Author Topic: Surf Stance Issues On Smaller Board - Three steps forward two steps back  (Read 11008 times)

seadart

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I moved to surfing a narrower, lower volume board (from a 10'6 150 L) and have slowly made progress to where I am fairly comfortable paddling in waves and taking off in surf on it.  I took some Gopro movies of my attempts for the first time –and I really suck.  One problem I noted is that I’m not getting my feet in the center of the board over the stringer but they are still in some hybrid staggered/surf position and I fall forward to the side a lot paddling for the take off. The nose is fairly narrow so that does not help.  I know from experience that if I look at my feet I’m going to fall taking off.  I don’t have a good sense of body awareness of where my feet are, they are just fighting for balance.  We had some flat conditions for a few days and I spent a couple of sessions just trying to work my feet into a good surf stance in small increments, I’m doing better but suspect in choppy conditions it’s not going to work.  I’ve seen videos where folks make a little hop to get both feet into position.  I can’t get both feet unweighted and moved simulataneously on the grippy top on the tippy board to do this.  Anybody have a suggestion on how to get to surf stance in the least number of increments without tipping the board? Right now I get into a staggered stance and then get low with bent knees, (goofy foot) so I reach out with the paddle on left side (it’s short) and paddle and brace as I turn my rear foot and slide it back and then step forward with my front foot trying to get it to the center of the board while the paddle stroke is still bracing. (I think my left foot wants to stay near the rail to help anticipate a bottom turn, and that makes my right foot want to stay on the right side of the stringer )  What am I doing wrong?

anonsurfer

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Practice paddling in surf stance or semi-surf stance and then try paddling for the wave in surf stance.  This way you are already in position when you catch the wave.  Then just practice, practice, practice. 
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Tom

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I have switched from paddling in a semi-surf stance to the technique that was taught at the Nosara SUP Camp and it is working very well for me. Stay in a parallel stance while paddling for a wave with your feet about shoulder width apart. When you've caught the wave, pivot your forward foot on its heel to right angles with the centerline of the board while moving your back foot to the rear of the board. This will place both feet on center of the board. While doing this, lower your body and keep your front foot weighed more than you back foot.

Green Water Sports

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Hi seadart, I've just recently made a step down in my surfing SUP and I'm having to focus on my footwork a little more since the new board is much more sensitive. I find when I'm going for a wave I'll still be in a mostly square stance, slightly staggered by 1-2" on the new board if it is choppy. If the wave is a little flatter I might step forward 8" with one foot to get my weight forward and improve my chances of catching the wave. I'm regular stance normally and I do surf some waves goofy as well, but interestingly I step forward with the foot on the side opposite to the paddle so that I maintain an open face to the paddle rather than getting all crossed up.

If the wave is a bit steeper, I'll step back a little with one foot. Usually this will be my back foot for the surfing stance but sometimes it could be just the foot to maintain and nice paddling position.

In both cases I'm not stepping onto the center line of the board as my other foot stays over where it was.

Once I've felt I've caught the wave I will usually move my front foot into position first, over the center line and just as this foot is being placed, I'll move my other foot to the back, not always over the center line as it depends if I'm going down the line one way or the other, it'll be in position to go that direction.

Moving and planting your front foot first keeps your weight forward and your board on the wave. Moving back to set your back foot and then setting your front foot may have you drop off the back of the wave and/or sink the tail and make the board unstable and twitchy. I always try to plant my front foot and let the back foot move accordingly for turns. Of course if I need to, I walk up and down the board.

I don't hop into position as unweighting and then weighting the board unsettles it. I try to do one swift move for my front foot and then my back foot right after. A good time to do this is right as or a fraction before the board shoots down the wave, it naturally drops and you use that to shift your feet.

At least that is how i do it...
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Badger

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You didn't give the specs of your new shorter board.

I paddle my 8'4 in a semi surf stance but but my feet are still well off to the side of what would be considered the stringer (Do any boards have stringers these days? lol) I don't use a particularly wide stance. My back toe lines up with my front heel. Front foot pointing straight ahead, back foot at a slight angle.

I learned a lot from Colas. He's talking really short boards here but his technique can be applied to any length board.

http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=15897.0

Once I've caught the wave I hop once or twice to get into full surf stance and put both feet on the centerline. Then I hop again to get to the tail if possible. These are very quick low hops pushing with your front foot, almost as if you are trying to shoot the board forward out from under you.

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« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 01:14:07 PM by Badger »
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Night Wing

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The specs are definitely needed for the new board so a comparison can be made to the older board in order to better understand your new stance.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
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SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters
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supthecreek

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Hi seadart

I usually recommend the "modified surf stance" to people looking for more stability when taking off on a wave.... and it works on all size boards.

Parallel stance doesn't give you enough "fore & aft" stability to handle the initial "pitch" in the wave face, before you gain speed (thus stability)

To get in the modified surf stance, simply slid your back foot about 4 to 6" behind your front foot.... then turn your toes out a bit toward the rail (pic #1)

This give decent "front to back" ----- and "side to side" stability as you paddle for a wave

When riding the wave, I try to keep my front foot near the centerline of the board, and my back foot closer to the rail.
Sometimes I have them both on the same side of the board.

If your feet are on opposite side of the board, they fight each other.... making turning hard.

I did a video to show footwork on a wave, to show where I place my feet to do different turns.
I'll add it here to show where you feet should be to turn most SUPs.....on really small SUPs, you can leave your back foot in the middle, but I find I need to move it on most of my boards.

Pics below vid show foot placement.... check them out before watching the vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-qB8_uZLuY


in flat-water, practice moving your feet, you will find that they will move without upsetting the board to much.

Night Wing

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I like the feet placement on the middle of the board photo. I started using this position last October. Works well.
Blue Planet Duke: 10'5" x 32" x 4.5" @ 190 Liters (2 Dukes)
Sup Sports Hammer: 8'11" x 31" x 4" @ 140 Liters
SUP Sports One World: 11'1" x 30" x 4.5" @ 173 Liters
CJ Nelson Parallax: 9'3" x 23 1/2" x 3 3/16" @ 78.8 Liters (prone surfing longboard; Thunderbolt Technologies build in Red construction)

seadart

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Hey All - Thanks for the pointers - lots to think about when I practice. 

PonoBill

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I like to keep my front foot pointed forward--it gives me more ability to shift my weight forward or back without moving the front foot. If I feel the board bouncing around too much I know it's because my foot is cheating it's way closer to the rail--a natural desire for stability based on land experience that accomplishes exactly the opposite result on a surfboard. So I slide my foot closer to the stringer. I'm most comfortable with my big toe on one side of the stringer and my heel on the rail side, angled probably about 10 degrees.

My back foot goes wherever it needs to go. I like bigger boards, so I have to move my back foot to the turning rail to get the kind of turns I want. On a shorter board you can do this with knee bends or heel and toe pressure, but on wider or longer boards you have to move the foot.
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Badger

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It may be interesting to note that Creek (Rick) often paddles on his heel side when going for a wave. He's the only one I know who does this. I've tried it and still can't figure out how he makes it work. For me the heel side paddle stoke is my weakest side. I get much more power and stability paddling on my toe side. I'll be the first to admit that my paddle stroke is not the most efficient and still needs practice.

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« Last Edit: March 22, 2017, 11:39:22 PM by Badger »
Kalama E3 6'1 x 23" 105L
Axis HPS 980 / PNG 1300
Sunova Flow  8'10 X 31"  119L
Me - 6'0" - 165lbs - 66yo

Wetstuff

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You guys are great...'great suggestions.  I've had a helluva time making the transition.  I must make really lousy wave selection because I frequently find myself either way too early (stroking like an idiot to catch up and missing) or looking down at the pit backing peddaling out of the drop.  There are a few people who have it wired and can knock them off like walking along a fence with their hand out, so I know the wave is here.

My general foot placement is close to Creek's.  My backfoot may be too straight by comparison, but I sense my wave is too fast for me, and/or I spent too much time outside -waiting for a softie- rather than committing to the waves-at-hand. 

Many years ago when I could half-prone, it seemed I was mostly-always in the right position, albeit slow on the popup; my feet were properly set fore-n-aft.  I was naturally leaning forward with my weight forward of center. Hell, for an IGOR, I had a good time.  Not so much now.  Length of the board does not seem to make much difference either.

Fricking water is too cold and I can't get away to try some new ideas, but Tom mentioned the Nosara Surf Camp.  That young fellow has a tutorial on how to get up on a small board.  I looked at that, and in my mind, it was like a hybrid takeoff, mix of prone and SUP.  Could that place me properly? ..maybe.   Badger mentioned Colas. He also has beachie waves. If I remember correctly, I rarely see him paddling for the wave, like most people, his vids show mostly the racy parts, not the pit work. (but I think I remember him leaning way forward toward the nose)

A major element one does not want to address is talent.  One does not comfortably accept personal limitations...  So, if Bobby Fisher beats your ass in three moves, an NFL linebacker stares you into a puddle of tears... the only good option is to get out the books and train to run like hell.  I can't wait for the water to warm!

Jim


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PonoBill

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Backing out of the fall to the pit might be part of your challenge. I catch myself doing that--a SUP is a much spookier perspective for that than prone. I force myself to commit and take any poundings. I get some beatings, but I also make a lot of those nasty looking "gotta be a closeout" waves that really aren't. Turning as you drop helps a lot, but mostly it's just making yourself go.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

surfafrica

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Here's a great video from Erik at the Progression Project surfing a 6'10 @ 83 L L41.  You can see how he uses a T-like stance when he paddles for waves (similar to Creek's picture above).

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supthecreek

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I like the way Erik mixes in casual turns, like slow carve building to a "whip" at the end.... very stylish and fun to watch.

Another thing that Erik does is flick his board away with his feet.
He takes the lip bouncing the board into him, out of the equation....a great way to stay safe.

 


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