure to paddle from a kneeling position with a comfortable seat.  There is less windage than any boat because boards have virtually no freeboard.  Now, when conditions are miserable to stand up I can still get some paddling in.  It is never going to be as fast as a kayak, but it gets me on the water with minimum fuss.  I'd love to try it with a real downwind board.

Robert

clayfeeter

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2009, 12:06:54 PM »
Hey Robert,
I paddle on both lakes and the ocean here in NH... and if conditions are windy we just do a downwinder; leave a car at the destination... it's a hoot.
      -also, when you kneel you take away the advantage of a long paddle; you have to "choke up" on it, which is inefficient and makes you feel like you should switch to a canoe paddle.

...and also!: the new, long glider boards can actually catch and ride motorboat wake; just takes some practice to get the hang of it.

I kind of feel it's totally ok to kneel to take a break, but the whole idea of sup is... well, standing up!
             Clay
« Last Edit: July 16, 2009, 12:13:31 PM by clayfeeter »
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Rogue Wave

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2009, 01:29:31 PM »
Robert

How 'bout posting some pics of your setup -- I'd love to see how you have it set up. It would be great for people who don't have good balance.

It's amazing how much more power you get when you're choked up on the paddle and close to the water.

I agree with Clay though and I feel that I'm wimping out if I sit or stand on a board (unless there is a big head-wind).
« Last Edit: July 16, 2009, 01:33:05 PM by Rogue Wave »
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Piros

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2009, 02:26:32 PM »
My buddy just loved to kneel when the wind came up in the surf , I would be constantly in his ear to stay standing because when a wave came he would jump to his feet and paddle for the wave but most times miss it because he was only half balanced when paddling for it.

After a couple of months he just sick of hearing "Stand Up" and got off his knees , he is now rock solid on his feet in all conditions and he has way more endurance in his legs and his surfing has even improved.

Moral of this story: - You can't beat time on your legs to improve your balance and fitness. So when you can stay on your feet.

With downwinds they aren't always downwind, wind direction often changes so you need to get used to paddling through sidewinds or sometimes into headwinds.

Rob
« Last Edit: July 16, 2009, 02:33:06 PM by Piros »
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bigdom

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2009, 02:38:16 PM »
no shame in kneeling when its choppy and windy or
to help get through the whitewater

im not proud !

lopezwill

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2009, 02:54:08 PM »

  I agree no problem knee paddling in wind and chop.  I surfed a wonderful reef break last week in 30 plus mph off shore winds.  I had to knee paddle most all of the time.  I would stand up quick when a wave came through and paddle into it.  This place had kelp so I would hang onto the kelp while waiting for a set.  Talk about a challenge?  A few laydown surfers couldn't make it down the face of the waves at all due to the heavy winds. 

  The alternative for me would have been to wait out until the winds possibly died down.  Meanwhile, perfect 3 to 5 foot peelers were rolling off the reef.  I'm glad I stayed out there!  This day was the most memorable for me so far this summer and I surf most days.  I say knee paddle when you want or have to.  It's all good!

lopezwill

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2009, 08:14:37 PM »


  Look...here are some photos of the windy day.  Hope this worked.

jjue

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2009, 07:21:44 AM »
As a beginning   standup paddle surfer  one of the  threads  I  keep coming back to  is this early one from Blane Chambers in which  he  discusses canoe paddle surfing  ,   in which   punching out and take offs are done on the knee  with a canoe paddle and then  rising  to standing once the wave is caught ...  Blane   does  a good job in this thread  discussing the issue of safety and newbies in the surfzone  as well . .   I know this  has not been discussed much  but there are  a lot of begining  folks   like myself who  can  stand up  paddle our   big boards on flat water  or  in the ocean out of the   surf zone  but who  are total kooks  in the surf zone  having absolutely no surf experience and not beginning as surfers before going to standup .   I wonder if we would be better served  starting out  on our knees   with  shorter canoe  paddles  moving away from the crowds finding some   small breaks  , maybe even  riding  a few   waves in on our knees  and then   try standing  up   on our board once  the wave comes and learning this way  to surf  first before trying to  learning to surf with our  big stand up paddles  from the stand up position . . Blane makes a point that punching out through the surf  is   easier anyway on  the knees balance wise .. Newbies will be perhaps a little less  kook like  and perhaps less dangerous going out   on our knees with a short canoe paddle and falling off our boards from a kneeling position with a short  paddle , rather than  falling off our   big boards  with a huge long  SUp paddle  from the standing position  either punching  out  or   trying to take our first waves....  thoughts ???  Maybe an adjustable paddle like the C4 Stendy might   be useful, so we could have a shorter canoe like paddle in the surf  zone to knee paddle  and  a longer standup paddle to paddle standup style  out of the surf zone .   , or to use standup paddle surfing once we get the hang of canoe paddle surfing  first   ...

http://www2.swaylocks.com/node/1019025

Blane's comments    when he was canoe paddle surfing ...

" I knee paddle instead of Stand Up paddle to get in.... After trying so many different paddles I found the 48" Kialoa Dave's Hybrid is the best overall surfing paddle for my ability and surfing style. Its short which allows you to get low on turns when needed.... You may have to try different ones to suit you... If you are gonna Stand Up paddle, you can make your paddle one open hand span, pinky to thumb over your head. That's a good place to start.

Get plenty practice before you head out into the waves by sprinting in flat water. Once you get the stroke down you can head out into the surf... Make sure no one is around... Getting into a wave kneeling goes like this.... Most important thing is to be lined up straight and get that momentum up. Stroke hard! Get that baby up to a speedy glide and maybe even an extra couple strokes for good measure...
 

From here you can see I'm planting my hands and after awhile you don't even notice the paddle there... ......
 
It takes plenty practice! If you're gonna Stand Up paddle, it takes even more practice.... Be safe... That's a huge board your swinging around!  "



I guess   one  of the issues     I want to bring up  . is whether  a progressive program of either  paddle surf instruction or    self taught  paddle surfing   might  be based on a program of first learning   canoe paddle surfing from a kneeling position and then progressing to full time  standup paddle surfing ....
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 07:45:15 AM by jjue »

PonoBill

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2009, 07:42:44 AM »
Every real beginner--especially people without surf experience--starts off on their knees to begin with. But the sooner you get to your feet, the more fun SUP is. Believe me, I understand. There were a lot of days when I thought "why don't I just stay down here". Here's a fat wobbly guy in 2006 spending a lot of time on his knees: http://www.ponohouse.com/ponoblog/activities/paddleboy/

DO stay out of crowds

Do make sure your board won't hurt anyone

But pay your dues on your feet. Blane was already an accomplished surfer when he started doing his canoe paddle thing. I don't know the motivation but I suspect he just wants to do new stuff. What you're talking about is staying with the baby steps, and crawling isn't really practice for walking. Once you get your sea legs in the surf you'll wonder what all the fuss was. But the only thing you'll get on your knees are hickies.

Incidentally, this would be my own personal cure for SUP delusional time warp, but I had to rebuild Ponohouse, so the date stamps got screwed up. Some day I need to ask Mark when I got that board from him. Then again he's almost as flaky as I am, so he probably won't know.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 07:47:02 AM by PonoBill »
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jjue

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2009, 07:59:54 AM »
Thanks  Ponobill  for  that blog  entry  and the pics of you  starting out catching waves on your knees  ,  actually that is   a lot of insipiration for me  to keep at it ...( and nice to know you understand where I am coming from !!) 
right now   I am    at the stage   of paddling pretty good    out of the surf zone .. but having  a lot of  problems in the surf zone from the standup position  although starting out from the kneeling position .and even taking some waves  kneeling all the way in  without attempting to stand , then going kneeling to standing on the takeoff ., . . . has helped me  to understand  how waves work , where you need to be  in position to the wave   and how to  trim the board on the wave etc , without constantly falling off !    guess next step  is  to stop crawling as you say and start
walking :)!

stoneaxe

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2009, 10:03:21 AM »
How 'bout posting some pics of your setup -- I'd love to see how you have it set up. It would be great for people who don't have good balance.

I have to disagree Rogue...the best thing for people with bad balance is to get out in tough conditions and keep falling until you don't fall anymore.... ;D. I speak from experience. Bill gave me my 1st board as a gift thinking it would be good therapy for the balance problems. That was almost two years ago. If I can do it, almost anyone can.

I have no problem with folks that want to kneel...to each there own. Whatever you find fun. I almost never kneel though...takes away from the workout and the view.

This vid shows about as much kneeling as I will ever do...from last October. 30 mph winds, gusting to 45. A year before I couldn't stand for more than a few minutes before falling. practice, practice, prctice.

http://www.youtube.com/v/MOmZung9fv4&hl#


What's up with youtube not embedding?
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 10:21:28 AM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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SUPer Dave

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2009, 01:54:19 PM »
I give SUPers shit when they Knee paddle into waves here !!!...Its fine for some fast paddlin out of the impAct Zone... But not for taking off on waves....

noworrieshawaii

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Re: kneeling on a SUP
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2009, 08:58:51 PM »
I've found that if I try to get through waves of any size on my knees , I got shoved backwards and it gets really nasty... Actually only tried it twice after getting stuck inside and decided it wasnt an option. Perhaps a heavier person might make it through, but at 130lbs, it doesnt work.  I normally try to really time the sets and always paddle out standing but got lazy a couple times.. Not again..   Oh but I do knee paddle occasionally when the headwind into the harbor gets too much... Again.. lazy

jjue

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C4 Stendy .. Nice !
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2009, 09:03:55 PM »
Whatever one  thinks about knee paddling on  SUP boards , it is nice when  a paddle works well  to allow  knee paddling to be done  with  power and then converts to a standard  sup paddle . on the fly  ... .

got the C4 Stendy   and   for my 6 foot height  , it is just about perfect   for varying paddle positions ...   it is very easy to adjust on the fly ,    
I like  68 inches or so  for   knee paddling   ,   60 inch  if I am seated on my board  and  81 inches  for standup  paddling  ...   the   adjustment mechanism locks well and does not slip ...  the paddle  does not have any wiggle ... it is very light  .. "paddleplace " up in bend oregon ,where I bought it from  weighed it  and it was about 2 oz more than a regular  c4 non adjustable paddle ,  the  round ball   handle is different  than a standard t grip  , but I  find it  very functional and easy to get used to .. it is important for allowing the   twist type  adjustment  to work  without  concern about alignment of a t grip . .

it is really  amazing how more efficient  knee paddling is  with    a  proper  length paddle  vs choking up on  a standard  sup  paddle ...
very nice    , and a unique   product     that is perfect for varying paddling position ...  

a nice review  here

http://www.standuppaddlesurf.net/2008/01/22/first-adjustable-length-stand-up-paddle-preview/
« Last Edit: July 23, 2009, 09:06:15 PM by jjue »

 


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