Author Topic: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]  (Read 344498 times)

johnysmoke

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #195 on: January 28, 2017, 04:50:57 PM »
And there goes the national parks, didn't really need those anyways. Maybe when they're building a golf cours, and shut down your beach access, you guys will realize what kind of thug you put in the white house. Can't afford the national parks but here's a great new wall. Also happy Holocaust Rememberance Day!

https://medium.com/@wilderness/new-bill-would-sell-off-3-million-acres-of-public-lands-9593763ac893#.bxhx744l0
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deepmud

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #196 on: January 28, 2017, 10:33:33 PM »
Trump signs executiver order, banning travel from 7 mainly Muslim countries (but not all .....).

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/01/29/protests-erupt-at-airports-around-u-s-following-trump-travel-ban.html

Fearism - we did this before. Jews were turned back too....

https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005139


"During the second half of 1941, even as unconfirmed reports of the mass murder perpetrated by the Nazis filtered to the West, the US Department of State placed even stricter limits on immigration based on national security concerns." (Same concerns that rounded up the Japanese-Americans? - 2nd and 3rd generation Americans?)

Today is National Holocaust Day.

Area 10

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #197 on: January 29, 2017, 12:23:22 AM »
If this Executive Order is about stopping terrorists, then why has he chosen to ban people from these particular countries?

ABC news:

"Trump categorized the executive order as part of a vetting plan to prevent "radical Islamic terrorists" from reaching American soil.

The seven-page document calls for an immediate suspension of immigration from countries with ties to terror -- Syria, Yemen, Sudan, Somalia, Iraq, Iran and Libya -- for a time period of 90 days. But none of the countries on the list have had anything to do with terror incidents on U.S. soil since the 9/11 attacks, and Saudi Arabia -- where 15 of the 9/11 hijackers were from -- is not included".

Maybe this is just an excuse for the real reason: religious discrimination:

"Trump told the the Christian Broadcasting Network that Christian refugees would be given priority over Muslims in applications to come to the U.S.

"We are going to help them," Trump said of Christians in Syria." (ABC News.)

Does he know that Jesus is arguably the second most revered religious figure in Islam, and that most of what Christians believe about Jesus is also believed by Muslims? If he wants to help people who believe in Christ then he should be helping Muslims too.

If it isn't belief in Christ as a redeemer, miracle-doer, result of an immaculate conception, transcendent to heaven, messenger of God etc that identifies Christians as worthy of Trump's help (since Muslims believe all of this too), then what is it, exactly?

yugi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #198 on: January 29, 2017, 02:03:22 AM »
...
Maybe this is just an excuse for the real reason: religious discrimination:

"Trump told the the Christian Broadcasting Network that Christian refugees would be given priority over Muslims in applications to come to the U.S.

"We are going to help them," Trump said of Christians in Syria." (ABC News.)

...

What a terrible message that sends.



Here is a guy who is removing threat.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 02:25:13 AM by yugi »

lucabrasi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #199 on: January 29, 2017, 04:35:22 AM »
I've read a lot of history of Asia and the Middle East. The history of Islam is particularly violent and political. It was from its very inception. Most of the successors to Mohammad were assasinated.  Yes, there are moderate muslims and secular muslims who don't deserve to be tarred with that brush. And yes, the history of Christianity and other religions is violent, brutal and repressive. But it's generally historical except for a few whack jobs. There's nothing that rises to the level or scope of Wahhabism and the general intent and scope of fundamental Islam. The brutality of sharia law should make that clear to anyone paying attention.
Well, I had to look up Wahhabism. I saw the word I wondered if that was something like Bananastan. Nope.
I looked up sharia as well tho that wasn't a new word to me I don't know lots about it. Still not convinced it is an all inclusive instruction manual to go along with the Book but I simply do not know. Seems more like an interpretation or addendum. That's always how I kind of thought it fit in I guess. Can't you take the ten commandments or any one of a number of things from the Bible and twist it in such a way it would be just as convoluted beyond recognition?  Putting the sharia law into the whole thing I guess answers my question about wondering what they are following.
Yeah, I am far more on board with what Mister Lama says.

Interesting that one of the things I read about sharia is:
"Sharia is a significant source of legislation in many Muslim countries but Saudi Arabia is the only one that practices it."
Hmmmmmm.

"Trump told the the Christian Broadcasting Network that Christian refugees would be given priority over Muslims in applications to come to the U.S.
"We are going to help them," Trump said of Christians in Syria." (ABC News.)
Yes, that is a terrible message that has been put out there. I did see that. I am not sure how you can not scratch your head at that with the message it sends. I will even go on board with the quote I just saw from Hilary. "This isn't what we are about". (ok, I didn't click and read further tho) It really just goes against the basis of why we are even a country.
What a mess.

I saw something on executive orders the other day. Most presidents do this alot in their first bit of time in office. (no, that doesn't mean I am on board with it)
Examples.
Emancipation Proclamation.
Japanese Internment.
Guantanamo.
Congress doesn't have to fund them. (guantanamo)
Supreme court has nixed them......(tho sounds like not often)
I don't know......

Not a fan of selling off public lands but I don't know enough about each instance to throw a broad brush over the whole thing. I do know that around here with the millions of acres and only a small amount of private land we are seeing our access just disappear out of nowhere the last while. They have closed off areas that have always had access (trails/roads/two tracks/etc) and not post them as closed. Vague to no explanation when people find out and it is questioned. Fall comes around and people go into these areas they have been going into for years and years and years and they get written up. The head of a forest district here came from some sort of government work and always lived back east and was never part of the forest service, public lands, etc. They chose him to run it. Imagine that. A person clueless to the way of the forest and someone from back east (hardly any public land) coming out west (public land as far as you can see) to tell us how to use our forest. This past summer they decided to plow up and bulldoze some areas to keep people out of them. Make it more apparent an area was closed I guess to keep what had happened the previous few years from having such bad press. Well, they bulldozed historical areas of the Lander Trail with ruts left from the wagon trains. These weren't secret areas. How dumb can they get? Kind of took the bad press from the previous years and amplified it. I guess what I am saying is if they are going to take away our access on public lands.........what's the use of having public land?
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 05:32:22 AM by lucabrasi »

johnysmoke

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #200 on: January 29, 2017, 06:08:03 AM »
Luca, if they're mismanaging or denying access to public land that sucks, but at least it's still there and is only temporarily unavailable. Make some calls to your representatives and other political folks, voice your discontent, start a local Facebook page and get on it that way, talk to outdoor groups in your area, get people to the bar together and talk about it. But once that shit is sold it's most likely gone forever.
I'll also admit that I don't know any details about this other than what's in the article, none of these are yet East Coast states, but I've spent a little time out west, and would hate to think about those spaces getting used for anything else than parks. I think it sets the wrong precedent.
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raf

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #201 on: January 29, 2017, 10:04:12 AM »
If the press wasn't doing everything in their power to delegitimize Trump and all the Kool-Aid drinkers on the left would engage in some critical thought there wouldn't be half the hand-wringing going on or out cry from abroad or leaders not meeting.

This is stupid.  Trump is delegitimizing himself.  Trump is also incapable of critical thought, which in my opinion is his worst quality. 

Area 10

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #202 on: January 29, 2017, 10:46:05 AM »
Wouldn't you have thought that if you were president, especially in only your second week, and were considering issuing an Executive Order, you might first run it by a few of your lawyers just to see if it would hold up in court?

https://youtu.be/RZ1ynUmsZCI

It certainly makes the US look like a very fearful bunch of people: your chance of being killed by a refugee is apparently 1 in 3.6 BILLION per year.

http://edition.cnn.com/videos/tv/2017/01/29/exp-gps-0129-take-travel-ban.cnn/video/playlists/donald-trump-muslims/

I love the detail that none of the countries that Trump named has a Trump hotel/office/business in it. However, according to the Washington Post:

"The executive order makes no mention of Saudi Arabia, home of 15 of the 19 terrorists involved in the 9/11 attacks. The Trump Organization had incorporated several limited liability companies in preparation for an attempt to build a hotel in Saudi Arabia, showing an interest in expansion in the country."
« Last Edit: January 29, 2017, 11:26:21 AM by Area 10 »

tautologies

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #203 on: January 29, 2017, 12:22:56 PM »


Trump's desire for approval / reinforcement vs. fact has just created a dangerous filter bubble: A self-described Leninist is now running the US security counsel while the joint chiefs are gone. Mr. Putin cannot believe his luck. Deflect that stoneaxe.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38787241

yugi

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #204 on: January 29, 2017, 12:56:29 PM »
Achtung! Germans on the rise!

(language NSFW)

http://youtu.be/HMQkV5cTuoY

Tom

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #205 on: January 29, 2017, 03:30:08 PM »
 John McCain
 
Our government has a responsibility to defend our borders, but we must do so in a way that makes us safer and upholds all that is decent and exceptional about our nation.
It is clear from the confusion at our airports across the nation that President Trump’s executive order was not properly vetted. We are particularly concerned by reports that this order went into effect with little to no consultation with the Departments of State, Defense, Justice, and Homeland Security.
Such a hasty process risks harmful results. We should not stop green-card holders from returning to the country they call home. We should not stop those who have served as interpreters for our military and diplomats from seeking refuge in the country they risked their lives to help. And we should not turn our backs on those refugees who have been shown through extensive vetting to pose no demonstrable threat to our nation, and who have suffered unspeakable horrors, most of them women and children.
Ultimately, we fear this executive order will become a self-inflicted wound in the fight against terrorism. At this very moment, American troops are fighting side-by-side with our Iraqi partners to defeat ISIL. But this executive order bans Iraqi pilots from coming to military bases in Arizona to fight our common enemies. Our most important allies in the fight against ISIL are the vast majority of Muslims who reject its apocalyptic ideology of hatred. This executive order sends a signal, intended or not, that America does not want Muslims coming into our country. That is why we fear this executive order may do more to help terrorist recruitment than improve our security.

tautologies

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #206 on: January 29, 2017, 06:36:58 PM »
John McCain
 
Our government has a responsibility to defend our borders, but we must do so in a way that makes us safer and upholds all that is decent and exceptional about our nation.
It is clear from the confusion at our airports across the nation that President Trump’s executive order was not properly vetted. We are particularly concerned by reports that this order went into effect with little to no consultation with the Departments of State, Defense, Justice, and Homeland Security.
Such a hasty process risks harmful results. We should not stop green-card holders from returning to the country they call home. We should not stop those who have served as interpreters for our military and diplomats from seeking refuge in the country they risked their lives to help. And we should not turn our backs on those refugees who have been shown through extensive vetting to pose no demonstrable threat to our nation, and who have suffered unspeakable horrors, most of them women and children.
Ultimately, we fear this executive order will become a self-inflicted wound in the fight against terrorism. At this very moment, American troops are fighting side-by-side with our Iraqi partners to defeat ISIL. But this executive order bans Iraqi pilots from coming to military bases in Arizona to fight our common enemies. Our most important allies in the fight against ISIL are the vast majority of Muslims who reject its apocalyptic ideology of hatred. This executive order sends a signal, intended or not, that America does not want Muslims coming into our country. That is why we fear this executive order may do more to help terrorist recruitment than improve our security.


This is EXACTLY why I have been so focused on the lack of experience that this whole administration have (you know in addition to trump being mentally ill). You can't have beginners run a country.

johnysmoke

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tautologies

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #208 on: January 29, 2017, 08:48:36 PM »
This Bannon thing is scary as well. Zero clearance or vetting.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/01/29/us/politics/stephen-bannon-security-council.html?smid=fb-share&referer=https://m.facebook.com/

Yeah when you put a self declared leninist at the top of that room, it is time to worry...more. I bet Putin can't even believe his "luck". I still wonder how stoneaxe will deflect this to something about clinton. Sigh..probably mostly because I have no idea how all this absolute bullshit wasn't clear to everyone.

Got damn it.

southwesterly

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Re: What a got damn shitshow. [warning politics]
« Reply #209 on: January 29, 2017, 09:02:41 PM »
Obviously this is before he signed the order, but you get the point about the countries that he has personal business ties with.

 


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