hawaiian stroke technique / tahitian stroke technique > what's the difference??

[suchlila]

Hey SUP friends!
Here in Germany the SUP sport is very young. I hope, this question is not so stupid but can you explain for us the difference between the hawaiian and the tahitian stroke technique???
Thanks a lot
Chris

[juandoe]

See here:
http://www.kenalu.com/2010/02/paddling-with-dave/

and here
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=6359.0

and here
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=6614.0

and here
http://www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=4766.0

[Pureadrenalin]

One is Hawaiian the other is Tahitian. Sorry I had to I couldn't help it.lmao

[Corkid]

Chris,

I spent a week in Turks and Caicos with Dave and Pono Bill's explanation on the first link is right on. The Tahitian stroke is definitely more technical and requires very precise movements to master but less power compared to the Hawaiian. The theory is that the Tahitian technique should help with efficiency while the Hawaiian stroke is going to be more powerful and faster. Dave is the first to qualify, that both are good and you should be able to mix and match in your paddling whether your racing, down winding or doing a recreation paddle. I've found that I move from one to another depending on how I feel, conditions, etc. I have to admit, the funny thing is I still come across a lot of superior athletes who out paddle me purely because of their fitness. The "motor", unfortunately is still the limiting factor for most of us. 

Mike
SupJunkie.com
 

[robcasey]

- tahitian - short quick strokes reaching out as far as you can towards the nose. remove the blade in front of your toes.  use a nearly straight arm technique with torso rotation. 

- hawaiian - standard forward stroke, taking out at your heels or behind your feet. longer strokes.  etc.

[CMC]

The Tahitian stroke comes from outrigger paddling and is being popularised due to the Tahitian domination of the sport using their high rating, short and powerful stroke.  It is faster but it takes a more trained athlete to maintain it for distance.  Most normal people can not paddle at 80 strokes per minute for 5 hours!

Tahitian teams have dominated the Molokai Hoe with this year first 4 placings taken by Tahitians using their 'Tahitian Stroke'.  5th place was an all star Hawaiian team, 6th place an all star Australian team.

The team that won: Shell Va'a holds the record for the race.

[robcasey]

thanks for the info cmc, good read.  our top sup racer in the pacific nw (beau whitehead) use the tahitian.  he can do it for 13 miles, maybe longer? it's fun to watch him do it with such precision and consistency.   

[PonoBill]

Actually the Hawaiian stroke includes winging the paddle out of the water by dropping the upper hand at the end of the power stroke. You still don't stroke past your toes.

When you see a Tahitian team doing their stroke your first reaction is "they can't keep that up for long". Wrong. They do it all day long. Part of the trick is the application of power is so very short. The other part is relaxing any muscle that isn't presently doing work, which is incredibly difficult at 80 strokes per minute (1.3 per second!!!). For example, when you're lifting the paddle out of the water you push it upwards with your lower hand, while the upper arm relaxes and the hand/wrist turns the handle like a knob to feather the paddle. Your upper arm should almost hang from the paddle. Nothing about the stroke is intuitive. I've been doing it for almost two years and I still haven't got it nailed.

[zacksc]

I have forearm extensor tendinitis issues and would really like to learn the correct, straight arm, semi relaxed Tahitian paddle technique. Any advice on how to learn and practice that would be greatly appreciated!
(I am in Santa Cruz , ca.)

[PonoBill]

The BEST way is to have Dave Kalama teach it to you. He's the master and a hell of a good teacher. Lots of people know how to do it, but not many have pulled the stroke apart and analyzed every little bit like Dave has. The stuff on his website is fine, but there's a big difference in getting personal correction. Dave does one on one training when he has the time (like when there aren't any big waves or big races anywhere). He also does it at his Kalama Kamps and Kalama Klinics. I've been trying to encourage him to do more Klinics (One day training gigs), I like to see him do one in Hood River so I could get a tuneup in the Columbia.

If you want to contact him you can do it through his website. He's really good about answering questions on the site. http://www.davidkalama.com/

[zacksc]

do you think there is anyone who could do a clinic or one-on-one instruction in Santa Cruz?

[raf]

If your lower arm is the fulcrum, don't you get more power keeping your hands farther apart?  Unless your hands are like 18" apart I don't see how you can get your paddle out before it reaches your toes, and if they are 18" apart, then your fulcrum isn't optimized. 
This is just an observation made in the vacuum that is Maine winter SUPing.  I have only my own experience to draw upon.

[PonoBill]

Probably the two biggest differences in a Tahitian stroke are that you lift the paddle up out of the water like drawing a sword (you actually push it up with the lower arm, but that's a refinement) and the focus on reach and early application of the power.  You can pull the paddle out far ahead of your feet, in fact that's one of the practice moves--to do a slight pull and then immediately pull out the paddle.

It's NOT intuitive at all.

[zacksc]

Can you use the Tahitian form at lower cadence?

[paddledaddy]

I too am a Tahitian stroke and Dave Kalama devotee having been to a few Kalama Kamps. And my local SUP shop is run by Brody Welte who organizes the Kalama Kamp events, so I am around the proper stroke a lot, even if I still struggle to do it right. Anyway, a few thoughts:

1) You don't have to do it at a super fast cadence to learn it. The best way to learn is to do it at a relaxed pace and then pick up the pace when you have the rythm down.  Recently, I purchased a cheap watch with cadence and discovered I am usually working at about 50 strokes per minute. I'm working on getting faster which is why I bought the watch, but I don't care if I never get faster than 60 strokes per minute. A paddler who can work at 85 strokes per minute in the outrigger is not going to be able to work that fast with the longer SUP paddle. 60 strokes per minute is cooking with a SUP paddle.

2) The arms are not straight throughout the Tahitian stroke. The arms are rather fluid which is what makes it harder. Keeping the arms straight throughout the stroke is actually characteristic of the big powerful Hawaiian stroke. You do however keep the top hand high at all times which may account for the confusion about keeping the arms straight.

3) The Tahitian stroke is much harder to learn than the Hawaiian stroke. Most of us probably do need some help to learn it really well. In speaking to Danny Ching at Surf Expo he hinted to me that the Tahitian stroke is faster, but he uses the Hawaiian stroke because his personal fitness is built around the Hawaiian stroke and at this point it is easier for him to do that then to develop the coordination necessary for an excellent Tahitian stroke. On the other hand I met a guy at our last race who pretty much self taught himself using Dave's blog. He showed up on an 18' board and took second overall in his first race beating some regional pros.