Looking for feedback on wood paddles - Save the Children

[stoneaxe]

I've just built my 1st two paddles and I'm hooked. I know...strange fetish, but I'm stuck with it. I'm looking for info from folks with wooden paddles letting me know what they like and what they don't.

I'm planning on building another as part of a charity effort on another web forum I belong to.
http://lumberjocks.com/jocks/msojka/blog/1785
The idea is to build something and auction/raffle/sell it, with the proceeds going to Save the Children. If your interested the complete blog on the construction of the 1st two paddles is already on the site.
http://lumberjocks.com/jocks/Treefarmer/blog/series/227

How light? laminated? shaft bend? double bend? blade? flex? glassed? I've got some ideas of things I'd like to try. I'm looking for performance but I also want extraordinary beauty. I'd also like to know what would drive you to bid on such a paddle. Does it make sense to do nice inlays and/or carvings?

You have to love the soul in a wooden paddle.

[shapeshifter]

a worthy cause and a wonderful endeavor. got to hand it to you stoneaxe... you got style!

i like to think that my medium is people. like someone said a long time ago: "as you change, so does the world around you." one of my hobbies is bringing people together with their life's aspirations. it's what i like to call my heart'spath project. the goal is to create opportunities that will allow people to work in the field of their dreams. one such project is to develop programs that employs instructors to bring vocational programs into reality that pays the apprentice to learn a new skill which can lead to a more promising future. through our work with after school programs we have the great honor of sharing new experiences with the inner-city youth from all walks of life.

i will be at meetings today to formalize this fall's semester of programs. i will use the link you provided as one of the ways our programs could work toward social change. for now our apprentices will build skateboards but in near the future i would like to develop a class with paddles for the project. i would hope to find assistance from you and any one else here towards this goal.

[Rand]

Hi Axe,

First off, your paddles look bee you tee full, and I would imagine bids will be zero problem.

I have a couple of thoughts (they come harder these days). 

The first is the big one, test, test, test (and get other paddlers to test too).  I had originally written off wooden paddles, because the first two I had tried shimmied so badly under a strong stoke that they were all but unusable.  I know nothing about blade dynamics, so I cannot offer any suggestions on how to achieve a fluid feel, although others have mentioned that the dyhedral used in many paddles helps.

The one paddle that you designed has a nice smooth transition to the shaft, while the other has some hard angles there.  That is probably a good spot to avoid hard angles, as your blade is often pulled back up from under the board, which can cause board damage, even without hard angles.  Also, for surf, no sharp corners to meet your flesh is a nicety.

My favorite paddle yet has had a little kick at the end of the blade (would be concavity except it is localized to the last inch or 2).  That's personal, and I am sure some will disagree, but this really added a power feel.

I have liked your posts and your attitude on your work; made two-what's next?

Keep up the great work!

Randy

[stoneaxe]

Kind words, Thank you both.

Shape - It's sounds like we have a lot in common. http://lumberjocks.com/topics/677#reply-7479 Strangely similar. SUP syncronicity? LOL...and maybe even more strange. http://lumberjocks.com/jocks/MsDebbieP/blog/1793

It sounds like a wonderful thing you've are doing. I'd be happy to help where I could. I've been on the technical advisory committee at a local voc high school (I taught a friend Autocad years ago and he now teaches it at the school). He suffers the downsides of teaching just for those chances to make a difference in the occasional kids life.

You should point your woodworking students (you too) in the direction of http://lumberjocks.com/ . It's a great community, very positive, lots of great talent sharing skills with blogs and video podcasts.

Randy - I have already been thinking about the testing. Not sure I'll have the time to test any before I build this one but i certainly plan to try in the future. I'm thinking that I may give a couple that I like to folks that really know their stuff to try out.

The 1st one I built (the one with the edges) is a war club, heavy, clunky, the blades too big, and I don't like the edges either. The only reason I haven't reshaped it is that its the 1st I built. I'm sure my brother will choose the 2nd one. The 2nd actually feels really good, light, well balanced. The blade looks like it will perform well. I also gave it a stress test. I think I put a lot more load on it than it is likely to see in the water and it came though fine. The true test will be in the water this Sunday though.

I like the idea of the slight kick. You can't see it very well in the pictures but the blade of the second has a slight scoop to it. This blade should be pretty easy on the rails too. The edges are rolled smooth, thought it would help reduce blade turbulence too.

Thanks again for the kind words.

[surfpainter]

Stoneaxeman.....Iv'e been collecting wood paddles, oars and anything resembling them. I also have painted scenes on the blades of old oars and I sell them as fast as I paint them. For stand-up, my lightweight carbon "Quickblade" is far and away, the only paddle I'll ever use in this sport. That way I can keep all my cool wood paddles for my showroom. If you would like me to paint a simple scene on one of your paddles for charity, let me know...happy to help.....Rick

[Rand]

I like the idea of the slight kick. You can't see it very well in the pictures but the blade of the second has a slight scoop to it. This blade should be pretty easy on the rails too. The edges are rolled smooth, thought it would help reduce blade turbulence too.

It is amazing the progression from #1 to #2.  I would hesitate to even use #1, just to have it in pristine condition to commemorate your first paddle.  It is obvious that you have that "that's great...but now what if I ..." mentality that seperates the creative producer from the rest of us mopes.

[stoneaxe]

Wow Rick....thanks for the offer. Not sure what my plan is going to be yet. I may try for performance or an art paddle with inlays and carvings or both performance and art. If I go pure art that would be a great addition. We'd have to figure out the logistics but it sounds very interesting.

Randy - I think #1 will be going straight to the wall for that very reason. I think I'll give Bill both paddles and tell him to hang #1 in the Pono house. Just so long as I maintain visitation rights....
Thanks for the kind words....I've been called many things....most not repeatable...but "Creative Producer" is a new one.

[shapeshifter]

just got word from toronto, stoneaxe... it would seem that someone named debbie from that forum is going to be at the new teaching facility to tour the latest developments there. thank you for sharing the lumberjocks forum with us. i will have to see what all the commotion is all about.

regarding paddle design, i have been studying some modern day applications of what has been practiced in paddle making since ancient times. the curved shape of the blade of a paddle called the dihedral is worthy of investigation.


dihedral angle

paraphrased quote: "the dihedral illustration shows the flow of water off the dihedral of  blade designs. notice how the powerface is angled from the center of the blade. this angle is called a dihedral. the dihedral angle concept comes from the discovery that a curved plane gives direction to the flow of water off the blade. during a forward stroke water builds up on the powerface of a non-dihedral blade. to expel this build up, a non-dihedral blade will flutter back and forth. therefore, by adding a dihedral angle to a blade design, water is given direction to flow easily off the blade, minimizing flutter and the gripping effort needed to overcome the flutter."

hope this helps...

[stoneaxe]

Hi Shape,

Deb's a great lady. She is the defacto spokesperson/motherhen/soul of the site. I'm glad to see you on LJ, a great place for folks that love working with wood.

Interesting info on the dihedral shape. I'll be experimenting with it and other shapes as I progress on performance blades. I think I've decided to focus this paddle on the artistic side. It will still be functional but I don't think anyone is going to want to put this one in the water. I'm purchasing a scroll saw as part of my winnings in the LJ summer challenge and I'm thinking about some complex inlays with a mix of woods.

LOL...I have to laugh, it's either that or cry. My complete newb status in SUP has been painfully exposed. Upon examination of the paddle my brother said " I hate to tell you this but it's backwards". DOH! What and idiot! I had thought the angle of the blade was toward you instead of away. As it turned out it the paddle performed well despite being backward. I actually preferred it to his (name brand deleted because what the hell do I know) carbon paddle. The added weight seemed to help my balance (important for me). Mostly I think it was because mine was longer though.

I learned 2 things on last Sunday's test.

1. Don't make them backwards.

2. I can still cut out a lot of weight. The shaft and blade are still much more beefy than is necessary.

I'm looking forward to this paddle for the fund raiser but I'm really interested in what I can produce for the next performance paddle. My first focus is blade configuration then I may try to push the envelope on weight and see if it can still take the stress.

[shapeshifter]

interestingly enough, i've just recently reconnected with a source that can provide me with reasonable quantities of recovered sunken lumber such as five-hundred-year-old premium hardwood including oak, maple, bird's eye maple, beech and birch as well as premium softwood including red pine, hemlock and white pine... the recovery process is ecologically driven for minimal impact to the environment.


click on the links for a choice of either windows media or quicktime links to a video of the recovery process.

what they have to offer is old growth lumber which has been cured in an oxygen free environment for over a century. the predominant qualities are that the colors are brilliant and the woods are quite a bit more rigid than the norm. déjà vu?

[stoneaxe]

Hehe...deja vu all over again.... I posted a response to you on LJ already but forgot to ask what they asking per board foot for this. Sounds expensive. I wouldn't mind using some for this paddle though. Adds to the story of the piece.

[shapeshifter]

man you're up late! hope you reserved some energy for the paddle today...

i'm hoping that they'll give me special consideration as they are aware of the high school classes i've been developing, not to mention another program i was a guest instructor at which actually used their products for a green lumber build. been considering approaching them with the possibility of being a distributor of their beautiful veneer to specialty builders such as ourselves. since they're primarily targeted at the mahogany row types with the laminated modular office systems which they manufacture, exploring this small niche doesn't seem to pique their interest at the moment. was going to try to make it out there next week so that i can pick up a small batch. depending on their generosity... you may just end up with some material too. i'll let you know how all this pans out.

[Chan]

what they have to offer is old growth lumber which has been cured in an oxygen free environment for over a century. the predominant qualities are that the colors are brilliant and the woods are quite a bit more rigid than the norm. déjà vu?

Hi Shapey,
I am interested to hear (and see) how this turns out.  I am in the market for a new paddle, and am open to suggestions.  Having tried a variety of carbon fiber shapes, I still feel that I have not found the one.  Could be that I need a recovered 19th century mahogony, with an ottertail blade . 

[Rand]

the predominant qualities are that the colors are brilliant and the woods are quite a bit more rigid than the norm

I had seen a documenatry on these guys a while back.  VERY cool.  How was the wood to work with?  Did it feel brittle?

[stoneaxe]

I was up late...partly because I was so stoked to go out today! What a great time...and most exciting...the boss I now hooked too. She was always amazing on the water when we were kids, great water skier and sailor. We went to Plymouth Beach...very flat, light wind, perfect practice for us newbs. She completely showed me up. I was very happy with my progress but she was amazing....of course the Starboard is pretty stable and she is petite but I was still surprised.

The water temperature is fairly chilly. She wasn't interested in getting wet. Walked out calf deep stepped onto the board and never once fell. She was spinning it around, stepping back, went downwind aways and came back....even caught a tiny boat wake wave on the way in and rode it right up to me standing in the shallows....showoff! We kept taking turns all day. I'm sore from my shoulders to the bottom of my feet....can't wait to get out again tomorrow morning.... I still can't believe that she never even got wet today. I was tempted to throw her in. We're heading for the south side of the cape tomorrow...much warmer water and maybe some knee highs.

All we talked about on the way home was about getting her a board and a couple of sails.