Author Topic: Your living room Tesla  (Read 26158 times)

Tom

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2015, 09:30:23 AM »
I'm thinking that developing a battery to power a house can be a huge game changer for energy mainly due to the transport of the power. Here in Southern California we are having a lot of controversy with locating solar power farms. The population is near the coast and the sunshine and cheaper land in the desert 100+ miles away. To get the solar generated power from the desert to the population centers they have to construct power lines through parks, private land, farms, and small communities.  Would it be possible to charge home batteries at a desert solar farm and transport them to cities by truck or rail? Then, when your home battery drops in power, take it to a exchange facility like you do with your 5 lb BBQ propane tank.

PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2015, 04:51:20 PM »
Yes, but its a much simpler thing to use existing distribution off hours and off demand. It can be micro scheduled if the system is smart enough. In most areas that enables distribution resources to be at least doubled but often much more. ,,
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eastbound

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2015, 04:15:17 AM »
econ of all this stuff requires that crude trade well back into the 100's.

i suspect the breakdown of opec, which resulted in crude trading to the 50's, was all spin--where the real mission was to cheapen crude, render competing (often more environmentally considerate) technologies diseconomic, and cause them to rust.
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PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2015, 07:11:09 AM »
Of course it was. Could anyone doubt that?  despite no such analysis in the media I assume that is common knowledge. A way to stop frackimg other than relying on hollywood ditzes.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

SuppaTime

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2015, 07:32:45 AM »
I'm thinking that developing a battery to power a house can be a huge game changer for energy mainly due to the transport of the power. Here in Southern California we are having a lot of controversy with locating solar power farms.

The utility companies need to be separated into generating companies and grid companies. A lot of the economic problems arising today (like net metering controversies) are due to who subsidizes what. Everyone who is grid-attached should pay a grid usage charge. But only those who consume power will pay that. In fact that whole thing could be free-marketized - you generate your PV power and sell it when you want, when the price is to your liking. You can battery store it for later selling (or your own use), or just sell it immediately to a grid-attached power broker if you don't want to buy batteries. Presumably the power-broker has batteries and is just a middle man. All of this just requires smart metering, basically could use the Internet to facilitate who is providing, at what rate, and who is consuming and at what rate.

Money is a powerful motivator and if the utilities are forced to allow more competitive use of their grid, a whole lot of opportunities will open up and will foster more creative renewable energy projects.

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PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2015, 07:52:54 AM »
Remember enron and the california brownouts? California separated utilities into distribution and generation, the end result was an easy play for creating scarity to drive price up.  In that scenario generation utilities have no requirement to serve coonsumers while the distribution utilities do.  the regulators instituted price controls but they could be undone by creating emergencies. Presto, emergency.  If generators have no economic ince tive to provide power at the lowest cost and no reliability requirement, then two things happen, the system gets less reliable, and less large scale generation gets built.  The logical next step is central planning, and we know how well that works. Doesnt mean idisconnecting utility function isnt a good idea, but like every other government regulatory action it has unexpected consequences. The market is going to assert itself anyway. The utilities are constrianed by the economics of plant size whereas smart grids and individual power generation and storage has no such constraint. solar city is on a path to be the largest utility in the us in terms of total generation. 
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #21 on: August 11, 2015, 06:33:01 PM »
I recently read an interesting analysis of the cost of oil. Lots of room for fluff in there, but there's a reasonable argument that oil costs the US between 30 and 70 Trillion per year. Our GDP last year was 17 Trillion. It's about 30 trillion if you include all economic costs including environmental damage and 70 Trillion if you include climate change costs.

Even at 30 trillion the cost of alternate energy generation and smartgrids starts to look very reasonable.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

eastbound

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2015, 05:08:16 AM »
ah but PB, but try explaining "indirect costs" like enviro damage etc to hard-driving business folk, like our esteemed chamber of commerce, or most republicans, frankly. until those costs actually cost someone or cost a business entity, they aint part of the equation..i believe they should be but the US is apparently not ready.

this said spot crude trades mid-low 40's--i am scaling in distant contracts

dont tell my daughters--they'd disown me for seeking to profit on crude prices
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PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #23 on: August 12, 2015, 06:22:41 AM »
I think oil will stay at 40 until the last fracking company dies. Even just the direct costs of 10 Trillion seem like they should be enough of an impetus.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

eastbound

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #24 on: August 12, 2015, 02:10:29 PM »
like i say distant contracts--theyve crushed carry so it's not too pricey to go way out the calendar--but you may be right that the tide has finally turned for crude, but ive made money buying down here before, so i will try again

another hypocrisy--progdem trades crude oil!

i can con myself into thinking i am doing good by contributing to higher prices and encouraging alternatives

yes, i am laughing too.
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headmount

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #25 on: August 12, 2015, 03:51:11 PM »
You can lease a Nissan Leaf now for around the monthly cost of my current gas charges per month at $3/gal.  That price is the lowest I've seen in years here but even at that the EV looks good for cost to own.  A $30/month card here on Maui allows you to fast charge your vehicle at 9 stations on the island.  Slap some racks on that baby....

PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2015, 05:45:11 PM »
That little Volt is a great car. When the engine falls out of my Nissan (probably right on the ground in front of Larry) I'm gonna get one. the chances of Diane letting me put racks on that one will only improve if she hands it down to me and gets a new one. Fat chance. She keeps cars forever. I'd probably buy a stripped version of the Volt and have the roof sprayed with bedliner. That or do some massive cathodic protection system that will stop a pacemaker on anyone who touches the car.

Nice thing with the Volt is I don't have to worry about charging it. Usually the charge from sitting in the garage is enough for a full day of travel. If it's not the gas motor kicks in and you can't tell the difference. Six months on the island with daily travel from the boonies and Diane used eight gallons of gas. And most of that because we needed to run out the old stuff before we stored it for the summer.

Nice thing with the Leaf is that people have already done the work for it to serve as a personal smartgrid. DC feed to a wall mounted inverter to run the house. The Leaf software already does off-hours scheduled charging--most modern EVs do. Maui doesn't charge a peak usage time rate yet, but they should. Run your house off the car during peaks when you aren't using it and charge when it's cheap. Or connect to PV and go off grid whenever a car is in the garage.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

connector14

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #27 on: August 13, 2018, 03:41:55 PM »
Of course you can go it on your own, the engineering is trivial. The slick bit is the control and integration software, and making it utility compatible which isnt easy unless you do some  clugy isolation relay. Anyone can charge batteries from a pv system and connect a inverter to make ac. But integrated systems that can be bought in increments for about the cost of the components is pretty slick. 

There isnt an entrepreneur operating at the big end who anyone is going to "trust". Execution at that level demands a mindset that simply isnt pleasant.  But the guy brought spacex to some version of profitability. he's probably the only hope that an american spacecraft will carry people anytime soon, and he's currently resupplyinf the iss with falcon nines..Built tesla from weenie little company to a company buiding the safest car ever tested, with absurd performance, and a nationwide network of high speed superchargers that let you drive them across the country for free.  And built the dominant solar power installation company in the us, an shortly probably the biggest manufacturer or high performance solar panels. And the gigafactory. And paypal.

I find it strange that he has so manu detractors.  Certainly he's not someone you want to hang out with, but geez.
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connector14

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2018, 03:45:49 PM »
The guy can build surfboards too....... ;D
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PonoBill

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Re: Your living room Tesla
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2018, 05:12:36 PM »
The detractors are super noise. I suspect funny business with the short sellers. The model for a large company in the age of Amazon is very different than most people are used to. If I were running Tesla I'd do everything I could to take it private, or at least gain control of a majority of the stock so the hedge fund guys wouldn't have me by the dick. 
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

 


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