Author Topic: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar  (Read 11633 times)

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #15 on: September 26, 2016, 10:15:34 AM »
Larry...who is selling your fins? I looked on the link you posted to your site, but couldn't find the multi fins set ups being talked about...or a way to buy them. Do you have an online store or a distributor that carry them?

Supflorida, Dealers are welcome to contact me at the factory 310-530-1383 or Lasurfer71@msn.com. I will be updating the website with a store now that I believe the fin line is covered. Along with Paddleboard Specialists support and I will being doing video Tutorial youtube when I figure out the program. Next level is sharing understanding of Allison Sup Race Fins.

Mahalo
Allison Race Fins

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2016, 09:07:36 AM »
Interesting and exciting 2 days at the Starboard world dealer event. Got word late last night that Larry Cain rode this board and appeared pleasantly surprised after paddling it for a couple miles. It's great when people ride this Allison Probox Race Twin concept and understand what's going on then the light comes on. As I always say you cannot judge a book by it's cover until you open it. People that talk; drag to many fins, open fin slots suck water, can't turn because tracks good only and my favorite weight issues which is the funniest since people get overfin and underfin confused with WEIGHT.

Feel of underfin: Is when your board feels like you are in quick sand and can not accelerate.

Feel of overfin: Is feeling like you are towing seaweed. You get to a point of speed and cannot accelerate, you remain at that speed no more.

Mick Di Betta
September 17 at 9:44am ·
Very exciting times ahead for board design , well whats under the boards more the fact. I have been working with LarryAllison Sup Race Fins for a few weeks now and looking at what he has done to this board and the results from earlier testing on other boards, things are about to change with your SUP race board very quickly.


Marc Frechou
14 hrs near San Diego ·
 

Starboard Allstar with Larry W. Allison probox twins and Ventral fin. At the 2016 Starboard world dealer meeting in San Diego. — with Tony Fajardo and Larry W. Allison.

Comments
Marc Frechou
Marc Frechou Really fast, and super stable!
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 09:18:33 AM by ProBox-Larry »
Allison Race Fins

Argosi

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2016, 12:09:38 PM »
Larry, what's the total fin are of the 3 fins at the tail? And the fin area of the ventral fin?

Thanks.

ukgm

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2016, 12:02:35 AM »
Interesting and exciting 2 days at the Starboard world dealer event.


Did Svein see it and were there any useful comments from people (other than Larry) there ?

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2016, 11:58:25 AM »
Interesting and exciting 2 days at the Starboard world dealer event.


Did Svein see it and were there any useful comments from people (other than Larry) there ?

ukgm, Funny are we reading the same thread! I have not made any comments about the ride of this board. I posted quotes and comments from Starboard Rider Tony, Corey Hamilton, Larry Cain, Mick di Betta, Maru from Abita Barn a Starboard dealer.

Yes Svein seen the board, along with some emails! He advised riders to ride the board, along with giving permission to retro fit Starboard Rider Tony Fajardo board. Thought I would give my Zoner friends a peak of whats happening. Only so much I can say at this point with respect and privacy to Svein.
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Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2016, 12:05:07 PM »
Larry, what's the total fin are of the 3 fins at the tail? And the fin area of the ventral fin?

Thanks.

Thanks for asking my friend, 6" kick fin 32sq. each Stealth Twin 19sq along with 12sq on Ventral.
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Argosi

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2016, 07:11:58 AM »
Thanks Larry. So that's 70 sq in of area in the 3 tail fins plus 12 more for the ventral fin for 82 sq in total. It would seem that would create a lot of drag, but based on the comments, there seems to be LESS drag than a single tail fin of much smaller area. Interesting.

I just had a small ventral fin installed on my Starboard Ace. Maybe just 5.25 sq in in area. I'm hoping it will reduce the tendency for the nose to get blown off course in strong side or quartering winds. I went with a smaller ventral fin since I do a lot of upwind-downwind paddles and I  don't want the ventral fin to have a negative impact on downwind paddling. We typically get 3-4 foot bumps in 20-25mph of wind with waves and wind chop coming from different directions due to bottom contours.

For the tail fin, I'll use a 39 sq in tail fin (similar to your Thresher but a little higher aspect). I have the Ninja as well, but think that would be too big.

Planning to test it out this weekend for the first time. Don't have the 3 fin tail set up yet though.

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #22 on: September 30, 2016, 08:47:47 AM »
Thanks Larry. So that's 70 sq in of area in the 3 tail fins plus 12 more for the ventral fin for 82 sq in total. It would seem that would create a lot of drag, but based on the comments, there seems to be LESS drag than a single tail fin of much smaller area. Interesting.

I just had a small ventral fin installed on my Starboard Ace. Maybe just 5.25 sq in in area. I'm hoping it will reduce the tendency for the nose to get blown off course in strong side or quartering winds. I went with a smaller ventral fin since I do a lot of upwind-downwind paddles and I  don't want the ventral fin to have a negative impact on downwind paddling. We typically get 3-4 foot bumps in 20-25mph of wind with waves and wind chop coming from different directions due to bottom contours.

For the tail fin, I'll use a 39 sq in tail fin (similar to your Thresher but a little higher aspect). I have the Ninja as well, but think that would be too big.

Planning to test it out this weekend for the first time. Don't have the 3 fin tail set up yet though.

Argosi, Thanks for sharing in. In answer to your comment about drag due to total surface area. Just maybe we have been running under fin more than you think. Think about it a board at 270litters being pushed by a fin of 32 sq inch. remember we are NOT riding a wave where power is pushing from tail, power in Standup is coming from forward of center.
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Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2016, 09:49:58 AM »
Starboard Rider Tony Fajardo is starting to collect data with different fins: Enjoy the pics will show you data. Mahalo
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Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #24 on: September 30, 2016, 09:56:46 AM »
Thanks Larry. So that's 70 sq in of area in the 3 tail fins plus 12 more for the ventral fin for 82 sq in total. It would seem that would create a lot of drag, but based on the comments, there seems to be LESS drag than a single tail fin of much smaller area. Interesting.

I just had a small ventral fin installed on my Starboard Ace. Maybe just 5.25 sq in in area. I'm hoping it will reduce the tendency for the nose to get blown off course in strong side or quartering winds. I went with a smaller ventral fin since I do a lot of upwind-downwind paddles and I  don't want the ventral fin to have a negative impact on downwind paddling. We typically get 3-4 foot bumps in 20-25mph of wind with waves and wind chop coming from different directions due to bottom contours.

For the tail fin, I'll use a 39 sq in tail fin (similar to your Thresher but a little higher aspect). I have the Ninja as well, but think that would be too big.

Planning to test it out this weekend for the first time. Don't have the 3 fin tail set up yet though.

Argosi, In the latest pic by Starboard rider Tony Fajardo he switched Twins to Elliptical Probox Twins at 27 Sq inch, Ventral and Kick remand the same as earlier pics show at the Starboard World dealer photos that Larry Cain was riding.

These are the Elliptical Probox Twins in the pic.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 10:07:06 AM by ProBox-Larry »
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Argosi

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #25 on: October 03, 2016, 01:38:37 PM »
I just tried a small ventral fin (about 5 sq in) on my Starboard Ace on a downwinder. That's a bit small for a ventral fin though. It did a good job in reducing the tendency of the Ace's nose to get blown around in side and quartering winds. We had a long paddle in quartering winds to get a better line downwind and I think the ventral fin helped with tracking. Once we started downwind, I didn't notice any negative effects on the bumps. Conditions were about 3-5 foot bumps and 20mph of wind.

I also tried the same fin in flat water it seemed to help with tracking with no speed reduction. While drafting, I was able to move my board in and out of the draft with no problems.

I'd like to try a bigger ventral fin now.

Larry, does the shape of the ventral fin matter much or is the total area more important (as long as the fin has a base that's relatively long compared to its height)?

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #26 on: October 03, 2016, 04:05:06 PM »
I just tried a small ventral fin (about 5 sq in) on my Starboard Ace on a downwinder. That's a bit small for a ventral fin though. It did a good job in reducing the tendency of the Ace's nose to get blown around in side and quartering winds. We had a long paddle in quartering winds to get a better line downwind and I think the ventral fin helped with tracking. Once we started downwind, I didn't notice any negative effects on the bumps. Conditions were about 3-5 foot bumps and 20mph of wind.

I also tried the same fin in flat water it seemed to help with tracking with no speed reduction. While drafting, I was able to move my board in and out of the draft with no problems.

I'd like to try a bigger ventral fin now.

Larry, does the shape of the ventral fin matter much or is the total area more important (as long as the fin has a base that's relatively long compared to its height)?

A Ventral fin under 2 inches catches and misses like you already experienced. A Ventral fin over 3 inches causes reaction which works against you and dogs the board heavy drag. The window is 2 to 3 inches in height with a long base line to give you the sq inch surface area for lateral resistance against the torque of paddle power from pulling the nose of your board.
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ukgm

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2016, 12:16:57 AM »
Interesting and exciting 2 days at the Starboard world dealer event.


Did Svein see it and were there any useful comments from people (other than Larry) there ?

ukgm, Funny are we reading the same thread! I have not made any comments about the ride of this board. I posted quotes and comments from Starboard Rider Tony, Corey Hamilton, Larry Cain, Mick di Betta, Maru from Abita Barn a Starboard dealer.

Yes Svein seen the board, along with some emails! He advised riders to ride the board, along with giving permission to retro fit Starboard Rider Tony Fajardo board. Thought I would give my Zoner friends a peak of whats happening. Only so much I can say at this point with respect and privacy to Svein.

I have a suspicion that season to season board evolution will require increasing levels of design sea change (like multiple fin set ups) to keep people buying new boards with frequency. As a result, in the end, one of the big manufacturers is going to adopt this (whether it is well executed or not) to stimulate our purchases.

ukgm

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2016, 12:24:39 AM »
I'm really looking forward to someone producing some decent test data from a racing perspective, not just a paddling point of view. I'm hoping to acquire a board over the winter to do this myself.

Larry Allison

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Re: 2016 Starboard Surprise with a 12'/6" by 25" Allstar
« Reply #29 on: October 04, 2016, 08:35:49 AM »
Interesting and exciting 2 days at the Starboard world dealer event.


Did Svein see it and were there any useful comments from people (other than Larry) there ?

ukgm, Funny are we reading the same thread! I have not made any comments about the ride of this board. I posted quotes and comments from Starboard Rider Tony, Corey Hamilton, Larry Cain, Mick di Betta, Maru from Abita Barn a Starboard dealer.

Yes Svein seen the board, along with some emails! He advised riders to ride the board, along with giving permission to retro fit Starboard Rider Tony Fajardo board. Thought I would give my Zoner friends a peak of whats happening. Only so much I can say at this point with respect and privacy to Svein.

I have a suspicion that season to season board evolution will require increasing levels of design sea change (like multiple fin set ups) to keep people buying new boards with frequency. As a result, in the end, one of the big manufacturers is going to adopt this (whether it is well executed or not) to stimulate our purchases.

That is already happening ukgm, Adding multiple fins can be done to your existing board to expand its options, along with new boards coming with multiple fins for the user to have options. So your comment to stimulate purchases I disagree with. Manufactures will adopt this multiple fin concept for better performance of their product with a wider range of users.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2016, 08:45:28 AM by ProBox-Larry »
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