Conflict resolution...

[skideeppow]

So, I was SUPing Shashone River on Sat, three sups and two kayaks.  This is class 3 water and is the only river in all of Colorado running right now. Needless to say very busy with downriver activity.  We finished up the rapids and were going towards the takeout and were surfing on some tiny waves.  We were river center, maybe a little to the right.

I hear some people yelling at us, and I look back and there are these two kids and one parent fishing on the right hand side of the river.  They are screaming at us, go f(&Y yourselfs, you f*&^ing assholes etc.   Most of this was directed at the 100lb girl we were with us, calling her the c word.    It was truly unreal.  They then started throwing rocks at her.

We got to the take out and we told the ranger.
About 5 minutes later here came the fisherman.  They claim that we were disturing their fishing.  That we had scared the fish away.  We were no where near them.
The ranger asked them for ID, made sure they had fishing licenses etc.  He told them downriver users always have the right away and that by tossing rocks as us they could be charged with assault.  He also explained to them that this is the busiest stretch of river in the state right now.
There were numerous things I could not comprehend.
1.  This is how the father teaches the kids to react, to curse scream and accost people?
2.  Even if we were acting malicously (which we clearly were not), we were a group of five, two of us were pretty large.  Use some commen sense here, what would keep us from pulling over and beating the shit our these kids.
3.  They are on the busiest river in the state right now.  10 miles away is the roaring fork with some of the best fishing in the state, why not go there.

Anyway, the ranger let them go, we almost called the police but decided against it.

There are assholes everywhere.

[SlatchJim]

I'm thinking you missed a great teaching opportunity.  When some 14 year old punk chucked an ice ball at my car with my family in it while driving in the mountains,  I stopped, ran up the hill and linebacker tackled him into the snow since I easily outweighed him by 120 lbs.  As I had him pinned in the snow, ready to cave in his bracers, I calmly instructed him that he was "participating in an unsafe activity" and that "he could get someone hurt."  The implied message was that If he did that again I would throw him off a cliff.  That was a very safe stretch of road from then on.  I'm sure it's a lesson he remembers.

[PonoBill]

There are assholes everywhere.

Yup, the one thing that never seems to be in short supply. With a healthy lifestyle though, you can plan on outliving the ones you know.

[skideeppow]

I'm thinking you missed a great teaching opportunity.  When some 14 year old punk chucked an ice ball at my car with my family in it while driving in the mountains,  I stopped, ran up the hill and linebacker tackled him into the snow since I easily outweighed him by 120 lbs.  As I had him pinned in the snow, ready to cave in his bracers, I calmly instructed him that he was "participating in an unsafe activity" and that "he could get someone hurt."  The implied message was that If he did that again I would throw him off a cliff.  That was a very safe stretch of road from then on.  I'm sure it's a lesson he remembers.

10 years I would have done this.  I am 210, pretty thick and hit x fit 4-5 days a week.  I am not small. 
I try and avoid conflict because the last thing I want to do is get sued etc.  But this was totally out of control, I got in their faces.  I was ready to through down, but it is never worth it.
We should have called the police but did not want to spend my Sat filing reports etc.

[supchino]

I went out in Hawaii Kai today and there were some locals fishing around. I respected their space and nodded to me their approval.. Love the aloha

[Wavecloud]

I once saw a group of fishermen cast lead weights at a chap on a surf ski at Bournemouth on the UK's south coast.

The bloke caught the next wave in, walked up onto the pier and smashed the fisherman over the head with his paddle. The fisherman had blood streaming down his face!!

I do not  agree with that level of violence, but I bet, said fisherman never did it again!

[SlatchJim]

Captions include:
Chum lands a fighter without a hook.
Spare the paddle, spoil the chided.
...Oar Cut Baiter

[stoneaxe]

I always try to give fisherman a wide area. I was embarrassed to snag a line at Kihei Wharf when we were doing the downwind showcase a couple years ago. Paddled in walked over and apologized. I'm in someone else's backyard and try to respect the space they need to catch dinner.

On the other hand...my wife and I were paddling Plymouth Beach...my local....and had swung wide to give a couple fisherman room. Wasn't enough for one of the assholes. He pulled back deep and let a real long cast go..landed 6 feet from my wife. I again paddled in called them a few choice words and told them if they did it again it wouldn't stop at words. They were lucky I didn't just kick their asses. SUP (and age I guess) has mellowed me. Not long ago I would have smashed their gear and left them bloody.

[Celeste]

I always try to give fisherman a wide area. I was embarrassed to snag a line at Kihei Wharf when we were doing the downwind showcase a couple years ago. Paddled in walked over and apologized. I'm in someone else's backyard and try to respect the space they need to catch dinner.

On the other hand...my wife and I were paddling Plymouth Beach...my local....and had swung wide to give a couple fisherman room. Wasn't enough for one of the assholes. He pulled back deep and let a real long cast go..landed 6 feet from my wife. I again paddled in called them a few choice words and told them if they did it again it wouldn't stop at words. They were lucky I didn't just kick their asses. SUP (and age I guess) has mellowed me. Not long ago I would have smashed their gear and left them bloody.

Assuming they did not do it to you first.  There is always someone with bigger guns, faster draw, better aim or must plain luckier then you.  It is just foolish to be pugnacious without an escape route and exit strategy. Having a prepared story for when the cops show up is also a very good idea and so might be a drop gun.

[stoneaxe]

So I'm to ignore someone throwing lead weights at my wife? Where is the line drawn? Next time it could be my daughters. They paddle that same beach frequently. Ignoring idiots like that only encourages the behavior and they could injure severely or even potentially kill someone doing that. Was I supposed to paddle back and call the cops? Get them arrested for casting? I've never gone looking for fights, but I don't back down either. I know there is always someone stronger/faster/crazier...take your pick. That doesn't mean you don't stand up to it. It's hardly being pugnacious when someone threatens harm to someone you love and you are reacting to an immediate situation. I'm not thinking about exit strategies at that point.

[Celeste]

So I'm to ignore someone throwing lead weights at my wife? Where is the line drawn? Next time it could be my daughters. They paddle that same beach frequently. Ignoring idiots like that only encourages the behavior and they could injure severely or even potentially kill someone doing that. Was I supposed to paddle back and call the cops? Get them arrested for casting? I've never gone looking for fights, but I don't back down either. I know there is always someone stronger/faster/crazier...take your pick. That doesn't mean you don't stand up to it. It's hardly being pugnacious when someone threatens harm to someone you love and you are reacting to an immediate situation. I'm not thinking about exit strategies at that point.

If you look, I never suggested a course of action you SHOULD take, just a word of caution about one you said you might have taken.  If you look at your words, you might see that paddling in and beating someone to a bloody pulp, as apposed to yelling bloody hell at them is exactly pugnacious.  I have no issue with the course you choose, I think it was the best of the available choices, assault is a whole different level.

[robon]

So I'm to ignore someone throwing lead weights at my wife? Where is the line drawn? Next time it could be my daughters. They paddle that same beach frequently. Ignoring idiots like that only encourages the behavior and they could injure severely or even potentially kill someone doing that. Was I supposed to paddle back and call the cops? Get them arrested for casting? I've never gone looking for fights, but I don't back down either. I know there is always someone stronger/faster/crazier...take your pick. That doesn't mean you don't stand up to it. It's hardly being pugnacious when someone threatens harm to someone you love and you are reacting to an immediate situation. I'm not thinking about exit strategies at that point.

Yeah, you try to ignore it as much as possible. These days you can get charged for looking at someone the wrong way and just like that, you're getting hit with 10 to 40 grand in lawyer fees. Then, even if you beat the charges, you could still have an arrest record. It's not worth it. Not to mention people don't always fight fair. Something to think about when confronting someone. Losing control for a split second can cost you for the rest of your life. Once again, it's not worth it.

[PonoBill]

Only if you get a cheap lawyer. Which is a lot like cheap wine.

[starman]

Don't forget to include that "stand your ground" law in many states when making your decision.

Pretty easy for that dude who is "just fishing" to pull out a 9mm and cap you between the eyes. And you know he's got one right next to the beer he's been hitting all day. "Just minding my own business and this crazy guy with a paddle tried to attack me and steal my cooler officer".

It could work the other way. You packing your 9mm and when he does the lead toss BANG. "Just standing my water officer".

It's a slippery slope for sure these days.

[stoneaxe]

Sorry Celeste...rereading your post you're correct...I wasn't looking for it but I was ready for a fight. Not enough to throw a 1st punch but ready just the same. I wasn't thinking about it going in but it's obvious it could have gone that way. I've been accused of letting my emotions get the better of my brains before and no doubt will again. I appreciate your words of caution.

You can take the boy out of the city but not the city out of the boy. I grew up in a somewhat tough neighborhood, showing weakness was not wise. The only times the cops showed up was to pick up the pieces. Times are different now of course, arguments are more likely to get solved by gunshot or lawsuit than fists.

I still have to disagree with you Robon...that wasn't an action that could be ignored. Doing nothing makes it more likely it happens again. Imagine how you would feel if a few days later if they did it again and hurt someone bad and you had ignored it.

Since this is about conflict resolution...where do you draw the line? Wait until they hit my wife or someone I care for? Then what...call the cops and hope the right thing happens? In my experience that's a crap shoot. They either take off before the cops get there, the cops do nothing because it was "an accident", the cops do nothing because they know them or another cop, the courts do nothing because the evidence isn't enough, etc, etc. So nothing happens and the ones who did it walk away laughing emboldened to do whatever the please whenever they please.

I know of many instances where the best result has come from taking matters into your own hands and many where folks that did what was right got screwed. Of course the reverse is true also but how many women have been killed with restraining orders on some whack job ex?

When does it become "worth it"?