Author Topic: Race paddle recomendations  (Read 4936 times)

ColoSup

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Race paddle recomendations
« on: September 22, 2014, 09:07:49 PM »
All,   Im in fairly uncharted waters.   Im doing a 31 mile race which is outside of the typical short courses (11-15)  I have done.  As such I am looking for a new paddle.  For short courses I like many prefer a high tempo blade but in my training and at my current level of fitness tempo is not the factor at this distance.  My question then is what paddle would you choose.

A large surface area paddle seems best but I have very little personal knowledge of these.  Any constructive advise would be appreciated.

juandoe

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2014, 04:59:42 AM »
Go small and keep up your cadence.  Like Lance Armstrong spinning up the Alps.  For such a long race, a light paddle makes a big difference.  I like the KeNalu Konihi.

ColoSup

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2014, 09:53:18 AM »
If only I had the endurance and the pharmacy Lance had.   

Thanks......I agree totally with light, I may sacrifice some weight for a oversized blade.

PonoBill

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2014, 10:37:09 AM »
I'd recommend a Konihi as well. It's an odd paddle, and you need to get the length just right, so get the extended handle and buy a cheap heat gun. You need to get the blade about two inches under the water when you hit the catch. If you get it just right it feels like you aren't making 100 percent effort--someplace about 80 percent, but you'll be faster than with a standard blade. Quite a bit faster in fact, to the point that I've stopped giving numbers because they are not credible--not even to me.

If you go a little too long the effort climbs quickly and you don't go any faster. Go too short and it sounds like a toilet flushing.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Luc Benac

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #4 on: September 23, 2014, 11:54:23 AM »
You need to get the blade about two inches under the water when you hit the catch. If you get it just right it feels like you aren't making 100 percent effort--someplace about 80 percent, but you'll be faster than with a standard blade. If you go a little too long the effort climbs quickly and you don't go any faster. Go too short and it sounds like a toilet flushing.

Bill, I have used as a reference the joint between the blade and the staff. I have covered the glue there with red electrical tape. I found that if the red tape is too much above the water then the paddle is noisy, if the tape is too deep in the water then I waste my energy.
Does it tallies with your findings?

Cheers,

Luc
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stoneaxe

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2014, 01:53:56 PM »
Good idea on the tape for easy to see reference.
Bob

8-4 Vec, 9-0 SouthCounty, 9-8 Starboard, 10-4 Foote Triton, 10-6 C4, 12-6 Starboard, 14-0 Vec (babysitting the 18-0 Speedboard) Ke Nalu Molokai, Ke Nalu Maliko, Ke Nalu Wiki Ke Nalu Konihi

ColoSup

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2014, 07:41:21 PM »
This particular brand is the most recommended on this site.  Is there a bias of some sort or have you guys found a great product.  It sure sounds interesting.  Thanks for the solid advise.

SUP407

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2014, 07:46:08 PM »
It's a great paddle.

PonoBill

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2014, 09:09:52 PM »
I'm biased.

I started the company but sold it to my partner, so I have no remaining financial interest, I just like the product. The Konihi paddle has nothing to do with me, it was developed after I sold. I find it to be a unique paddle with some very unusual characteristics. One of them is that it seems to take less effort to go fast with it. I think it's because when it's at just the right depth it develops little to no vortex behind the blade. I think it's simply that the energy normally wasted in creating a vortex is not used. I have no proof that is what is actually going on, it's just a guess, supported by some dramatic improvement in speed over a measured course over standard Ke Nalu paddles.

The standard paddles Ke Nalu paddles are considered to be equivalent in performance to other premium paddles

Ibenac, I'm doing the same thing with white tape. It helps a lot. I aim to keep the tape under water from the catch to recovery. Whenever the paddle makes noise I focus on getting the tape under. Whack fricken' paddle. If it wasn't working so well for me it wouldn't be worth all the fuss.
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

Luc Benac

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2014, 09:55:28 PM »
I aim to keep the tape under water from the catch to recovery.

Great that confirms it, then.
I started with keeping the tape under water right from the very start of the catch and then it got deeper as it comes closer to my feet. This was with the paddle at what you would consider Race length (top of fingers on the handle).
I then shortened the paddle to touring/cruising length (handle in hand) and this resulted with the tape be at water or even a little bit out of the water at the very start of the catch and then going under water as the paddle got a little bit more vertical and a little bit before it reaches my feet (or rather as my feet reach the paddle).
I am now considering going back to Race length to check with gps but it means putting back the extended ergo T.
In the meantime, I have ordered a Ho'oloha 84 blade that I am going to try for a while to work on my stroke form and on my cadence before coming back to the Kohini 95 with longer length.
Of course it will be winter by then....
Sunova Allwater 14'x25.5" 303L Viento 520
Sunova Torpedo 14'x27" 286L Salish 500
Naish Nalu 11'4" x 30" 180L Andaman 520
Sunova Steeze 10' x 31" 150L
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PonoBill

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2014, 11:09:34 PM »
You might be better off with the cruising length and bending a little to get the blade under at the catch. that sounds long. With my very thick Bullet 17 I'm using paddle length that comes to my wrist. I get the highest speed with that length, bending a bit to get the blade well under at the catch. When I went to "racing length" the blade felt stiff in the water
Foote 10'4X34", SIC 17.5 V1 hollow and an EPS one in Hood River. Foote 9'0" x 31", L41 8'8", 18' Speedboard, etc. etc.

yugi

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2014, 02:55:00 AM »
^^ how much overhead is that?

yugi

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2014, 03:51:39 AM »
Which begs another question. Well, two. I mean... three.

Paddle length:
Common practice is to speak of paddle lengths from handle to tip of blade. As evidenced by the above conversation we should adjust length to just get the blade fully submerged. Since blades vary in length the key length to speak of is from handle to neck of the blade. Right?

For downwind:
As everything is moving it would be inherently trickier to set a blade at a perfect depth. Does that mean the Konihi is not ideal for downwind use or can one compensate by adding a bit of length to make sure the blade is fully under?

Race length:
Am I understanding from the conversation that Race length is longer than touring/cruising length? I'm looking at the racers and seeing they are using really short (again) these days. So my current touring/cruising/downwinding length seems to be longer than a "Race length". Confused. I have some questions on length recommendations but I'll open anther thread for that.
   http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,25207.0.html
« Last Edit: September 24, 2014, 04:20:20 AM by yugi »

stoneaxe

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #13 on: September 24, 2014, 09:02:40 AM »
I'm biased too...Bill's my bro and I used to be the Ke Nalu rep in New England. I stopped doing that though for the same reason I stopped being a Starboard "ambassador" years ago. I don't want anything influencing my comments/recommendations when I share my love for the sport or commercial interests getting in the way of my passion for the CCBC. It's cost me considerable $ to drop both associations. I still like Starboards and still tell anyone that wants to listen that Ke Nalus are the best paddles on the planet but I have no $ at stake or other motive in doing so.

I prefer paddles with a dihedral....I think the Ke Nalus are the current state of the art when it comes to performance. They are for me anyway....we all have to remember that it's very personal.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2014, 09:06:13 AM by stoneaxe »
Bob

8-4 Vec, 9-0 SouthCounty, 9-8 Starboard, 10-4 Foote Triton, 10-6 C4, 12-6 Starboard, 14-0 Vec (babysitting the 18-0 Speedboard) Ke Nalu Molokai, Ke Nalu Maliko, Ke Nalu Wiki Ke Nalu Konihi

Area 10

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Re: Race paddle recomendations
« Reply #14 on: September 24, 2014, 09:21:14 AM »
Race length shorter than cruising length.

Downwind length slightly shorter than flat water race length (if you downwind in bumps bigger than 1ft, and depending on what board you ride).

Surf length shortest of all.

Small blade size for long distances.

Longer shaft lengths for long distance races.

Softer shafts for long distances.

If you can afford it, and are suspicious that every paddle thread on the 'zone ends up recommending a Ke Nalu, then try a Quickblade v-drive with a tapered shaft.

 


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