Author Topic: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games  (Read 4201 times)

PonoBill

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Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« on: July 29, 2015, 04:18:13 PM »
Truly weird. The PPG (Replacement for the BOP) announced board classes:  http://www.supthemag.com/news/board-classes-announced-pacific-paddle-games/

All men's divisions are one class--14' or smaller. So you can paddle a 12'6" or a surfboard, but you'll be up against 14's
All women's classes are 12'6". No mention of smaller. As written, women have no choice but a 12'6"

Gotta say. WTF? I'm trying to figure out what they're trying to solve with that. Or who is pulling what string.

Here's a lift:

What we do have is the Pacific Paddle Games, to be held at Doheny State Park on October 10 and 11. And what we’re doing is simplifying.

The inaugural PPG board classes are as follows. Make your plans accordingly.

All Men’s divisions, including Pro Technical, Pro Distance, Open Technical and Open Distance will be 14-foot or smaller. One class.

All Women’s divisions, including Pro Technical, Pro Distance, Open Technical and Open Distance will be 12’6″.

All Juniors, from Pro and Open will be 12’6” for both males and females. There will be an Open Unlimited class in the Distance for SUP and Prone. Prone Technical will be 12’ stock and 10’6″ surf race.

Age groups will apply to the open classes only.

Stay tuned for more info on registration, prize purse and courses.


If they're looking to shrink the event, that's one way to do it. I might drive down to surf and play, but I'm not going to buy a 14' board to participate in a class I don't like. I've got a couple of very outdated 14's that I guess I could dust off. Maybe the woodie Javelin. But I'll probably just spectate. too bad, I was really looking forward to this one.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2015, 04:46:47 PM by PonoBill »
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Chilly

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2015, 05:33:26 PM »
I see there point on simplifying the race. Jim Terrell brought this up years ago with the suggestion of a 4 meter class. This could be the beginning of the end for the mens  12’6 Class. 
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stoneaxe

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2015, 05:39:39 PM »
That sounds so limiting. I've kind of had my fill of racing though. Kind of pointless unless I'm racing other Clydesdales on unlimited boards or at least similar boards. I can challenge myself without entering a race. Events to me are about seeing friends. I will say I'd have less issue with limiting board classes if there were better weight/age classes. The biggest problem for that kind of solution at most events though is critical mass.....I'd podium every race here in the 50-60 yrs and 250lbs+ division.....likely 1st place in fact.... ;)

Bill, I think if you take that woodie javelin into a beach break race someone should kick you in the nuts.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2015, 05:56:34 PM by stoneaxe »
Bob

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PonoBill

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2015, 06:44:39 PM »
Probably the beginning of the end for large-scale races. Sponsors need bodies, that means making events as inclusive as possible. The notion of there being a perfect board size for competition is just silly. Everything anyone knows about board design says that's so. We've already altered the pro classes to the point where big, powerful racers can't compete, and so they don't. Not a huge deal for sponsors since they aren't selling to pros, they're using pros to add cachet to their product. But changing the game in the open class means that a much greater number of people can't be competitive, and will have to buy boards that they don't currently own and that won't suit them even to just play.

So they won't. We're already seeing race entry numbers drop.

As in all cases involving personal choices vs. market trends the effect of limiting choices won't be obvious. Decreased participation will be blamed on some other set of issues. In a narrow sport like SUP the effect is hard to overcome. There won't be a significant number of manufacturers bucking the trend. Self fulfilling decisions. Skiing got saved from overspecialization with shaped skis--a crossover from snowboards. Before that the "good" skis were getting harder and harder to ski on. Everyone knows what happened to windsurfers--all the gear moved to high performance leaving nothing for the beginners. Same thing with motorcycles. Where are the beginner bikes?

But this isn't a manufacturer decision (at least I don't think it is). It's just odd.
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pdxmike

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2015, 06:59:11 PM »
Is "technical" a BOP-type surf race? 

I can see their logic if that's so.  If there's a distance race and a surf race, then a 14' board is probably better for most people for the distance race, and either a 14 or a 12-6 for the surf race.  They may have been thinking if the class is "14' or smaller" then someone who wants to bring only one board can use a 14' that works well for distance and is at least manageable, albeit maybe a compromise for surf.  Or they can use a 12-6 that's idea for them for surf, and at least manageable, albeit a compromise, for distance.

Or they can bring two boards if they want to use a 12-6 for surf and a 14' for distance. 


Of course if they had categories for many types of boards (surf, 12-6, 14, UL) then you could bring one board and be competitive within your class in every event, and competitive overall (not just inside your class) in at least one distance.

There is an unlimited category for open distance also. 

It seems like the biggest losers might be people wanting a surfboard class, and also by cutting the categories there will be a lot fewer people getting awards. 

All those comments are related to men only, since the women and juniors only get 12-6. 

Then there's the whole larger issue of arbitrary board lengths in general...and also the pro vs. open and whether it makes sense to apply the same rules...and...
« Last Edit: July 29, 2015, 07:21:55 PM by pdxmike »

Tom

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2015, 07:13:51 PM »
Well, if they set the standard, like the BOP did, there's going to be a fire sale on 12'6"-ers.

pdxmike

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2015, 09:41:22 PM »
I hadn't thought much about its impact on the 12-6 class.  Probably because  that class has been dead around here (races are almost all flatwater except for a few downwind) for at least a couple years.  14s may outnumber 12-6s 8 or 10 to 1 for men.

TallDude

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2015, 10:47:54 PM »
A guy weighing around 150# could really do well on a 14' x 24" or narrower. Lately I've some of the serious women paddlers starting to go to 14' boards too.
It's not overhead to me!
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PonoBill

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2015, 11:20:54 PM »
The announcement actually says the men's open distance is 14' or smaller, one class. Then under the Junior section it says there will be an unlimited class for SUP and prone.  No idea what that means.

I looked back at the previous BOP races at Doheny through 2013, 14' was the most popular class for men, but the combination of surf class and 12'6" totals more entries than 14' for all years. Surf class has been surprisingly popular. And here I thought I was one of the only ones that liked it. Unlimited participation fell off precipitously over the years.

It will be interesting to see what the outcome is of this puzzling decision. I expect that the late start in getting the event organized, board classes announced, and registration up will trim some entries, and the strange and off-putting board class decision will trim more. With the hefty purse they should have no trouble getting the pros to show up, but the open class might be pretty thin.
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TEX_SUP

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2015, 06:59:27 PM »

I looked back at the previous BOP races at Doheny through 2013, 14' was the most popular class for men, but the combination of surf class and 12'6" totals more entries than 14' for all years. Surf class has been surprisingly popular. And here I thought I was one of the only ones that liked it. Unlimited participation fell off precipitously over the years.


I analyzed all the major SoCal races a few years back and noticed the same thing.  Boards less than 12'6 are hugely popular.  It's basically a "recreational" class.  Paddlers who don't want to spend big money on a fragile 12'6 or 14' race board.  They show up on a surf board, or a touring board, or an all-arounder and just want to have fun like most recreational runners entering a 5k.

gorgebob

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2015, 09:30:42 PM »
I agree with the divisions. If they do have unlimited that would be great. Surf class can enter under 12'6" and still race. If your serious in racing you will get a race board. If you just want to have fun you can still enter the event. There is a guy in our area who owns every size board and seems to enter the board that will give him a chance at the podium even if he is the only one in that class. He always has fun but he always complains when not every board style and size has its own division. Men on 14, women on 12'6" , unlimited and rec class (everything).

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FloridaWindSUP

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2015, 05:16:59 AM »
There's no perfect board class decision, and I think this one is actually pretty good, with just one major bad aspect.

Good: No separation of 12'6 and 14' class for men. Some people say 12'6 boards are superior in surf and technical races- now they can try to prove it by racing their 12'6s against 14s. Also, some heavier people who might not normally be competitive in a surf race could do better now that they're allowed to use their 14's in the surf races.

Bad: Missed an opportunity to apply the "14' or less" rule to women, too. Forcing women to do even the distance race on 12'6 is cruel. If women tend to be less powerful paddlers due to physical differences, why worsen that disadvantage by making them ride slower boards that require more power to maintain speed? If boards were barbells, the 12'6, not the 14', would be the heaviest set of barbells. Crazy.

Dunno: Juniors on 12'6. Perhaps this class could be 14' and down, too.

Dunno: Unlimited class in distance race but not in surf races. Would anyone actually want to paddle unlimited in the surf races?
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PonoBill

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Re: Board Class Announcement for Pacific Paddle Games
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2015, 06:36:01 AM »
Ive raced unlimited in the surf class every year at the BOP .  I planned to race surf class at salt creek but realized id be starting into mayhem.  So i was one of five guys that raced unlimited at Salt Creek.  It used to be a reasonably sized field but it was silly small at Salt Creek.

I dont mind stuffing 12'6 and 14 race boards together, though i dont see. The point, but why no surf class?

Surely the concern cant be the expense of trophies. Every racer covers much more that that cost. At 75 bucks an event he incremental income of adding more entrants makes any number of classes viable. No one races for little medals but everyone wants to measure themselves equal competition.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2015, 06:51:44 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

 


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