Author Topic: How easy is it replace a handle?  (Read 4102 times)

Badger

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How easy is it replace a handle?
« on: October 21, 2016, 04:54:41 AM »
I'm sick of the LiftSUP handle on my Sunova. I'd like to replace it with the Blue Planet SupGrip. 

Is it a difficult job? Can the average board repair guy do it? Would I be looking at a huge labor cost if I hired someone?

I'm not sure if I have the skills to do it myself. Nor do I have the tools, but I'm open to the idea. I'm pretty good with epoxy. I've just never cut into a board before. Would it be risky as a DIY project? What tools would I need?

After watching this video, it looks like the LS handles are installed fairly permanently, with resin in the bottom of the hole. Is it even possible to get the handle out once it's installed or is that not an option?





« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 05:18:18 AM by Badger »
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J-Bird

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2016, 05:57:33 AM »
Never replaced a handle, but I did just replace a FCS plug on a shortboard, and the hardest part was removing the damaged plug.  I imagine a properly installed handle would be even tougher. But it's not impossible, just might take a bit of effort. 

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2016, 06:05:11 AM »
Badger-other that the guy reaching in the hole while the router was spinning...that was a good install video.

The Blue Planet handle install does not look difficult. I would make router templates.
 My only concern would be if there was any metal in the Liftsup handle that could nick a router bit during the 'remove existing' part of the job. One could ague for using a little more resin and a little less glass during the install.



« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 06:14:02 AM by jrandy »
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Badger

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Re: How easy is it to replace a handle?
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2016, 07:00:18 AM »
The installation looks simple enough. I think I could do it.

The big question is, can the LiftSup be removed without damaging the board? Sunovas have very thin layers on the bottom. I'd hate to end up with an indentation in the bottom of the board.






« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 07:02:28 AM by Badger »
Sunova Flow 8'4" X 29 3/8" 110L
Sunova Flow 8'10" X 31 1/8" 119L (Low volume version)
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SUPflorida

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2016, 07:54:48 AM »
Badger-other that the guy reaching in the hole while the router was spinning...that was a good install video.

The Blue Planet handle install does not look difficult. I would make router templates.
 My only concern would be if there was any metal in the Liftsup handle that could nick a router bit during the 'remove existing' part of the job. One could ague for using a little more resin and a little less glass during the install.





I bought one of these handles and will be installing it this morning...I do not care for the way they install the handle in the video. I come from the perspective of windsurfing where fin boxes and mast tracks were always points of failure in both production and custom boards.

After lessons learned, I always put 3-4 layers of 4 oz clothe under whatever I'm inserting in the board. Not only under, but it comes out of the hole and laps onto the deck 1-1/4" to 1-1/2" on all sides. Seen to many plugs/finboxes/mast tracks lose bond with plastic even when meticulously prepared by sanding and chemical pre-treatment .

By putting glass under the object (and out onto the deck) you are giving some longitudinal integrity back to the deck skin. But mainly you are islolating the foam from water intrusion (even if the handle fails). And you are getting greater bonding surface to the box other than just the top face.
 
I believe the installer in the video put 8 layers on top of the box, and minimal filler to bond in the actual hole. Overkill on the deck, underkill in the cutout. The box itself creates a stress risers. If the bond breaks between the glass overlay and the plastic box water can enter without the owner being aware of it (under the pad) until weight change is noticeable or bubbles start manifesting themselves around the handle. By that time you have water in the board, all of which you will never get completely out.

My method is twice the trouble to that shown in the video, but the peace of mind is worth it to me.
Unfortionately the design/construction of this particular box does not lend itself to a flush install using the method I use. I will not be recessing the flange but rather have it sit/bond to the deck Everything is a compromise when utilizing what is commonly available.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 07:58:10 AM by SUPflorida »

Bean

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2016, 07:55:31 AM »
Badger, you will avoid that risk by routing out your template for the new handle right through the existing handle.  This would be one of those times where you make sure you wear your safety goggles, move slow and let the router do the work.  You don't need a high end router, but you do need a high quality bit to get a clean cut.

Here is a handle swap I did, switching from a Futures to an FCS handle.  The Futures handle was actually deeper so after routing the FCS template to depth, part of the original handle was still in place.  In this case the residual piece came out easy and I filled the void with a chunk of EPS.  I could have just as easily left it in place.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 07:58:11 AM by Bean »

Badger

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2016, 08:37:18 AM »
Badger, you will avoid that risk by routing out your template for the new handle right through the existing handle. 

Excellent. I hadn't thought of that. I knew there must be a trick. It sounds so easy I just might have to try it. Thanks.



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Sunova Flow 8'10" X 31 1/8" 119L (Low volume version)
Jimmy Lewis M-12'6" X 28" 237L

Badger

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2016, 08:53:30 AM »
Badger-other that the guy reaching in the hole while the router was spinning...that was a good install video.

The Blue Planet handle install does not look difficult. I would make router templates.
 My only concern would be if there was any metal in the Liftsup handle that could nick a router bit during the 'remove existing' part of the job. One could ague for using a little more resin and a little less glass during the install.


I bought one of these handles and will be installing it this morning...I do not care for the way they install the handle in the video. I come from the perspective of windsurfing where fin boxes and mast tracks were always points of failure in both production and custom boards.

After lessons learned, I always put 3-4 layers of 4 oz clothe under whatever I'm inserting in the board. Not only under, but it comes out of the hole and laps onto the deck 1-1/4" to 1-1/2" on all sides. Seen to many plugs/finboxes/mast tracks lose bond with plastic even when meticulously prepared by sanding and chemical pre-treatment .

By putting glass under the object (and out onto the deck) you are giving some longitudinal integrity back to the deck skin. But mainly you are islolating the foam from water intrusion (even if the handle fails). And you are getting greater bonding surface to the box other than just the top face.
 
I believe the installer in the video put 8 layers on top of the box, and minimal filler to bond in the actual hole. Overkill on the deck, underkill in the cutout. The box itself creates a stress risers. If the bond breaks between the glass overlay and the plastic box water can enter without the owner being aware of it (under the pad) until weight change is noticeable or bubbles start manifesting themselves around the handle. By that time you have water in the board, all of which you will never get completely out.

My method is twice the trouble to that shown in the video, but the peace of mind is worth it to me.
Unfortionately the design/construction of this particular box does not lend itself to a flush install using the method I use. I will not be recessing the flange but rather have it sit/bond to the deck Everything is a compromise when utilizing what is commonly available.

I like your idea of putting glass under and filling every void right to the top with resin. Does that mean that you won't be putting any glass over the exterior of the flange?




Sunova Flow 8'4" X 29 3/8" 110L
Sunova Flow 8'10" X 31 1/8" 119L (Low volume version)
Jimmy Lewis M-12'6" X 28" 237L

DW

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2016, 08:56:59 AM »
Badger-other that the guy reaching in the hole while the router was spinning...that was a good install video.

The Blue Planet handle install does not look difficult. I would make router templates.
 My only concern would be if there was any metal in the Liftsup handle that could nick a router bit during the 'remove existing' part of the job. One could ague for using a little more resin and a little less glass during the install.





I bought one of these handles and will be installing it this morning...I do not care for the way they install the handle in the video. I come from the perspective of windsurfing where fin boxes and mast tracks were always points of failure in both production and custom boards.

After lessons learned, I always put 3-4 layers of 4 oz clothe under whatever I'm inserting in the board. Not only under, but it comes out of the hole and laps onto the deck 1-1/4" to 1-1/2" on all sides. Seen to many plugs/finboxes/mast tracks lose bond with plastic even when meticulously prepared by sanding and chemical pre-treatment .

By putting glass under the object (and out onto the deck) you are giving some longitudinal integrity back to the deck skin. But mainly you are islolating the foam from water intrusion (even if the handle fails). And you are getting greater bonding surface to the box other than just the top face.
 
I believe the installer in the video put 8 layers on top of the box, and minimal filler to bond in the actual hole. Overkill on the deck, underkill in the cutout. The box itself creates a stress risers. If the bond breaks between the glass overlay and the plastic box water can enter without the owner being aware of it (under the pad) until weight change is noticeable or bubbles start manifesting themselves around the handle. By that time you have water in the board, all of which you will never get completely out.

My method is twice the trouble to that shown in the video, but the peace of mind is worth it to me.
Unfortionately the design/construction of this particular box does not lend itself to a flush install using the method I use. I will not be recessing the flange but rather have it sit/bond to the deck Everything is a compromise when utilizing what is commonly available.

I'm with you. I also glass under and lap to deck. But I do route a space for flange and go flush. I do my futures fin boxes same way too.

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2016, 09:00:33 AM »
Badger-other that the guy reaching in the hole while the router was spinning...that was a good install video.

The Blue Planet handle install does not look difficult. I would make router templates.
 My only concern would be if there was any metal in the Liftsup handle that could nick a router bit during the 'remove existing' part of the job. One could ague for using a little more resin and a little less glass during the install.


I bought one of these handles and will be installing it this morning...I do not care for the way they install the handle in the video. I come from the perspective of windsurfing where fin boxes and mast tracks were always points of failure in both production and custom boards.

After lessons learned, I always put 3-4 layers of 4 oz clothe under whatever I'm inserting in the board. Not only under, but it comes out of the hole and laps onto the deck 1-1/4" to 1-1/2" on all sides. Seen to many plugs/finboxes/mast tracks lose bond with plastic even when meticulously prepared by sanding and chemical pre-treatment .

By putting glass under the object (and out onto the deck) you are giving some longitudinal integrity back to the deck skin. But mainly you are islolating the foam from water intrusion (even if the handle fails). And you are getting greater bonding surface to the box other than just the top face.
 
I believe the installer in the video put 8 layers on top of the box, and minimal filler to bond in the actual hole. Overkill on the deck, underkill in the cutout. The box itself creates a stress risers. If the bond breaks between the glass overlay and the plastic box water can enter without the owner being aware of it (under the pad) until weight change is noticeable or bubbles start manifesting themselves around the handle. By that time you have water in the board, all of which you will never get completely out.

My method is twice the trouble to that shown in the video, but the peace of mind is worth it to me.
Unfortionately the design/construction of this particular box does not lend itself to a flush install using the method I use. I will not be recessing the flange but rather have it sit/bond to the deck Everything is a compromise when utilizing what is commonly available.

I like your idea of putting glass under and filling every void right to the top with resin. Does that mean that you won't be putting any glass over the exterior of the flange?

It's glass over and under. It's very important.

Badger

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2016, 09:07:21 AM »
"It's glass over and under. It's very important."


Yes, that makes sense now that I think about it.
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mrbig

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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2016, 09:37:14 AM »
Badger,
Be mindful that Sunova is wood over foam. A different animal when replacing handles.!! ;D  ;D
Let it come to you..
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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2016, 09:25:05 PM »
I am liking the suggestions for glass below and above the new handle.
Less chance for leaks and the handle is in the 'neutral' axis so to speak.

Badger,
Be mindful that Sunova is wood over foam. A different animal when replacing handles.!! ;D  ;D


So Sunova is not a foam+glass+wood+glass 'compsand' type construction?
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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2016, 10:12:05 PM »
Sure is.
Let it come to you..
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Re: How easy is it replace a handle?
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2016, 11:14:40 PM »
I'm a big fan of glassing under and over fin boxes and inserts. Wouldn't do it any other way. I like one layer of table-impregnated 4os S glass. I push the box or handle in, trim the folds out with a razor so it lies flat on the deck, add a layer of peel ply and clear plastic (so I can see if anything shifts), then stack on a square of glass and some weights. When you pull the peel ply you probably won't have to sand to get a nice surface for the top layers. Ready to go.
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