Author Topic: Designing a custom - tech question  (Read 5526 times)

supthecreek

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Designing a custom - tech question
« on: April 23, 2014, 04:05:48 PM »
Never paid much attention to evolving tech specifics in custom board making.... so my question may be lame.

Do most shapers have access to 3D scanners to copy a board into a CAD program? or is that limited to a few big manufacturers?

I was thinking about taking a board I like, copying it with a scanner, make some CAD adjustments and have it cut on a CNC machine.
The purpose is to improve the performance of a good board, with minor tweaks, but mostly to shed 11 or 12 lbs by using a different glassing method.

ahhh.... yeah.... straight up theft of intellectual property.  :-[
I imagine 3D scanners make that a daily reality.


Tom

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2014, 04:19:18 PM »
I think most shapers, at least here in Southern California, have access to one if they don't own their own. I know there are several in San Diego that contract out to various shapers. You should call around. 

spookini

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2014, 04:49:21 PM »
C'mon creek, there's no such thing as a lame question...

Just lame people who ask questions??  ??? ;)
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supthecreek

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2014, 09:44:54 PM »
I resemble that remark

Bean

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 10:24:03 AM »
Just had one of my molars laser scanned and replicated yesterday.  My dentist only needed to spend about 2.5 minutes fine tuning it.  What a great fit; the technology is unbelievable, my mouth is totally bamboozled into thinking its the same old tooth.  But it's lighter and stronger (presumably).

Here are my thoughts, for what its worth.  If the board is scanned, it would naturally include not only the skin (which is variable thickness throughout) but also the pad.  Would the process of reducing the dimensions by these two components result in a more accurate replica than a hand shaped board using the old board as a guide?

I'd like to get perspective from DW on this one...



kayadogg

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2014, 10:38:03 AM »
I smell a custom light yet durable CreekMana.

supLaz

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2014, 03:11:20 PM »
"Just had one of my molars laser scanned and replicated yesterday.  My dentist only needed to spend about 2.5 minutes fine tuning it.  What a great fit; the technology is unbelievable,"

Mr.Bean,

the 3D laser scanner of your dentist is a nice toy compared with a “real one” .
Not in terms of accuracy, but in  size of the objects.
Laser scans for the category SUP requires really heavy machinery like hardware and software,
the scans produce a gigantic huge amount of data.
Of course a board is symmetrical (should be) so you can scan only one half and mirrored later in the CAD software.

Reverse engineering like this sounds complicated and expensive... belief me ...it is.

I am pretty sure, all of the SUP board companies have a huge scan database for  there own and all competitor products.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2014, 03:16:16 PM by supLaz »
Laz

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2014, 04:54:10 PM »
I don't know anything about the technology but I did have the fun opportunity to see one of my raceboards get scanned and used for cnc production.  The board was hand shaped by my friend and I used it during 2012 and loved it.  It was scanned and later manipulated from a pintail into a squaretail.  It was a pretty cool process to see. It did create a little more volume on the blank because the scanning was done from a completed board that was sand down and given a mini fill coat application.  So the resulting blank would produce a higher volume board if not hand tuned back in the shaping bay.
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Bean

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2014, 06:30:44 PM »
"Just had one of my molars laser scanned and replicated yesterday.  My dentist only needed to spend about 2.5 minutes fine tuning it.  What a great fit; the technology is unbelievable,"

Mr.Bean,

the 3D laser scanner of your dentist is a nice toy compared with a “real one” .
Not in terms of accuracy, but in  size of the objects.
Laser scans for the category SUP requires really heavy machinery like hardware and software,
the scans produce a gigantic huge amount of data.
Of course a board is symmetrical (should be) so you can scan only one half and mirrored later in the CAD software.

Reverse engineering like this sounds complicated and expensive... belief me ...it is.

I am pretty sure, all of the SUP board companies have a huge scan database for  there own and all competitor products.

It is a toy in the sense that its compact.   It costs a bit more than an AKU shaper but from a net earnings perspective, it will out perform the AKU.  That's the kind of toy I want! 

supthecreek

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2014, 06:43:32 PM »
lots of cool info coming in....

XLR8 - love the scanning picture... although I have to admit that I had assumed that scanners could "scan" items without all those target points. I just figured something similar to a CT Scanner would just pass around the object and voila... 3D model in CAD. :-[
My experience with shaping tells me that if you tried to shave of a 1/4 inch back in the shaping bay, by hand and eye.... you would just screw it up.... lots of area to shave minutia off, changes would happen.

Thanks Laz...I had a feeling it sounded rather complex and expensive, most of my ideas are.  So... ok, that's out... but fun to discuss ;D
Heck... even Beans molars are beyond my reach.

Mr Bean... I naively figured that once in the CAD program, it would be a simple equation that skimmed an 1/8 (+-) of an inch off the  skin, to achieve a finished blank (with pad removed before scanning).... and NO... I don't believe that a shaper could reproduce any board with accuracy to match a CAD programed CNC cut blank.

If I keep making outrageously incorrect comments, will you folks keep the info coming? This is interesting stuff ;D

supthecreek

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2014, 07:22:06 PM »

Bean

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2014, 09:48:20 PM »
20 feet! You could shape conjoined 10' Mana's...just sayin.

supdiscobay

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2014, 10:09:35 PM »
8'5" Starboard Pocket Rocket, 8'0" Kazuma Fugu custom,  8'10" Kings Sidewinder, 10' Starboard Noserider, 14' BARK Carbon Dominator, SIC F16 V3, KeNalu and Quickblade paddles, 19' Eaton Prone, 67" Goode 9700

TallDude

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2014, 10:33:17 PM »
I use the old school method of scanning with a new school twist. I design new custom homes and re-design homes for a living. So I draw in various CAD programs all day, everyday.........help..... Anyway, over the years I've developed a fast method to measure homes for as-built plans. I just applied a similar approach to measuring boards. I use a laser set at various datum points and write down measurement points about every 6". Sometimes closer, sometimes further. With the laser I create a virtual box just larger than the board. The result is a negative space in the shape of the board. I then input all those points into Shape3D. The Shape3D program is a basic version of Autocad at it's core, using wireframe surfaces in a Bezier mode. You open the program with a board that is already there. Then you stretch, push & pull it into the board you want. The Bezier curve maintains smooth transitions from one point to the next. It takes me a couple of hours to measure and input it into Shape3D. I have never actually outright copied a board. It goes in as the scanned board, but comes out something different. I always go into the process thinking what I did and didn't like about the board. Then I change things to get rid of the "didn't likes" and add the "this is want I want this board to do".   
It's not overhead to me!
8'8" L-41 ST and a whole pile of boards I rarely use.

supthecreek

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Re: Designing a custom - tech question
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2014, 04:32:20 AM »
TD... that's awesome... Po' Boy scanner, in negative.... very creative!

How do you hold the board? and do you rotate views or rotate the laser?

How do you "reference" the laser to achieve meaningful measurements?

Your technique needs it's own thread.... with pictures and explanations for the unwashed among us (me)

I know a lot of Zoners would be keen to see that at work!

 


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