A few Questions about Technique from an outrigger paddler new to SUP

[Shawn Michael]

In outrigger there is a lot of talk and focus on technique, seminars etc.  It seems like here there is not as much detail about the stroke.  In outrigger there are some major points but just to put it in a nutshell the stoke starts at the set up and you 1) Open your body and rotate your torso while rolling your weight onto the foot of the side your are paddling on.  2)  Bury your blade with a forward angle on the catch like a "pole vaulter"  3) starting with leg drive unwind you torso and "pull the canoe to the planted blade" 4) Clean exit at the hip    There is a Hawaiian style stoke which is longer and slow (feels really good, builds muscles IMO) and a Tahitian style that is shorter and higher cadence.  Both styles win. 

What about SUP?  It there any point that is not obvious or do you just put in the miles?  I feel great but I wonder if there is some technique with the lowerbody to push your board with the legs or push off a certain foot or emphasize one leg.  I get the upper body part and feel that have a great stroke but wonder if any pointers for the legs. 

I use the outrigger technique above and go for a long stroke and pull the shaft of the blade right next to the rail of the board at the end of the stroke I dip my knees and crunch the torso down a bit, feels great.

Thanks for any feedback.  I trust that my body will find the best way to move the board but if I am missing anything I appreciate the advice!

[DavidJohn]

I think you just have to put in the miles.. 

I use the outrigger technique above and go for a long stroke and pull the shaft of the blade right next to the rail of the board at the end of the stroke I dip my knees and crunch the torso down a bit, feels great.

If it feels good..Do it..  ..btw..I think I do the same.

DJ

[PonoBill]

I suspect that as the sport progresses we'll start to get smarter about stroke. I think it will be different from the outrigger stroke just because of position, but most of the fastest people in the downwinder/distance paddling side of SUP all come from OC-1. When I first started doing upwind/downwind runs from Kanaha a few years ago the guy I'd run into the most often was Dave Kalama--always in his OC-1.

I've started paying attention to my legs on the stroke. I can get my highest speed when I give a thrust with my legs at the end of the stroke. It feels clumsy right now, but I think it will become just part of the stroke. I wish there was someone doing coaching. I've asked a few of the guys that I suspect know what they are doing, but they can't tell me much in an email. I'm going to try to hook up with Ernie Johnson when I'm down in SoCal, I bet he knows how to swing a stick.

[Garrett]

i come from an OC background also and ive found that if you dont keep your feet next to eachother and instead offset them (for me the offset is about heel to toe) and keep the forward foot on the side that you are paddling on it helps to drive your legs like in OC.  changing over your feet each time you switch sides takes some getting used to but its helped me alot

[noa]

Shawn and Garrett, thanks for your insight. although it's true that standing upright and sitting down make technique slightly differ, i feel we have much to learn from the OC guys. they have spent a lot of time refining their styles and efficiency. some pictures, or even better a video, to illustrate your techniques would be great.

[Shawn Michael]

Hey Garret that is very interesting and what I was thinking too.  When you go to an OC seminar with Danny Ching that is a drill he teaches put the foot on the side your are paddling on a bit forward and drive off it.

I am going to see if Jim Terrell will sell me an hour of coaching and I think with him I will be going straight to the top in terms of technique with his great attention do detail and his olympic background.

The to Joe Bark for a custom board...maybe

[PonoBill]

I'm experimenting both with foot swtiching and with driving from the foot on the paddle side even when my feet are parallel. It's a little easier for me to gain benefit when my right foot is forward and I'm paddling on the right side. When I switch foot at the same time as switching paddle I don't get much from the left leg. It seems I get more thrust on the left side with my feet parallel. But that's one more example of needing a coach. I'm sure if I had someone telling me what was best I could be practicing proper moves instead of reinforcing bad habits or body tendencies.

[Shawn Michael]

It is interesting that it is still sort of evolving.  I am one of these people who wants to gather info. I dont want to re invent the wheel unless it is necessary, just train really hard.  I do draw the like with the short rapid stroke...the long digger is what really feels great, builds the body and gives me that farfegnugen.  If all I cared about was going fast, I would be in a surfski.

[Garrett]

in OC what really made the stroke make ALOT of sense was when i was explained that when the blade is in the water you are not pulling the water back rather that you are pulling the boat and your body to the blade. so when the term plant your blade is used it litterally means your blade stays in that spot. ive found this same philosophy works for SUP.

[Candice]

There are some key elements to the "stand up" stroke that I tell people when teaching....In my own words...With the upper body, its a simultaneous push down/pull back motion. You are pushing down with you top hand and pulling back with the bottom. However, you should be using more effort(strength) when pushing down rather than pulling back. Don't get me wrong, you are still using effort in pulling back, but the bottom arm is essentially guiding your paddle back, while your top are is the "strong arm". To get the most out of your stroke, it is important to use your whole body, just like in paddling canoe when you use your legs and pull your whole bottom half forward. The difference with stand up is obvious...your standing up. With that said, as you take your stroke you should have your knees slightly bent and as your paddle is passing your body, push off you legs while bringing you whole core and pelvic areas forward. This motion uses your whole body.....One last thing, sometimes the long deep stroke might not be the most effective. Try using a short fast stroke and don't dig the blade extirely in the water. I find that this stroke gets the board going faster in quick situations like catching waves, as it kind of lifts the board out of the water and helps you quickly glad across the waters surface.....I hope this information is useful to you. I know there are many ways in which to paddle and we're all learning. This is just what has been working for me.

[Shawn Michael]

Thank you for your post.  Good stuff.  This is the part that interests me.

"With that said, as you take your stroke you should have your knees slightly bent and as your paddle is passing your body, push off you legs while bringing you whole core and pelvic areas forward."

Is that kind of like "inchworming" the board forward? 

It would seem all the other OC type paddle mechanics would stand.  The thing about the stroke length is interesting.  It is a big deal in OC to get the longest front half of the stroke you can.  If you can pull two more inches through hundreds of strokes that adds up.  If you pull longer you will glide longer, if you pull shorter through a higher cadence your glide will die sooner but you put the paddle back in the water more quickly to compensate.  The shorter stroke require less strength but a ton of cardio and conditioning to keep the rate up so persons with different strengths will end up with a slightly different ideal stroke.

Personally I see it like this...I am the engine and I have to love what I am doing.  The high rate double blade did not feel that satisfying to me but the OC feels like you can really put your body into it, even more so in SUP so I really like it.

This is good to study.  Look how far they pull back, reach, etc.  The teams with the most exaggerated styles seem to do well.  Enjoy.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/video/player.html?assetid=0821_sd_cfb_hl_l1096

[Shawn Michael]

Sorry this link is not right but click on the C-2, interesting.