Author Topic: First carbon paddle recommendation?  (Read 5684 times)

zirkel

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First carbon paddle recommendation?
« on: October 24, 2014, 11:19:44 AM »
Newbie here looking to upgrade current FG paddle to carbon. 

I'm 5'9 and 150 lbs and currently paddle a 12'6 x 29 board with a 76" paddle and 100 SI blade, solely on flatwater lakes.  I look forward to trying a race or two next season. 

I'm looking for something in the $300+ range.  I THINK I'm looking for a blade size around 90 SI, and an oval shaft.  I've had prior shoulder surgeries and like a little flex the my paddle shaft.  I've used and like the grips on both Werner and QB eva foam.  DURABILITY and FLEX seem to be more important to me than light weight.

Nitro?  Kahana?  Others?

Any suggestions that meet the above criteria?  I know everyone sez demo, demo and demo but, living where I do, I don't have that option.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: October 24, 2014, 11:29:59 AM by zirkel »

jumpfrom13k

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2014, 12:07:19 PM »
Craigslist.

Twitchy

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2014, 04:15:48 PM »
My first 3 paddles were no-name carbons.  I broke two of them (shafts) and still have the third that goes largely unused.  I bought a QB Kanaha AC 100 and love it.  I then picked up a QB V-Drive and love it even more.  I now use the Kanaha for surfing and the VD for flat water/racing.  It was an entirely different feel with each paddle.  Going back to the no-name feels like I'm using a 20 pound 2x4 compared to the other two.  The two QB paddles actually give me feed back.  I can't adequately describe the feeling of each of them, but the VD is by far the best paddle I've used.  I'm just too worried about messing it up to use it in surf.

Edit-I guess I would recommend the Kanaha AC for a good all-around first carbon paddle.
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PonoBill

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2014, 04:36:56 PM »
You'll undoubtedly get some useful response here. We're kind of a bunch of paddle fanatics. I co-founded Ke Nalu paddles but sold it to my partner. I have no remaining financial interest. But I like the paddles a lot. I think for people who have compromised shoulders Ke Nalu is the only choice. I like Quickblade and Kialoa paddles a lot, Warner a little less, and I think ZRE makes fine paddles. But if your shoulders are touchy, then it's Ke Nalu. Ke Nalus have a component approach, and they were designed from the start to assemble with hot glue. Not just the handle, but the shaft and blade. The xTuf(S) shaft is stiff under load but for the first two inches of flex it's softly progressive. If your shoulders are really junk, then the xTuf shaft is the ticket--keeps flexing softly for about four inches, and then gently locks up. When and if your shoulders get stronger you can buy a 90 flex or 100 flex shaft to swap in when you want to hit it hard. You can buy any Ke Nalu component separately.

People who own a lot of ke Nalu components also have either a cheap, hot hair dryer or a heat gun and mix parts and change length ruthlessly. It's a cult. 

At your size and weight I go with either the Wiki, or the Konihi 84. The Konihi is a very strange blade, but it's fast. It doesn't feel right, it does strange, dead, quiet things in the water, but you'll go fast and when you're done you'll think you didn't hit it hard enough.

I know that sounds weird, but you won't find anyone that uses Konihis to refute that. It's great for bad shoulders. The Wiki feels better, but it's not as fast.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2014, 04:45:12 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

zirkel

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2014, 06:12:24 PM »
jump:  I live in a rural area not served by Craigslist.  Thanks anyways.

Twitchy:  The V-drive is substantially out of my price range.  The Kahana AC is at the top of my list.

PonoBill:  I'm intrigued, and have read much of the Ke Nalu lovefest on this site.  I just assumed they were out of my price range.  But, upon closer inspection of their website, and correct me if I'm wrong...  I could get (and you would recommend considering my size and intended usage):

xTuf wiki 84 blade
xTuf shaft (70 flex)
ergo handle
hot glue

All for under $300?

And, as a nordic skier, I also happen to own a heat gun!

Thanks, Dave

Eagle

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2014, 06:28:37 PM »
Not to put you off KN or any other paddle …..

Have tried numerous paddles over the years and you can tell in a short time whether one works or not.  We lucked out in that we got to test every board and paddle before we ended up buying - everything we purchased used or demo.  All in all probably saved around 50%.

We ended up with a Riviera R8.5 and SB high aspect 500 both round shafts.  One is a sprint power blade - the other a high cadence long distance cruncher.  Shaft lengths and blade angles play a role as does overall weight blade weight blade shape blade area shaft flex tip flex balance durability etc.  Some blades like the SB now come with an abs rail to reduce edge wear and tear.  The Riviera is tiring on the traps going full out but pulls a ton - the SB just goes fast and easy.

Know of horror stories of items purchased without testing so maybe try to use a friends paddle or politely try to ask to demo paddles from a sup racing group you might join.  Most people love to share the sup stoke so you should have no problems testing a bunch of paddles.

Oh - paid $100 for the Riviera with a split blade - which was fixed with a bit of epoxy - and $200 for the demo SB.  Love um both - great paddles.

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PonoBill

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2014, 07:16:00 PM »
Probably, I haven't paid attention to prices recently. I wouldn't recommend the Ergo handle given your likely size, I'd go with the ergo-t. I saw a new Ke Nalu handle that someone had recently that looked really slick. Ah, I remember, it was Capobeachboy. It was a new extended handle.

Hmm, I just looked at the site and the prices for some of the paddles have been cut substantially. I don't know what that's about. Winter maybe? Haven't heard from lane for a while.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2014, 07:33:42 PM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

55NSup

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2014, 04:47:03 AM »
Lots of people on this forum  will tell you about KeNalu,  but I read on Sup racer that most top paddlers are using quick blade.

spookini

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2014, 05:15:35 AM »
Most top paddlers prob aren't paying for their gear.  For the avg schmuck like myself, I think the ability to swap parts in-and-out is a pretty unbeatable feature!
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lucabrasi

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2014, 05:53:50 AM »
Oval shaft? Check out Kialoa.
Bang for your buck? Check these out.
http://kenalu.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=4

PonoBill

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #10 on: October 25, 2014, 08:34:21 AM »
Lots of people on this forum  will tell you about KeNalu,  but I read on Sup racer that most top paddlers are using quick blade.
It's a great paddle, but the reason most top racers use them is because Jim is very aggressive and successful at promoting through sponsorship. It's a fine marketing approach.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

zirkel

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2014, 09:01:25 AM »
PonoBill:  Why would you not recommend the ergo grip?  In my limited experience, I like the feel of both Werner and QB's ergo-style grips.  My ideal would be a Werner grip offered with an Eva-texture.  But then that might be my inexperience talking.  The few times I've use a basic T-grip on a friends carbon Kialoa I've found it somewhat awkward and not as comfortable in comparison to the others.

2nd question:  I'm currently paddling a 79" length (Correction from above.  Measured 10" above head height).  As I progress in the sport and start to race, how will my paddle length change?  In other words, if I'm investing in a paddle upgrade should I consider going with a longer length?

Lucabrasi:  This is a really good tip!  I will contact KeNalu on Monday to get info about factory seconds.  Thanks!
« Last Edit: October 25, 2014, 09:03:13 AM by zirkel »

PonoBill

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2014, 09:51:14 AM »
I suspect the Ergo actually too big for your hands, and as you progress as a paddler you'll want more precision about blade angle control than a more rounded handle provides. I also don't recommend EVA covered handles as they encourage a tight grip. Your upper hand should be loose on the handle. If you hold an EVA grip loosely the high friction will raise blisters. In other words, it's comfortable because you're doing it wrong. A tight grip tires your tiny finger muscles quickly, makes your fingers numb, and gives you hand cramps. Lastly a more rounded handle is more difficult to catch on the change. If/when you want to speed up your change you'll want more of a T so your thumb can catch it as you slide you hand up the shaft. Fast changes happen when your thumb catching the T triggers muscle memory to curl your fingers over the handle.

The Kialoa T grip is a classic canoe paddler grip, very refined. The result of fifty years of evolution by the best paddlers of Oceania. It may surprise people that T-grips are a relatively new thing in Hawaiian paddling. A hundred years ago canoes were paddled with straight shafts. gripped near the top with Connor's "choke stroke".

Length is highly personal and is affected by your board thickness, board characteristics, and the stroke you adopt. If you hinge more you'll want a shorter paddle. If you stack your shoulders and reach with abdominal rotation you'll want longer. Get the Extended Ergo T handle and you can set the length wherever you want it with just a few minutes with a hairdryer. You can also get the adjustable part, it's certainly cheap and effective, but I prefer just hot glue. Totally your preference.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2014, 09:56:36 AM by PonoBill »
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

55NSup

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2014, 01:38:19 PM »
BTW.  I bought a KeNalu wiki and xtufs shaft w extended handle.  really like it, works good for me as occasional paddler, compared to most here. Solved my shoulder irritations.
Seems like pros would use any paddle that was good if free. You think qb is paying big bucks to get them to use it?  Doesnt seem economical. 

Zooport

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Re: First carbon paddle recommendation?
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2014, 03:15:12 PM »
I recently bought a Kialoa Insanity paddle for about $260 from a local shop and absolutely love the paddle.  Low price, light as a feather, tough and the blade seems nearly indestructible.  Feels good to me in the water, seems to stroke cleanly.  I know JimK can get them for you. 

« Last Edit: October 26, 2014, 03:20:09 PM by Zooport »
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