Author Topic: Stripped FCS Screw  (Read 11175 times)

Bean

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2016, 11:27:39 AM »
Hard to use dogmatic term like "all" or "every" when you are talking about fin boxes.  Some Futures boxes are indeed threaded 10-32, which is why I said, "look very closely at the FCS and Futures threads. The FCS should be 10-24 (coarse) and the Futures 10-32 (fine thread)".



mrbig

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2016, 11:52:40 AM »
+1 Judge Roy Bean! THEY AIN'T THE SAME!

Fine threads and coarse threads DIFFERENT!

And the stock FCS length is too short IMHO!

  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D
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PJBrendel

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2016, 12:32:49 PM »
Well I can only say That my "E-Bay" Futures and FCS screws have the same thread.  Which IMHO says nothing about the true size of a Futures fin screw.

I did think about a Helicoil insert but I'm hoping that this will be a one time repair and hold without the additional support since the other boxes seem OK. 

I don't think the fins will be changed much since I bought her green fins and a green leash to match so I know I'm set for a little while at least.

PonoBill I was going to tap the hole but now I'm curios about cutting a shallow slot in the screw. What would you use to do that?

Thanks


Dwight (DW)

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2016, 03:55:24 PM »
Hard to use dogmatic term like "all" or "every" when you are talking about fin boxes.  Some Futures boxes are indeed threaded 10-32, which is why I said, "look very closely at the FCS and Futures threads. The FCS should be 10-24 (coarse) and the Futures 10-32 (fine thread)".

Authentic USA Futures are 10-24 X 7/16. My glassing room has big box full of them.

mrbig

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #19 on: August 23, 2016, 05:07:13 PM »
Sniffed around on the interweb. Futures changed from coarse to fine threads also used M 5 for a bit in certain markets..And  used 10 32 as well..

Not the hill I want to die on, but there really isn't a correct answer as they have used many varying types in different markets at certain times..

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« Last Edit: August 23, 2016, 05:11:42 PM by mrbig »
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Bean

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2016, 09:14:47 PM »
Hard to use dogmatic term like "all" or "every" when you are talking about fin boxes.  Some Futures boxes are indeed threaded 10-32, which is why I said, "look very closely at the FCS and Futures threads. The FCS should be 10-24 (coarse) and the Futures 10-32 (fine thread)".

Authentic USA Futures are 10-24 X 7/16. My glassing room has big box full of them.

So based on your very narrow sample, there are no Futures boxes with 10-32 threads, is that right?  Nonsense...

jd

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #21 on: August 24, 2016, 06:29:12 PM »
From the Futures Website

How do you fix a stripped screw?
Step 1: Clean the box in question with a little fresh water to remove any sand or grit and make sure the screw hole and work area are clean and dry.

Step 2: When dry, use masking tape to cover the screw hole on the inside cavity of the box so the resin doesn't run out the bottom of the hole.

Step 3: Prepare the epoxy by following the instructions on the back of the package. Fill the screw hole with Five Minute epoxy. NOTE: Leave a little void at the top of the screw hole, to allow the drill to be started easier. Allow the epoxy to dry for a few hours.

Step 4: Use the #21 drill bit to drill a hole through the epoxy following angle of the original screw hole.

Step 5: Now use the 10-24 tap to re-tap the drilled hole following the angle of the original screw hole.

Step 6: Screw in the screw and check for tightness, then go for a surf!

Ive never known Futures to be 10-32.  Maybe used in offshore china special boards.  Ive used future screws in FCS when i wanted a longer screw.  One fix for the striped thread is to use a longer screw.  Usually your leash has the longer screw that works. 

Bean

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2016, 06:19:46 AM »
Ive never known Futures to be 10-32. Maybe used in offshore china special boards.  Ive used future screws in FCS when i wanted a longer screw.  One fix for the striped thread is to use a longer screw.  Usually your leash has the longer screw that works.

In any event, the take-away regardless of box type, is to make sure you know what screw size you have before you make your repairs. 

So, completely unrelated to this thread, but strikingly coincidental, I have about 40 cases of 10-32 taps for sale if anyone needs one. ;D

jsb

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2018, 06:57:21 PM »
I realize this thread is kinda stale, but I hope someone can give me some advice…

I have a Naish Mana GS that has a loose fin-screw that I’d like to repair.  I've got the following questions:

   1.   I know sometimes Naish does things “differently” than the rest of the industry.  The fins on the Mana have Naish graphics, but are set in FCS (NOT FCS II) mounts.  Can I safely assume that the Mana uses standard FCS screws?

   2.   Assuming the answer to #1 is yes, I need a 10-24 coarse tap, correct?  Does it matter whether it’s a hand-tap, or a high-speed tap?

   3.   Can I fill the screwhole with JB Weld, or do I need to use some kind of exotic epoxy/microballoon mix?  Will the tap work OK in the JB Weld, or will the JB Weld shatter when I try to tap it?

   4.   One of the posts in this thread suggested using a #21 bit to start the hole, but the following site (http://www.americanfastener.com/tap-and-drill-size-chart/) says #25. Which would you recommend?

   5.   Any suggestions on how to get the angle right when drilling the pilot hole?  If its too vertical, it won’t extrude into the finbox.  If it’s too horizontal, there may not be enough length in the hole to fully sink the screw.

   6.   Do you use a tap in epoxy the same way you would in metal?  (Eg, turn the tap a couple of turns, then back it out, then repeat as necessary).

   7.   Once I've tapped the screwhole, do you recommend adding anything to the hole to improve the durability of the threads, in the face of repeated fin changes?  Teflon tape?  Ivory soap? Steel wool?  (We used to use steel wool when mounting bindings in foam-core skis.  But this was an application where you didn’t need to back out the screws).

   8.   Any other advice?  As you can tell from the above n00b questions, I’ve never done this repair before.  Indeed, the whole idea of tapping a screwhole into epoxy seems kinda sketchy, but maybe it’s not as bad as it sounds… ;-)

TIA for any advice!

Bean

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #24 on: January 14, 2018, 08:12:49 PM »
You could bring the screw to your local hardware store to match the treads, then pick up the matching tap and drill bit.

As far as the angle goes, unless you have or make a jig, you will need to eyeball it.  Get the feel of the angle from one of the other holes.   Drilling a pilot hole with a small drill bit first helps.

PonoBill

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2018, 12:20:02 AM »
Here's the thing-- its plastic. You can screw anything into it. You can epoxy the hole closed and retap, or drill and tap the hole bigger, but the difference in diameter between 10/24 and 12/24 is .0250" (.1900 for 10/24 vs. .2150 for 12/24). You can grind flats on a 12/24 screw and just run it in, creating an ad hoc tap. Then get a 12/24 grub screw about 7/16" long and Bob's yer uncle. Yes, you'll have one odd screw. So what?
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

jsb

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2018, 07:51:29 AM »
Here's the thing-- its plastic. You can screw anything into it. You can epoxy the hole closed and retap, or drill and tap the hole bigger, but the difference in diameter between 10/24 and 12/24 is .0250" (.1900 for 10/24 vs. .2150 for 12/24). You can grind flats on a 12/24 screw and just run it in, creating an ad hoc tap. Then get a 12/24 grub screw about 7/16" long and Bob's yer uncle. Yes, you'll have one odd screw. So what?

I was hoping to re-use the existing screw, so that I don't have to worry about bringing a different allen wrench to the beach each day.  Yes, I'll have to buy a tap that I don't currently have, but once I have it, I should be able to do this same repair on any FCS fin.  And it seems like a repair that probably comes up ALL the time, given the janky design of sinking the  fin screw directly into the board material -- I would have thought that FCS would provide some kind of collar that the shaper could embed in the glass, kinda like a drywall collar.

This whole approach of making the repair repeatable is predicated on the assumption that all FCS screws are the same size, eg, 10-24 coarse.  The reason I'm not following Bean's suggestion and sizing it at my local HW store is that I actually trust the wisdom on this site more than I do my HW store -- especially when it comes to the question of whether FCS screws are always sized the same.

Thanks again for the help -- there's a ton of know-how in the Zoner community!

jsb

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #27 on: January 15, 2018, 07:56:54 AM »
As far as the angle goes, unless you have or make a jig, you will need to eyeball it.  Get the feel of the angle from one of the other holes.   Drilling a pilot hole with a small drill bit first helps.

I was thinking of maybe setting a toothpick in the epoxy, and trying to center it as well as possible before it sets.  Then I could use the toothpick as at least a visual guide.  Not as good as a jig, but building a custom jig for the specific angle that my shaper used for the original hole is more work than I'm prepared to undertake.

Can anybody see any obvious problems with this approach?

Thanks!

Dwight (DW)

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #28 on: January 15, 2018, 08:26:40 AM »
The days of removing your fins every time you finish surfing are over in my opinion. Leave them in.

If you fill the hole with epoxy, drill and tap, it will be more headache than you think. The drill is not likely to behave. Different hardness of epoxy versus plastic will make it wander.

Just use a larger screw like Bill said, and leave the fins in whenever possible.

The quick and easy solution, dip the screw in epoxy, screw it in and forget about removing the fin.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 08:29:27 AM by Dwight (DW) »

Bean

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Re: Stripped FCS Screw
« Reply #29 on: January 15, 2018, 02:42:10 PM »
The reason I'm not following Bean's suggestion and sizing it at my local HW store is that I actually trust the wisdom on this site more than I do my HW store -- especially when it comes to the question of whether FCS screws are always sized the same.

HD, Lowes, etc. usually have a display with all the common male and female sizes, so no guess-work (no unproductive interaction). 

But, going up a size from 10-24 to 12-24 like PB and DW suggested could be a good alternative since the hex key size should be the same (at 3/32") for both sizes.  Either way, for about $5, pick up a tap and corresponding drill and you're all set.

Don't be tempted to simply heat up a 12-24 screw and drive it home...

 
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 02:45:00 PM by Bean »

 


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