Author Topic: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]  (Read 344580 times)

PonoBill

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #345 on: February 06, 2017, 06:46:21 PM »
It pretty much is. We are the Saudi Arabia of coal. the entire midwest sits on huge seams of it. But it mostly sucks as far as quality goes. Still, there's so much that good stuff (low sulfur, hard coal) is available in larger quantities than the full reserve of most countries.

I'm fully in favor of religion getting involved in politics if they pay taxes. Otherwise it's church and state. What would Jesus do? (not that I really care, but it makes me snicker).
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Bean

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #346 on: February 06, 2017, 09:15:22 PM »
Jesus said, "give to Caesar what is Caesar's and to God what is God's."  Absolute genius...

But before we dismantle the church, consider the social burden that religious organizations carry.  These would be otherwise supported by government.  The relegiously-involved tend to indirectly provide more support to social programs than does the average non-involved taxpayer.

Salish Salt

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #347 on: February 06, 2017, 09:20:03 PM »
Natural gas passed coal last year as the largest source of USA power generation.
The majority of new construction generating capacity in 2015 world wide was renewable.  So much Texas wind its messing with grid stability (like Hawaii).
Things change  (Still lots of coal in the ground but its gotten expensive to generate with, so no new green field PPAs). Don't think its an EPA thing.
When will car batteries get cheaper than...??

tautologies

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #348 on: February 06, 2017, 10:04:16 PM »
Jesus said, "give to Caesar what is Caesar's and to God what is God's."  Absolute genius...

But before we dismantle the church, consider the social burden that religious organizations carry.  These would be otherwise supported by government.  The relegiously-involved tend to indirectly provide more support to social programs than does the average non-involved taxpayer.

No one is saying anything about dismantling anything.

I am curious on what you base your claim that they tend to indirectly provide more support to social programs on? 1. What constitute indirect support, and 2. what social programs?



stoneaxe

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #349 on: February 07, 2017, 04:40:59 AM »
To my earlier point about all the hysteria causing people to ignore what actually is concerning.
http://www.npr.org/2017/02/07/513857856/not-every-trump-outrage-is-outrageous-tom-nichols-says
Bob

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Area 10

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #350 on: February 07, 2017, 06:52:06 AM »
That article misses the main concern of those who oppose Trump's EO. This is that a ban of this type will make the US LESS safe, not more.

IMO Trump is relying on his supporters not being sophisticated enough to understand why.

stoneaxe

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #351 on: February 07, 2017, 07:17:10 AM »
It's not specific to that. The hysterical reporting isn't just about the so called ban...it's about everything...and that's why it's stupid...get outraged about the outrageous and don't paint everything with a brush of sensationalism.
Opinion is the key word in your last sentence.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2017, 07:18:48 AM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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Bean

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #352 on: February 07, 2017, 08:14:51 AM »
Jesus said, "give to Caesar what is Caesar's and to God what is God's."  Absolute genius...

But before we dismantle the church, consider the social burden that religious organizations carry.  These would be otherwise supported by government.  The relegiously-involved tend to indirectly provide more support to social programs than does the average non-involved taxpayer.

No one is saying anything about dismantling anything.

I am curious on what you base your claim that they tend to indirectly provide more support to social programs on? 1. What constitute indirect support, and 2. what social programs?

I used "dismantling" in the context of the current tax structure.

Indirect support are donations made to religious organizations who in turn support homeless programs, schools, etc.  These donations are in addition to any tax obligations they pay, so they create an excess that would otherwise have to be covered by government programs. 

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of non-religious donors that also make significant donations to charities, in some cases, to religious organizations.

Area 10

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #353 on: February 07, 2017, 09:53:26 AM »
It's not specific to that. The hysterical reporting isn't just about the so called ban...it's about everything...and that's why it's stupid...get outraged about the outrageous and don't paint everything with a brush of sensationalism.
Opinion is the key word in your last sentence.
It's as unhelpful to refer to this coverage as "hysterical" as it is for the liberals you hate so much to disparage Trump supporters. The majority of the population did not vote for Trump, and if the whole world's population were voting for US president he'd have got virtually nowhere. What you have here is the majority of the US population, and just about every non-US person in the rest of the world, voicing their fears. Their fears are that Trump is going to precipitate a war with China (which is not at all unrealistic since Bannon had said he expects one), and that his actions are going to greatly help ISIS and other religious fanatics.

Then of course there are the fears that he is going to pollute the environment, cause irreparable climate change, and remove financial regulations that exist to prevent another financial meltdown like we've just had.

So, by all means argue as to why the policies he is pursuing are not going to lead to these outcomes. But you are being no better than the people you criticise if you refer to them expressing their fears publicly as "hysterical".

PonoBill

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #354 on: February 07, 2017, 10:01:29 AM »
Interesting article on Fake News and its genesis and economy: http://newatlas.com/what-is-fake-news-history-economy/47773/
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

PonoBill

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #355 on: February 07, 2017, 10:18:14 AM »
Natural gas passed coal last year as the largest source of USA power generation.
The majority of new construction generating capacity in 2015 world wide was renewable.  So much Texas wind its messing with grid stability (like Hawaii).
Things change  (Still lots of coal in the ground but its gotten expensive to generate with, so no new green field PPAs). Don't think its an EPA thing.
When will car batteries get cheaper than...??

Yes, a very promising trend. What I was talking about is known reserves. In reality, the reserves of natural gas are probably unknown (known unknowns??).

I don't forsee electric cars being cheaper than gasoline for some time, but electric cars can give a return on investment that gasoline cars cannot. If some of the smartgrid schemes are implemented your car might power your house and/or business. I'm tempted to add that capability into the electric TR3 I'm building, just for the hell of it. Connect your DC car to an AC inverter, charge it on off-peak power. Drive to work and back home, power your home/work through the inverter during peak power time. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Utilization factor of cars is very low. Creates all kinds of potential opportunities. Historically the aim for better utilization was to stick everyone in a bus or carpool. Doesn't work if people are even moderately rich. as four lanes of clogged traffic and an empty two-person carpool lane demonstrates.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

stoneaxe

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #356 on: February 07, 2017, 10:58:48 AM »
What? there is a huge difference in me saying there is hysteria in news reporting...false outrage simply because it's Trump and the offhand dismissal of his supporters. All I'm suggesting (and there are lots of liberals saying the same now) is to back off on the hysteria. And it's not just far left liberals I hate it's the far right as well. Both are prone to inflation,  exaggeration and hypocrisy. There is plenty to be outraged about without making shit up. If you don't see that there is hysteria in both the reporting and the response to it then I guess there is nothing to discuss. Do you really not get this...do you not understand the parable of the boy who cried wolf?
I also like how you paint with such a ridiculously broad brush.....you seem to feel like the whole world is on your side except for a few naïve and unsophisticated people here that supported Trump. Kind of like Trump inflating his inauguration crowd...both laughable.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2017, 11:03:06 AM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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Tom

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #357 on: February 07, 2017, 11:10:56 AM »
What? there is a huge difference in me saying there is hysteria in news reporting...false outrage simply because it's Trump and the offhand dismissal of his supporters. All I'm suggesting (and there are lots of liberals saying the same now) is to back off on the hysteria. And it's not just far left liberals I hate it's the far right as well. Both are prone to inflation,  exaggeration and hypocrisy. There is plenty to be outraged about without making shit up. If you don't see that there is hysteria in both the reporting and the response to it then I guess there is nothing to discuss. Do you really not get this...do you not understand the parable of the boy who cried wolf?
I also like how you paint with such a ridiculously broad brush.....you seem to feel like the whole world is on your side except for a few naïve and unsophisticated people here that supported Trump. Kind of like Trump inflating his inauguration crowd...both laughable.

Could you post a few examples of what you term as 'hysteria'?

tautologies

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #358 on: February 07, 2017, 11:30:59 AM »

I used "dismantling" in the context of the current tax structure.

Indirect support are donations made to religious organizations who in turn support homeless programs, schools, etc.  These donations are in addition to any tax obligations they pay, so they create an excess that would otherwise have to be covered by government programs. 

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of non-religious donors that also make significant donations to charities, in some cases, to religious organizations.

Well, some time ago, I did some back of the napkin using the lowest calculation possible for estimated tax revenue from churches (note not all religious activities) and if the tax revenue was earmarked homeless people each homeless person in the US would get almost $100k per year.

I think a lot of the donations from good Americans aren't going where they are hoping it is going. This is of course why they should be forced to publish their budgets. A lot of the programs you are talking about are also getting direct government support. At least they should show their accounting, and be treated as a non-profit.
When that is said, the non-profit sector in the US has gone nuts. I know people who has a SUP / Kite teaching school as a non-profit because it is somehow a social good that people learn to SUP (while paying for it). 

Tom

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #359 on: February 07, 2017, 11:40:32 AM »

I used "dismantling" in the context of the current tax structure.

Indirect support are donations made to religious organizations who in turn support homeless programs, schools, etc.  These donations are in addition to any tax obligations they pay, so they create an excess that would otherwise have to be covered by government programs. 

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of non-religious donors that also make significant donations to charities, in some cases, to religious organizations.

Well, some time ago, I did some back of the napkin using the lowest calculation possible for estimated tax revenue from churches (note not all religious activities) and if the tax revenue was earmarked homeless people each homeless person in the US would get almost $100k per year.

I think a lot of the donations from good Americans aren't going where they are hoping it is going. This is of course why they should be forced to publish their budgets. A lot of the programs you are talking about are also getting direct government support. At least they should show their accounting, and be treated as a non-profit.
When that is said, the non-profit sector in the US has gone nuts. I know people who has a SUP / Kite teaching school as a non-profit because it is somehow a social good that people learn to SUP (while paying for it).

Are these schools designated as non-profit or as not for profit? There is a difference in taxes treatment  between the two.

 


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