review of the Ke Nalu (Pono Bill) paddle

[Dwight (DW)]

For surfing I've been using a Maliko xTuf at 74". Went back up to 78" yesterday to see how it felt. Answer: not quite as good.

Bill,

We have found, when pushing the limits of balance surfing small SUPs, short paddles severely hamper your balance. You want an upright torso for the best balance. Short paddles make you bend over a lot and really make you bonk a lot.

i have actually experienced the exact opposite as you. granted i don't think i necessarily surf a 'short' board since i ride a 9'0, and i am 6'2, 185. i now prefer a shorter paddle for surfing, and my current paddle is 5, maybe 6 inches overhead. i find the shorter paddle MUCH better for when the waves get big (and i know that big is a relative term, but for me it's big when it's over head to a couple feet overhead, and anything more than that i am just a spectator!).

when i surf the steeper, late-drop beach breaks the longer paddle is actually a hinderance. for those waves you already need to be in your surf stance, starting to crouch down (you can still crouch or get down and still keep a straight torso)  and be ready to go. with a longer paddle you are crouched down, but your arms are way up in the air while paddling, which its throwing off your balance. The shorter paddle allows me to bend at the knees a touch and lower my center of gravity and really dig in and take a later drop much easier. now even if it's a big day and it's a slow rolling, a-frame type wave, the paddle length wouldn't be as critical i would think. just my two cents, and YMMV!

Most of what you talk about is surfing related and not staying upright related. When I'm battling whitewater on the way out, having a short paddle really hurts my ability to stick the foam and stay upright.

The other area of improvement is trolling for waves. Just cruising and staying upright in wicked chop is easier when your paddle actually reaches the water. My paddle must always be planted to stay standing. If you can stand without the paddle planted, your board isn't small.

[ODJ]

+ 1 DW.

I haven't measured a paddle in lots of years... but measured my Peahi the other day to respond to a PM.  82 inches.  My Ke Nalu is the same height (just from looking at the two together on the paddle rack)... I am a shade over 6'1".

I think that is considered long for a surf paddle... but in an hour and a half in high tide head high surf refracting off a jetty in a crowded lineup this morning on my 7'9" by 26 by 3.6 "Adam" I fell exactly zero times.

Some of it is balance... some of it is an amazing board that Adam and Corran designed... and a good piece of it is the confidence that I have when I need to slap my Ponopaddle in the water for grip and use the leverage... it is now an extension of my arm...

Tim

tim-

how much do you weigh?! i am 6'2, 185lbs and can't even imagine riding a board that small, let alone have it float me! my Stamps is 9x29x4, and i sink it just a touch. tim actually recommended me going 4.25, but thought that would be a bit thick, but i realize now why he recommended that thickness, because he really foils his boards thin in the nose, and especially the tail, which is one of the factors that i think allows his boards to be so maneuverable. i would love to see a picture of your board!

[Strand Leper]

ODJ,

I am clocking in at 185.

On this thread I have some pic's of the board:

http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=14205.0

This board is the BOMB.  For the next one, I am going to have Adam and Corran widen the tail a smidge... this is a good board for predictability but a wider tail would give me a touch more speed on the flats...

Tim

[ODJ]

For surfing I've been using a Maliko xTuf at 74". Went back up to 78" yesterday to see how it felt. Answer: not quite as good.

Bill,

We have found, when pushing the limits of balance surfing small SUPs, short paddles severely hamper your balance. You want an upright torso for the best balance. Short paddles make you bend over a lot and really make you bonk a lot.

i have actually experienced the exact opposite as you. granted i don't think i necessarily surf a 'short' board since i ride a 9'0, and i am 6'2, 185. i now prefer a shorter paddle for surfing, and my current paddle is 5, maybe 6 inches overhead. i find the shorter paddle MUCH better for when the waves get big (and i know that big is a relative term, but for me it's big when it's over head to a couple feet overhead, and anything more than that i am just a spectator!).

when i surf the steeper, late-drop beach breaks the longer paddle is actually a hinderance. for those waves you already need to be in your surf stance, starting to crouch down (you can still crouch or get down and still keep a straight torso)  and be ready to go. with a longer paddle you are crouched down, but your arms are way up in the air while paddling, which its throwing off your balance. The shorter paddle allows me to bend at the knees a touch and lower my center of gravity and really dig in and take a later drop much easier. now even if it's a big day and it's a slow rolling, a-frame type wave, the paddle length wouldn't be as critical i would think. just my two cents, and YMMV!

Most of what you talk about is surfing related and not staying upright related. When I'm battling whitewater on the way out, having a short paddle really hurts my ability to stick the foam and stay upright.

The other area of improvement is trolling for waves. Just cruising and staying upright in wicked chop is easier when your paddle actually reaches the water. My paddle must always be planted to stay standing. If you can stand without the paddle planted, your board isn't small.

well, i guess we are just different! again, and maybe its because i am tall and lanky, but standing directly upright on a surf SUP just sets me up for disaster. when i am paddling out over whitewash and breaking waves i crouch down just a bit, lower my center of gravity while still keeping my torso straight and will usually be in a partial surf stance to punch through or pop over the wave then immediately step back into my paddling stance, or my 'waiting for a wave' stance, where my feet are still slightly offset, but not in a full surf stance. obviously there is a point where short becomes too short, and that probably varies from paddler to paddler, and i can't give my opinion on paddle length and the really short boards because i'm just not there yet in my ability and have never ridden anything less than 8'11, but to me, the only time a longer paddle helps is when, like you mentioned, you are trolling for waves, but for everything else the longer paddle just gets in the way for me. i've also found the shorter paddle really helpful for really fast turn arounds where i decide at the last minute that i want to turn and go. i get down a little, get in my surf stance and dig in hard with the paddle. when i had a longer paddle my arms were way up while the rest of my body was crouched down, and this was not good for balance! i am a hack SUP surfer anyway, so take what i do with a grain of salt!!

[ODJ]

ODJ,

I am clocking in at 185.

On this thread I have some pic's of the board:

http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=14205.0

This board is the BOMB.  For the next one, I am going to have Adam and Corran widen the tail a smidge... this is a good board for predictability but a wider tail would give me a touch more speed on the flats...

Tim

i still don't see how that floats you, but that's the amazing talent that these shapers have! i just hope to be able to get to the point to be able to ride a board like that. it's pretty cool to see how different these boards are from one to another and how well they reform. my board has the volume more in the middle with the nose and tail nice and thin, but i suspect once you get down short enough you have to start distributing the volume along the entire board, but since it's shooter it's still going to be easy to whip around (especially by a guy your size) because it's short. i dig it.

[Strand Leper]

ODJ,

"Float" is a relative term... the board is about 88 liters... and the water is right around my ankles most of the time... just gotta keep on paddling to keep the inertia... It's a fun challenge... WAY easier than the Collab!

Tim

[soulpaddler]

Holy cow Tim.  I have prone boards that are around that range.

[SUPpaddler]

Like TN_SUP, I also have a Werner Nitro and some shoulder issues to be careful about.  I was looking at the Wiki and wondering if anyone can say how the pull and cadence of the Wiki compare with the Nitro?  (As another point of reference, I've heard several times that the QB 90 blade has about the same pull as the Nitro, so maybe someone can compare that to the Wiki.)  Also, I don't quite understand the Ke Nalu shaft choices for someone looking for a little flex. Thanks.

[Reid SUP'd]

I know I'm late to the picnic but my ke nalu maliko arrived today and it looks great, and feels even better! love the grippiness, can't wait to take it out for a spin!

Might be a stupid question but,

when inserting the blade does a lot of the glue bleed out?  it seemed like i pushed most out although it feels pretty solid once it cooled, i covered the joint with some electrical tape

i will take my time doing the handle as I also got the adjustable ergo,  i'm psyched to try it!

i think i made the right decision with the 60 flex even for distance but will have to wait and see

[PonoBill]

Yes, some glue should bleed out. It might be a bit late to say this, but the videos show you how to keep this excess off the blade and shaft--you mask both with electrical tape and use either a blade (like the back of a hacksaw blade, an old butterknife, or a business card) to scrape off the excess.

If you get both the ferrule with the glue on it and the shaft pretty warm, you can push the ferrule in and out a few times, twisting to get the glue well distributed. This is the best way, but we've had very few problems with the blade joints.

We've had two people who had problems with handle adhesion, three if you include me. Again it's a matter of getting the shaft and the ferrule warm enough. That doesn't mean blasting it in one place--carbon fiber is not that good of a heat conductor. You have to take you time and get it very evenly warm. You'll find that out for sure with the extended handle--it's really long, and everything needs to be warm for the entire length you're going to push it in. Tim's method with a towel to keep the heat in is right on. When it's all warm everything moves easily, but if you don't get the entire length you're going to push the handle into warm, then it will lock up. No problem, just heat it up more.

You can get the handle to go in if the shaft isn't warm, but the glue won't stick evenly. When it's evenly distributed it takes 200+ foot pounds of torque to twist a handle standard handle and disrupt the glue, more than 400 ft pounds for the extended. In fact I don't know how much, I didn't get it to turn. You can actually solve a loose handle problem by just rewarming the shaft until the handle moves freely, give it a wiggle and let it cool.

I'm warming up to the 60 Flex after playing with the xTuf so much in the surf. We adapt--that's what humans do. I'm going to try an xTuf shaft with an elite blade. I shouldn't say that, people will want one if it works and we have enough inventory problems as it is, but it's an interesting notion. The xTuf shaft has an interesting flex. The unidirectional carbon fiber is different. Doesn't have the same kind of stiffness in the vertical plane. It stacks up more, meaning it flexes easily at first, and then firms, like a recurve bow. Odd feeling, but good.

[TN_SUP]

Like TN_SUP, I also have a Werner Nitro and some shoulder issues to be careful about.  I was looking at the Wiki and wondering if anyone can say how the pull and cadence of the Wiki compare with the Nitro?  (As another point of reference, I've heard several times that the QB 90 blade has about the same pull as the Nitro, so maybe someone can compare that to the Wiki.)  Also, I don't quite understand the Ke Nalu shaft choices for someone looking for a little flex. Thanks.

The pull of the wiki seemed much stronger to me and the cadence is almost twice as fast - it's hard to slow down and not overwork yourself. I was pulling too hard with my lower arm which agravated my elbows. One thing I like about the Nitro is the long blade allows you to easily adjust how much is in the water (Bill is cringing here) which is handy when going upstream or upwind (or when your winded!). The shorter blade on the wiki means it almost always submerged so you're at 100% power. If I paddle all Friday afternoon with the wiki and don't have pain, I'll be a believer, but right now the nitro is magic on my body despite its wobbles. I wish I had bought at least a 90 flex shaft on the wiki for extra cushion.

[SUPpaddler]

Interesting that you found the Wiki harder to pull (if I understood), yet higher cadence than the Nitro, since those would not tend to coincide.  I suppose when you feel more resistance, you tend to counter it with more effort. 

You're probably right about combining the smaller blade with a more flexible shaft for joint issues.  Speaking of flex, I was just at a surf shop comparing a bunch of QB Kanana paddles that had different shaft stiffness ratings.  But far more pronounced was the difference in flex between the carbon Kahana blade and the fiberglass Kanaha blade, the latter being only 1 ounce more (or the same weight depending on which specs you read.)  So I'm wondering if going to a fiberglass blade might provide more relief, or whether it would  feel entirely different from a flexible shaft.

[TN_SUP]

Should add I'm talking about the bent shaft nitro model that is 10" over my head. And I found the amount of pull proportional to the length of shaft - 2 inches on the wiki made a huge difference, as going from 12" overhead to 10" made the paddle feel completely different and easier to pull.

[PonoBill]

The wiki cadence is high because the swing weight is so low. Recovery is extremely quick. You'd think it wouldn't matter that much but it does. Of course you can slow yourself down, but it doesn't feel right to do that.

You might try taking another inch off, or even just a half. When you hit the sweet spot for length it's a big deal. You may have to add a little glue with the cut and trying, ace hardware has hot glue sticks for their glue guns. Get the amber-colored ones. You can heat the ferrule up with your hairdryer or heat gun, soften the glue in the heat and just dab a little at the end of the ferrule. 

[paddlejones]

Bill,
Any time line for when the x-tuff pono paddle's are available?
thanks,
Jeff