Standup Zone Forum
Stand Up Paddle => Gear Talk => Topic started by: Zooport on November 25, 2016, 12:59:32 PM
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OCSurf and I have been talking about the wisdom of this, and I was wondering what your thoughts were on this idea: I'm approaching 60 and wondering if I should wear mild flotation when I surf, like an Oneil Gooru, just in case something were to happen, getting knocked out, heart attack, whatever. I rarely go out in really big surf; most of what I surf is head-high, usually below, so I don't need it for the same reasons as chargers like Beasho. I'm in pretty good shape, surf every day, but you never know; something could happen to someone my age. It would be nice to float face up if it did. Thoughts?
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A Gooru isn't going to reliably float you face up if you pass out for whatever reason. You need a Mae West style for that, which makes no sense for SUP. If you're worried about the danger factor you need to go out with a friend or two, or at least go where there are other people.
Having said that the Gooru makes sense for wearing when you don't have to duck dive, like on a SUP. Less so for regular surf.
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Hey Zoo: I've been wearing the same patagonia big wave vest now for a couple of seasons and I wear it all the time regardless of wave size. It provides a good bit of float but will NOT float you face up. I like it a lot as it provides some extra warmth (~1mm or so), fits well, provides torso protection (ribs: front and back from board whacks), and is floaty. I think there's several out there on the market and there's been some info post here in the past on the different manufacturers and model. Here's the link for the Patagonia vest I like:
http://www.patagonia.com/product/mens-r1-padded-big-wave-vest/88200.html
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I've got a gooru and wear it in bigger surf. I like that I get to the surface quicker, feel more comfortable and I don't care what others think of me.
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I wear one for anything over three feet (Hawaiian), meaning head high. I have both the Gooru and the patagonia. They're a bit of a bitch to get off with my crap shoulders, so the next on I get will have a zipper.
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I wear the Gooru Tech Comp whenever it's head high or above. It gets me to the surface quick and pretty much guarantees I'll be able to swim to shore regardless of how exhausted I get. It also protects my ribs if I happen to fall on the board.
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CORRECTION: I didn't mean to imply that I thought the vest would turn a person face up if he became unconscious. I just meant that it would help you keep your head above water if you were incapacitated.
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Impact vests are actually pretty good to swim in--not as fast, but you don't have to use as much energy for the speed you do manage. My swimming skills have deteriorated with successive shoulder crap, so I'm not gonna be fast anyway.
With our relatively big boards (in volume if not length) the stuff that works fine for surfers is sometimes not enough. I've been hit by my surf and windsurfing boards many times without real injury. I got hit in the breastbone with my 9' SUP and pulverized the bone. Still have a big knot three years later.
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Oneil also makes a USCG Approved vest called the Revenge. I use it on big days and I find it compact enough that it doesn't get in the way. It wont turn you face up if you are unconscious, but it is buoyant enough to keep you afloat without any physical effort. That plus a waist leash is probably as safe as you can hope for. Plus it zips in front, which I like.
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They're a bit of a bitch to get off with my crap shoulders, so the next on I get will have a zipper.
You fully figured out the "houdini" maneuver?
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Prior posts on the gooru impact vest convinced me and I got one a few months ago and wear it whenever I surf. Comfortable, can still swim, provides some warmth, protects from rib shots, and pops you back to surface a little bit sooner.
Also, if worn under a wetsuit it looks like 15-20 pounds of added muscle :D.
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I think they are a good idea in some conditions.
But as an aside, a day will come when I have a strong do not resuscitate order for all my buddies. If I slip unconscious out in the lineup I don't want some goofball bringing me back to "live" in an assisted care facility after I've been oxygen deprived for a few minutes.
Acceptance is key in this life and slipping away under the waves at a break I love is about the best exit I can imagine.
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I've been wearing the Body Glove Vapor impact vest in all conditions for a few years now. Keeps me nice and warm. Good security blanket on bigger days.
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I'm going to get one for bigger days. I'm going to have to get one with straps I can lengthen or have my sister modify one. Nothing I've seen fits me so far. I def need to get one. My swimming sucks these days too. At least compared to the old me...like my bro I have partially functioning arms these days. I also have shitty lungs. Long history of asthma, bronchitis, and pneumonia...it's what will kill me someday no doubt. Bad combo on the water for sure.
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I've been trying a Gill Compressor vest racing pfd recently. I wear waist hydration and a waist leash belt when downwinding and the bulk of the Gooru around the waist can get awkward. The Compressor vest has less bulk on the hips, gives more flotation, gives protection to ribs etc, is easy to swim in, is easy to get in and out of, and doesn't ride up in big wipe-outs. So far it's a thumbs up from me - and I have several pfds already. Dunno if it is sold in the US though?
http://www.gillmarine.com/gb/compressor-vest.html
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I think the little bit of extra float, warmth, and rib protection these vests provide could them worthwhile, though I'm really much more worried about head injuries than anything a vest would protect me from. When I'm in the water in the impact zone, my head is a lot more exposed than my torso, especially when surfacing after a disorienting spin through the wash. I also like to be able to dive deep to safety if I get caught with my board between me and a breaking wave. I wonder if a floatation vest might keep me in harm's way in that situation.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
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I've been trying a Gill Compressor vest racing pfd recently. I wear waist hydration and a waist leash belt when downwinding and the bulk of the Gooru around the waist can get awkward. The Compressor vest has less bulk on the hips, gives more flotation, gives protection to ribs etc, is easy to swim in, is easy to get in and out of, and doesn't ride up in big wipe-outs. So far it's a thumbs up from me - and I have several pfds already. Dunno if it is sold in the US though?
http://www.gillmarine.com/gb/compressor-vest.html
Just for info...the O'Neill Tech Comp impact vest has the foam taken out of the bottom of the vest so you can put on a harness/ waist pfd or waist hydration. It isn't going to provide same flotation as the Compressor but it does a nice snug not hinderance feel and gives protection ribs up. I still reckon a proper pfd is better for DW in winter for me personally...I can get everything in it....but it isn't as easy to get back on the board.
Where do you put your VHF and plb?
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I think the little bit of extra float, warmth, and rib protection these vests provide could them worthwhile, though I'm really much more worried about head injuries than anything a vest would protect me from. When I'm in the water in the impact zone, my head is a lot more exposed than my torso, especially when surfacing after a disorienting spin through the wash. I also like to be able to dive deep to safety if I get caught with my board between me and a breaking wave. I wonder if a floatation vest might keep me in harm's way in that situation.
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That's why I want a vest with just a little flotation; so I can still dive, if need be. A helmet would be a good idea too, but I'll probably never wear one of those.
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I also like to be able to dive deep to safety if I get caught with my board between me and a breaking wave. I wonder if a flotation vest might keep me in harm's way in that situation.
100% Wrong
I only hear these comments from surfers WHO HAVE NEVER USED A VEST. This is akin to those who used to claim they didn't wear their seatbelts because they would rather 'Be flown free from the crashing vehicle.'
I have been using an O'Neill Gooru for 7 years and wear it in everything from 2 to 18 feet. Above 18 feet I put on 2 vests. This video shows my standard 'Kit' which includes:
Rashguard, High-School rib protector, O'Neill Gooru and Wetsuit.
This is a lot of float and typically puts the waterline 2" below my shoulder when vertical in the water.
When motivated I can still dive under a wave with one hand on the paddle. 1st Photo shows small conditions, 2nd shows upper limit of single vest.
PS: Whatever your comfort level is with surf e.g. I'm comfortable to 6 ft, or 8 ft . . . a vest will immediately add 4 ft to your comfort level.
https://vimeo.com/59367681
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How hard is it to get the Gooru on and off? No straps, right?
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Yeah, perfectly easy to get in and off. Well, no harder than any other type of wetsuit kit. No straps, no zips. It's quite stretchy and flexible so it's very comfortable. If you'd be safer wearing one then it's pretty dim not to, really. They add a nice bit of warmth too, so you see our South African colleagues pairing them with boardshorts for downwinders.
They do make it a little bit harder to dive underwater if you are starting from just floating in the water (as opposed to diving off your board) but if the extra flotation is enough to prevent you from diving then to be quite honest you probably shouldn't be out there anyway.
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Do these vests lose buoyancy over time? I've had mine for 3 years. Seems to be ok except for the loose threading I have to trim every so often. How often do you guys replace them?
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Is the Gooru considered a wakeboard vest? Gooru wakeboard is the only vest I'm finding online.
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That's the one. It doesn't have a strap but that's only a problem in bigger surf as a tumbling can leave it partially pulled up over your head. If worn under a suit or surf shirt also not a problem.
I don't find it easy to get off, but it's a managable though not beautiful moment.
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I've been trying a Gill Compressor vest racing pfd recently. I wear waist hydration and a waist leash belt when downwinding and the bulk of the Gooru around the waist can get awkward. The Compressor vest has less bulk on the hips, gives more flotation, gives protection to ribs etc, is easy to swim in, is easy to get in and out of, and doesn't ride up in big wipe-outs. So far it's a thumbs up from me - and I have several pfds already. Dunno if it is sold in the US though?
http://www.gillmarine.com/gb/compressor-vest.html
Just for info...the O'Neill Tech Comp impact vest has the foam taken out of the bottom of the vest so you can put on a harness/ waist pfd or waist hydration. It isn't going to provide same flotation as the Compressor but it does a nice snug not hinderance feel and gives protection ribs up. I still reckon a proper pfd is better for DW in winter for me personally...I can get everything in it....but it isn't as easy to get back on the board.
Where do you put your VHF and plb?
In the pockets of my Camelbak Baja. It's a hydration pack that combines a waist-mounted bladder with a shoulder-mounting, so is the best of both worlds. I have various full pfds as well, but they make swimming too difficult. If I got parted from my board in a full pfd I'd be unable to make my way to shore under my own steam. Yet the cold and remoteness of UK downwinding means that getting to shore under your own steam is by far your best bet. As you'll know, a 4 or 5mm wetsuit already adds some buoyancy even before a pfd.
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I'm really much more worried about head injuries than anything a vest would protect me from. When I'm in the water in the impact zone, my head is a lot more exposed than my torso, especially when surfacing after a disorienting spin through the wash. I also like to be able to dive deep to safety if I get caught with my board between me and a breaking wave. I wonder if a floatation vest might keep me in harm's way in that situation.
Hey Luke, whenever I think the board might be above me after a wipe out, I just put my free hand above my head for protection as I come to the surface.
I think if you used a tail handle, it would lessen the chances of getting hit by your board while in the impact zone. Loose boards are dangerous.
There is no need to ever dive under a wave. You should be on the surface controlling your board. You shouldn't have to retrieve your board every time you get hit by a wave.
Only in a few very rare cases have I ever ditched my board and that's when it's well overhead and a wave is threatening to break right on top of me. I don't want to be anywhere near the board in that situation.
If I think a whitewater wave is too big to paddle over, I will jump off the board and grab the tail handle.
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After my SCA I wanted to get some extra protection in the area where my ICD was installed. An impact there could be most shocking - literally!
Checked around and got some excellent advice from supdisco - competition water skier, and pdlsfr who both had the Gooru.
Helps some with float, and is awesome as an impact vest. Easy on and off. Took a shot in the ribs in a Hurricane 🌀 swell with no ill effects. Tiny by beasho standards, big enough by mine.
It will look ratty with use. Oh dear..
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I used my O'Neil Tech comp impact vest fir surfing today fir the first time...mainly because I was feeling cold....but hey....I think this is one to wear all winter....the wee bit of extra buoyancy is great and you don't feel much when you hit the water. Bugger getting it off!
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Is the amount of buoyancy provided by the Gooru vest published anywhere?
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I think I read somewhere back when I was doing the research that the Competition Vests have about 15 pounds buoyancy. To be USCG approved, a vest has to have 35 pounds buoyancy.
I can't confirm that but it should be online somewhere.
The Gooru (now called the "Gooru Tech") is a Competition vest.
http://us.oneill.com/shop/wetsuits/mens/wake-waterski-vests/
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Area 10, I am interested in the Gill Compressor vest. I have a 40" chest, wear medium long wetsuit. From their size chart, looks like I would order L. Do you think it will fit over a wetsuit? The description indicates there is a side zip, which is not visible in the photos. Is it easy to get on and off? How about the Gooru - same questions? Thanks, TB
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I think I read somewhere back when I was doing the research that the Competition Vests have about 15 pounds buoyancy. To be USCG approved, a vest has to have 35 pounds buoyancy.
I was wrong.
CG approved vests require 15.5 pounds of buoyancy.
http://www.pfdma.org/choosing/types.aspx
The Comp Vests have a bit less. Maybe 8 or 10 pounds. I'll see if I can find it.
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Yeah, 36 pounds of buoyancy would be a hell of a lot. I determined when I was fiddling with adding float to camelbacks that 4 pounds of float in the chest area lets you swim and rest with minimal effort. Ten pounds is hard to distribute in ways that don't impede activity. A pint of water is one pound, so ignoring the weight of the material, 36 pounds of floatation would be equivalent to having about four and a half gallon containers strapped to you. 16 pounds is two gallons. That's a hell of a lot too.
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You're right Bill, I was thinking of my Mustang belt PFD which I believe has 35 pounds. I think I remember the ad saying that it had twice the CG required buoyancy.
I can't find the Gooru buoyancy anywhere. I guess we can just say that it isn't much. Just enough so that you don't have to tread water to stay afloat.
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PFD is 75 Newtons (~15 lbs)
A competition vest (called a "buoyancy aid", without a collar) allowed for racing (like sailboats, here SUP is in that category) is 50 Newtons (~11 lbs)
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Those Newtons will go great with all those gallons of milk.
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I'm not sure what the hand wringing is all about at this point.
75 Newtons, 4 Gallons of Milk, 11 lbs of thrust. . . .
If you troll Amazon you will see the price of this vest change over time often based on color. Last year I got one for $35 even though I didn't need a second one (and mine is almost 7 years old). I gave it to a 'kid' for Christmas that I had been surfing with who was interested in big waves.
Here it is for $95 shipped (in the US). The extra warmth allows for thinner, cheaper wetsuits so you will save the money over time and did I mention it doesn't wear out if worn under your wetsuit.
You will never have an appreciation for the amount of float until you try it but 11 lbs is enough beyond neutral to get you back to the surface in anything from 2 to 12 foot faces.
I remember when I cracked my ribs, through my Gooru, and was in so much pain I couldn't crawl back on my board. I was bobbing and giggled at the thought 'Wow this sucks but at least I'm not going to drown.' Eventually the wind and waves deposited me back on the beach.
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Area 10, I am interested in the Gill Compressor vest. I have a 40" chest, wear medium long wetsuit. From their size chart, looks like I would order L. Do you think it will fit over a wetsuit? The description indicates there is a side zip, which is not visible in the photos. Is it easy to get on and off? How about the Gooru - same questions? Thanks, TB
Yes, the Compressor should fit you. I am a 42" chest (actually measured rather than clothing size) and I can wear the L size over a wetsuit, and it's quite snug. It's a similar concept to the Gooru but is a step up in that it is a fully certified 50N racing buoyancy aid. It has a fairly short zip down the left hand side which helps getting it off a lot. In fact getting it off is easier than getting it on IMO. There is an adjustable belt around the waist which stops it riding up, which is a weakness of the gooru in big surf (if you wear it over your suit). The Compressor is a classy bit of kit aimed at competitive sailors. It is a bit more bulky up top than the gooru (hence the increased bouyancy) so there is bit of an Arnold Schwarzenegger effect going on when you wear it - pretty macho - but it is otherwise discrete and looks professional. It works well in the water - you can swim easily in it and still dive down if you want to, but it gives just enough buoyancy to make staying afloat pretty easy.
The Gooru is pretty easy to get in and off as well - I don't really see why there are so many Qs about this: these things are very flexible. But I guess I'm used to getting in and out of 5mm chest-zip wetsuits so compared with those anything is easy. But an average person with average mobility shouldn't have any trouble really. The Compressor is easier to get off than the Gooru: unfasten the quick release buckle waist, unzip the side zip and you can have it all off inside about 3 seconds. There is definitely a bit more struggling with the Gooru, but once you've got the technique it's nothing to worry about.
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The price has gone up a bit somebody here is gouging, I think. I found one at a swim outlet for $79
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Regional variations???
Try this link: Indica/Lime
https://www.amazon.com/ONeill-Wetsuits-Waterski-Gooru-Competition/dp/B00QLN14KA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1480470468&sr=8-1&keywords=oneill%2Bgooru&th=1&psc=1
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FYI I normally order large for most tops, including wet suits. I ordered the X-large gooru from Amazon because it was a lot cheaper and it fits very tightly.
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FYI I normally order large for most tops, including wet suits. I ordered the X-large gooru from Amazon because it was a lot cheaper and it fits very tightly.
Yes, I am also normally wear a L shirt but use the XL Gooru, and also the XL O'Neill Revenge Comp impact vest, which is a good option for those who want something easy to get on and off. The O'Neill impact vest sizes seem to run a little tight. So if you are in doubt I'd go up a size.
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I've found that Amazon prices jump around a lot. They can change one minute to the next. I've seen a good price on an item, then gone back a few minutes later and it was gone.
If you see a good price, bookmark it and the price will not change. I've kept good deals on stuff for up to a week or more like that while I think it over, but if you don't bookmark it, it might disappear.
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I've used a few different ones, but all with zipper. I do not find that it impedes that much at all. To say it in the words of my tow-in instructor: Air trumps everything...it was after he got caught in the washing machine at Sunset.
Naish , O'neill, Dakine, Liquid force...probably a few more. I've ended up using the naish ones and o'neil the most.
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The strechyness of the gooru makes it nice and warm. The ziperlessness makes it a good padding for between boards when stacking for downwinders.
The trick to take it off is to first tuck one arm into the vest, wriggle it down and out and then in lifting your arm the vest peels up and off over your head. As illustrated in the instructions.
The L is not baggy on me but I’d use an M because it is that strechy.
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Another useful thing about the Gooru is, if you start to overheat in your wetsuit and you want to take off your gloves to cool down, you can store them inside the vest while you surf.
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The strechyness of the gooru makes it nice and warm. The ziperlessness makes it a good padding for between boards when stacking for downwinders.
The trick to take it off is to first tuck one arm into the vest, wriggle it down and out and then in lifting your arm the vest peels up and off over your head. As illustrated in the instructions.
The L is not baggy on me but I’d use an M because it is that strechy.
Going to try your getting off the Gooru technique as I failed miserably the other day over my 6 mm. Thought I might have to ask for help. ;D
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https://youtu.be/i6xQ3xwECSo?t=1m14s
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https://youtu.be/i6xQ3xwECSo?t=1m14s
You've saved me years of torture lol!
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Damn. I cut the hell out of my Patagonia vest because I couldn't get it off. I bet that would have worked.
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Wearing a long sleeve fitted rash guard underneath my impact vest makes it easier to remove.
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My Gooru vest arrived yesterday and I surfed in it the first time today. I really like it. Not really floaty but just right. I kicked out on a wave today only to find a larger wave just about break on my head. Dove under it and had no trouble getting below, but the vest brought me to the surface quickly too. I also love the extra warmth factor. Thanks for the guidance everyone.
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Anybody tried the DK surface vest.
http://www.dakine.com/sport/kiteboard/kite-harnesses/surface-vest.html (http://www.dakine.com/sport/kiteboard/kite-harnesses/surface-vest.html)
Would like to kill 2 birds with one stone for SUP and kiting.
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I have the O'Neill and the Dakine. I prefer the zippered Dakine, a little floatier.
I was really grateful for it today, three hold downs, two that FELT lengthy. I knew struggling and panic wasn't any use, so I just relaxed as best I could until I came to the surface to take some deep breaths before the next beat down. I also lost my paddle twice and found it again. There were some violent ground swells coming through. It's amazing how such a short experience can really make your heart pound and get you out of breath.
I do wear it as standard equipment out there.
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I've been trying a Gill Compressor vest racing pfd recently. I wear waist hydration and a waist leash belt when downwinding and the bulk of the Gooru around the waist can get awkward. The Compressor vest has less bulk on the hips, gives more flotation, gives protection to ribs etc, is easy to swim in, is easy to get in and out of, and doesn't ride up in big wipe-outs. So far it's a thumbs up from me - and I have several pfds already. Dunno if it is sold in the US though?
http://www.gillmarine.com/gb/compressor-vest.html
A10 - does the Compressor have padding around the sides like the Gooru, or is it just neoprene on the sides, with the foam panels on the front and back only? It's hard to tell from the pictures on their site. The shorter Compressor looks like it would fit me more comfortably than the longer Gooru, but I want some protection from a shot to the ribs from the side.
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It's just neoprene at the sides, for about a 4" strip. You'd have to be pretty unlucky to land right there because your arms would usually cover it, but I suppose it could happen. There is more padding on the chest and back than you get with the Gooru, so if you fell on those parts you'd be better protected. The Compressor is a proper CE approved buoyancy aid, whereas the Gooru isn't. So I guess there's no perfect solution, and you choose the risks that you want to take. The Gooru is sleeker and covers a bigger area, whereas the Compressor provides more buoyancy, is more stable in position in a big wipe-out (assuming you are wearing them on the outside of a wetsuit), and if you did take a hit to the upper back or chest, it would provide more protection. Impact vest vs. buoyancy aid, I guess. I tend to use the Gooru if I'm not going to be crazy far offshore (e.g. not more than about a mile), and the Compressor if I'm going to be a couple of miles offshore.
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When I'm wiping out badly or in the water in a bad spot relative to my board and a wave, I find my arms are often up flailing for balance or protecting my head rather than down at my sides, so I'd feel better about having some protection from the side too. I'd use this mostly for near shore surf and downwinding too, so the slightly reduced buoyancy is probably ok too. With the Gooru being a little cheaper and easier to return on Amazon right now, I think I'll give that one a shot first, and if it doesn't fit well, I'll try Compressor.
Thanks for the helpful review of both!
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I've been using the Guru now for a couple of months and really like it. I surf a lot alone and it gives me some peace of mind to know that I will at least float if something were to happen.
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Using the Gooru for about a year under my wetsuits. At this time of year the added warmth is appreciated. Rib protection and a bit of float for safety. A bit too warm in the summer but the water is cold and I spend a fair bit of time in it.
Bob
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Btw a friend of mine recently broke his ribs SUP surfing even though he was wearing an Ion Vector, which is an impact vest similar to the Gooru. So, although impact vests will definitely help, it is not a certain solution.
Just something to bear in mind. I love my Gooru, but you have to understand its limits. I did take a hit to the ribs in mine once from the rail of my board and although my ribs did not break - as far as I know - I was very sore and bruised for a while, despite the hit not being that big. So, impact vests do help for sure. But they don't provide as much protection as you might think.
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https://youtu.be/i6xQ3xwECSo?t=1m14s
You've saved me years of torture lol!
Glad I remembered your post.
I have a Matuse vest - with no zipper.
Easy on, impossible off by myself, I thought.
Only 1mm thick so didn't want to pull on it to hard.
Awesome, the Technique works!
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I've fractured my ribs twice in less than a year SUP surfing. Both times were just weird accidents.
I'm going to invest in a Gooru and minimise the chances of a third break.
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I have the Dakine zippered vest (surface vest). I have only used it for windsurfing on winter days so far. Plan on using it for SUP. FYI the sizing on this vest is odd. I have broad shoulders but I am thin. Take a mens large tall in a shirt. I tried these on in the store and ended up with XXL. I wear it on the outside of my suit, and it fits well. Extra float is nice when waterstarting and keeping your hands out of the 40 degree water.
JP
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I picked up a Gooru vest a few weeks back when the price dropped a bit on Amazon, and I finally got a chance to try it today. It fits snugly, but is easy enough to get in and out of. I wore it under my wetsuit, so it stayed in place until I took it off afterward.
The extra buoyancy it provided was nice. I could duck under a wave if I needed to but would pop right back up and float effortlessly with my head well out of the water and the tops of my shoulders just above the surface. The float made it easier to grab my board and climb back on with less effort to pull myself up and out of the water.
I fortunately did not need to test its impact protection, but with a strong offshore breeze flipping my board in the air any time I missed a wave and fell, it was nice to be able to protect my head with my arms and worry a little less about leaving my ribs exposed.
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Zoner's: For what its worth...just did a giggle search for "O'Neil Gooru Vest" at found them at The-House.com for $59 and change w/ free shipping, so figured for that price I'd pull the trigger. Got an XL and the site indicated there were "two XL remaining".....if anyone's in the market.
8)