Author Topic: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide  (Read 10752 times)

supuk

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2015, 12:55:31 PM »
it is not the carbon that has the short life span it is normal the fact that a lot of companies only use very small amounts of it to get the boards as light as posable, it makes the board stiff enough to use but carbon is a lot more brittle than glass so on a foam core it can pick up dings a lot easier as it is so thin and then lead to water intake and a faster deterioration of the board. once you have found out exactly what the layup of the boards are it will be a lot easier to figure what will be the most durable if that is you main concern.

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2015, 12:58:15 PM »
O.K., thanks for the clarification. Something I will definitely look into. Thanks again.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

photofr

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2015, 01:10:15 PM »
I don't mean to pry or anything, but here are some facts:
Glass will last longer.
Carbon will be lighter, and just "more fun".
We only live once (as far as I know).
Perhaps you should get something really nice (carbon), with the intent that if you really really like it a lot, you will want a newer shape within 3 years any way.
In 3 years, judging from what you are saying, your board will still have some good life left. You will be able to get some money back and get another light carbon board.

If at 50+ we can't have really fun and light stuff, then I question why have we worked so darn hard ALL OF OUR LIVES ?

Keep smiling, have even more fun !
Nelo SUP - 14' x 23"
Nelo Surfski 560M - 18'4" x 17"

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #18 on: August 26, 2015, 01:47:16 PM »
I don't mean to pry or anything, but here are some facts:
Glass will last longer.
Carbon will be lighter, and just "more fun".
We only live once (as far as I know).
Perhaps you should get something really nice (carbon), with the intent that if you really really like it a lot, you will want a newer shape within 3 years any way.
In 3 years, judging from what you are saying, your board will still have some good life left. You will be able to get some money back and get another light carbon board.

If at 50+ we can't have really fun and light stuff, then I question why have we worked so darn hard ALL OF OUR LIVES ?

Keep smiling, have even more fun !


You’re not prying at all, and quite frankly I love your attitude! I’ve just always had this thing about keeping equipment in good shape and making it last. When I find something I like I’m not opposed to paying more, but I do want it to last.

And while I know carbon will be lighter, I’m not 100% convinced it will be “more fun”. Just not sure about that??? From what I understand, I’ll accelerate more quickly with a lighter board, but once I get up to speed I really won’t notice any difference in how it handles???

I probably also should have mentioned the type of paddling I do. It is mostly for recreation and exercise. Once in a while I go in “fun” races, but I do not do any competitive racing. I will paddle almost completely on a lake where we have a cabin. It will be mostly flat conditions, but the wind does come up in the afternoon and it can get pretty choppy.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

Jeroensurf

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2015, 02:07:37 PM »
It is really depending on the lay-up.
There can be a couple of options:
Same lay-up:
Light build: If the Carbon board is build for ultimate lightness the glass board will be almost as fragile and a lot more flexible because you need more glass to get the same stiffness as  with carbon.

Different lay-up: If the beefed up the Glass to become as stiff as the carbon you have a serious weight penalty.
There is also a possibility they gained so much weight with the carbon over the Glass construction that they reinforced the carbon a bit on strategic points. If you look at the Starboard Raceboards there is actually more layers and cloth in the carbon ones as in the glass...
Carbon is fragile but when used well it can last pretty long.
I windsurf (wavesailing) and have carbon-sandwich windsurfboards, its unbelievable what they can hold up.
Supwise I have 2 carbon wavesups and owned 4 carbon race sups the last couple of years, put them a couple of times a week on the car and had only once a small ding in my deck after a 5000km holiday tour through Europe with 3 other boards on top of it...something a glass board would have  as well.  What I do use is rail-savertape to protect the rails, that helps a lot to prevent damages.

Performance wise I prever carbon because besides the weight the often stiffer construction accelerates easier. That isnt just at the start, but as well when you are paddling and do a bit of a sprint in between to the next pont or whatever.
I paddled a Glass board as well and although I liked the board too it just needs a higher heart-rate to keep the same pace as it bounces more in chop taking some of the energy I put in it to keep forward momentum.






Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2015, 08:45:41 PM »
It is really depending on the lay-up.
There can be a couple of options:
Same lay-up:
Light build: If the Carbon board is build for ultimate lightness the glass board will be almost as fragile and a lot more flexible because you need more glass to get the same stiffness as  with carbon.

Different lay-up: If the beefed up the Glass to become as stiff as the carbon you have a serious weight penalty.
There is also a possibility they gained so much weight with the carbon over the Glass construction that they reinforced the carbon a bit on strategic points. If you look at the Starboard Raceboards there is actually more layers and cloth in the carbon ones as in the glass...
Carbon is fragile but when used well it can last pretty long.
I windsurf (wavesailing) and have carbon-sandwich windsurfboards, its unbelievable what they can hold up.
Supwise I have 2 carbon wavesups and owned 4 carbon race sups the last couple of years, put them a couple of times a week on the car and had only once a small ding in my deck after a 5000km holiday tour through Europe with 3 other boards on top of it...something a glass board would have  as well.  What I do use is rail-savertape to protect the rails, that helps a lot to prevent damages.

Performance wise I prever carbon because besides the weight the often stiffer construction accelerates easier. That isnt just at the start, but as well when you are paddling and do a bit of a sprint in between to the next pont or whatever.
I paddled a Glass board as well and although I liked the board too it just needs a higher heart-rate to keep the same pace as it bounces more in chop taking some of the energy I put in it to keep forward momentum.


Thanks so much for your informative post. I’ve gone back and forth on this so many times and I’m still not sure what I’m going to do.

I have found out that the carbon board weighs 23 pounds and the glass board weighs 27 pounds. My current board (which is glass and is not a race board) weighs 32 pounds, so either of these is an improvement. The owner of the Company is away right now, but he does have a young fellow working for him who told me the weight of the boards and he also thought that the carbon board had 2 layers of carbon with 4 layers on the rails, but he is not 100% sure.

I know they have a demo board in both carbon and glass so I’m hoping to be able to demo both boards when the owner gets back early next week. At this point I’m thinking that if I don’t notice much difference in the boards I’ll probably get the glass.

The advantage of getting the glass is that I can get it right away (they have one left in stock), whereas if I want the carbon I’ll have to wait until next year. As well, because I live in Canada, I’m pretty sure there will be a large price increase next year because our dollar has fallen so much against the American dollar.

Anyway, that’s my thinking right now.

Thanks so much to all who have responded, and any other suggestions are always appreciated.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

Rakky

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2015, 01:11:05 AM »
Carbon...carbon...carbon! 
If it is your first board, and you will ding it a lot during learning, then fiberglass. 
Otherwise, I prefer the carbon - for many reasons the pervious posts mention.  Especially as it is lighter to carry
Starboard widepoint 8'10. 
I'm 5'11 and 185 = high BMI

Jeroensurf

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2015, 08:28:17 AM »
23 and 27 pound is both pretty light but especially for a glass board so they put probably less cloth in the glassed one as the carbon makes me thinking the carbon one is probably stiffer and stronger.

The strong dollar makes with next year indeed the price difference bigger. On the other side, if you already know you want one, the can pre-order it for you and if you do a first payment and they know for sure you,l take it they can give you a bigger discount.
(But because of the Dollar I also opted last month for a discounted 2015 Starboard Race14x25 instead of waiting for the new but extra expensive 2016 line up).

 


Eagle

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #23 on: August 30, 2015, 08:46:36 AM »
it is not the carbon that has the short life span it is normal the fact that a lot of companies only use very small amounts of it to get the boards as light as posable, it makes the board stiff enough to use but carbon is a lot more brittle than glass so on a foam core it can pick up dings a lot easier as it is so thin and then lead to water intake and a faster deterioration of the board. once you have found out exactly what the layup of the boards are it will be a lot easier to figure what will be the most durable if that is you main concern.

We have seen one carbon board with a 1" crack on its bottom - the layup was surprisingly thin.  If any board is too light there should be some concern about the layup being fragile.  Provided you care for a carbon board it should be quite durable.  Ours still look pretty much like new even with a fair amount of use and abuse.

Testing both boards should help out a lot.  We have noticed no major differences between full carbon and glass other than the our carbon boards do not pressure dent.  They are lighter and easier to carry plus feel a bit faster and easier to paddle.

Since you already have a board you can compare the wear and tear on it.  If it only has a few light scuffs and no dings then a carbon one may be ok used with care.  If it looks worn out then definitely stick to glass.   ;)

Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #24 on: August 30, 2015, 10:14:46 AM »
it is not the carbon that has the short life span it is normal the fact that a lot of companies only use very small amounts of it to get the boards as light as posable, it makes the board stiff enough to use but carbon is a lot more brittle than glass so on a foam core it can pick up dings a lot easier as it is so thin and then lead to water intake and a faster deterioration of the board. once you have found out exactly what the layup of the boards are it will be a lot easier to figure what will be the most durable if that is you main concern.

We have seen one carbon board with a 1" crack on its bottom - the layup was surprisingly thin.  If any board is too light there should be some concern about the layup being fragile.  Provided you care for a carbon board it should be quite durable.  Ours still look pretty much like new even with a fair amount of use and abuse.

Testing both boards should help out a lot.  We have noticed no major differences between full carbon and glass other than the our carbon boards do not pressure dent.  They are lighter and easier to carry plus feel a bit faster and easier to paddle.

Since you already have a board you can compare the wear and tear on it.  If it only has a few light scuffs and no dings then a carbon one may be ok used with care.  If it looks worn out then definitely stick to glass.   ;)


Sorry, not sure what a "pressure dent" is???
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

Eagle

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #25 on: August 30, 2015, 10:42:58 AM »
Pressure dents are small depression indentations due to pressure from your fingers or hips or putting your board down on hard objects.  We have a version 1 Dominator and have many small pressure dents also.  It appears mainly cosmetic as the board continues to paddle and handle splendidly.  It seems caused from a board that is laid up too lightly during manufacturing in an effort to reduce weight.  The video below shows a board with extreme pressure denting -

"I am pretty careful with my equipment, but even within the first couple of weeks I had acquired indentations on the bottom of the board."

"Since then I have somehow managed to acquire other small indentations on the Dominator as well, and there is a small area where the paint has chipped off. "

http://www.supglobal.com/stand-up-paddle/reviews/255-review-of-the-surftech-bark-dominator-14-ft-stand-up-paddle-board.html

http://youtu.be/Yvsts_G-uvI
Fast is FUN!   8)
Dominator - Touring Pintail - Bullet V2 - M14 - AS23

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #26 on: August 30, 2015, 11:35:41 AM »
Pressure dents are small depression indentations due to pressure from your fingers or hips or putting your board down on hard objects.  We have a version 1 Dominator and have many small pressure dents also.  It appears mainly cosmetic as the board continues to paddle and handle splendidly.  It seems caused from a board that is laid up too lightly during manufacturing in an effort to reduce weight.  The video below shows a board with extreme pressure denting -

"I am pretty careful with my equipment, but even within the first couple of weeks I had acquired indentations on the bottom of the board."

"Since then I have somehow managed to acquire other small indentations on the Dominator as well, and there is a small area where the paint has chipped off. "

http://www.supglobal.com/stand-up-paddle/reviews/255-review-of-the-surftech-bark-dominator-14-ft-stand-up-paddle-board.html

http://youtu.be/Yvsts_G-uvI

Thanks for this.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #27 on: September 03, 2015, 01:50:47 PM »
O.K. guys, kind of stoked right now. Just waiting for delivery of my new, and first, race board. I said I’d get back to everyone, so I wanted to let you know I ended up going with fiberglass.

I paddled both boards (carbon and glass versions) yesterday. The carbon did accelerate more quickly, but it was not a huge difference. I also noticed that I thought the carbon board was quicker “swinging around” in buoy turns. Having said all that, I got offered a killer deal on the fiberglass board that I just couldn’t turn down. As well, I got the last new glass board he has in stock, and it was in the colour I wanted. If I wanted a new carbon board I would have had to wait until next year, and as I said earlier in my posts, with the value of the American dollar (I’m Canadian) the price will be going up.

Just to clarify, he does have one demo carbon board and one demo glass board, but I got his last new glass board, and he doesn’t have any more new carbon boards.

So given the deal I got, the fact I’ve got the board now instead of having to wait until next year, the price increase on all the boards next year, and I got the colour I wanted, I’m beyond pleased with what I’m getting.

I expect the board to weigh somewhere around 27 pounds, which is much lighter than the 32 pounds my current touring board weighs (my touring board is 12’ 6” x 29” and the new race board is 12’ 6” x 25”).

Thanks again to everyone for their help with this. Was very much appreciated.

Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

newton333

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #28 on: September 03, 2015, 02:43:20 PM »
carbon  and a starboard.. get the best

Quickbeam

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Re: New Board - Carbon or Glass??? Help Me Decide
« Reply #29 on: September 03, 2015, 03:21:37 PM »
carbon  and a starboard.. get the best

Sorry, not carbon and not a Starboard but, in my humble opinion, still a very, very nice board.
Infinity Blackfish 12’ 6” x 23”
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 24”
Infinity Whiplash 12' 6" x 24 1/2"
ONE SUP Evo 12’ 6” x 26”
Bark Competitor 12’ 6” x 29”
Red Paddle Explorer (Inflatable) 13' 2" x 30
Starboard Airline (Inflatable) 12’ 6” x 27

 


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