Author Topic: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016  (Read 25378 times)

Eagle

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #45 on: January 04, 2017, 08:37:09 AM »
"It’s too big and voluminous, for me and I imagine you, to be nimble. Nore is it optimised for that. It’s a board more for bigger riders."

yugi - the volume of the 26.5 Rail is 270L and the Bullet V2 is 269L  I never had the feeling the Bullet was meant for really bigger riders.  Maybe the F14 though.  The V2 is actually quite nimble for me vs the M14.  But ever since putting that 7.0 fin on the M14 - that board now has a perfectly nice loose tail.  And turns 100% for me.  The sticking problem seems to have resolved itself.

Personally though I like the Bullet V2 the way it is.  The wider shoulders above water seem to give it more float the times it starts to pearl.  So it is narrow at the waterline for speed -> plus has good float when it planes.  Quite a nice little nuanced shape that way.  I had the impression riders of all sizes really like that board.  The V2 and M14 have just the right amount of overlap for my uses actually.  To me the Rail 26.5 would simply split that difference.  Too bad though that proto never came available to me. 
Fast is FUN!   8)
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yugi

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #46 on: January 04, 2017, 09:07:47 AM »
^ interesting. I’d have thought a lot less for the Rail. I wonder where the volume is hidden. Not in the nose, nor the tail, nor the middle. Pick either up or just look at on the water and anyone would tell you the same. Hmmmm.

In-between those 2 is good description of the Rail.
add: nimbler and better upwind. A bit lighter, better in big chop and may be a bit faster on flats. Not as easy as either of the other 2, more for a lighter or skilled rider.

Exactly: would replace the other 2. (and a Dominator and a Starby Touring)

Eagle

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #47 on: January 04, 2017, 09:34:01 AM »
Yep - gone over that.  Definitely if single -> the AS23 and Rail 26.5 is very hard to beat.  Very hard.  But in my situation - will have to make do with my 5 boards.  Now what about A10 and all his boards?  A10 if you had to choose only 2-14' boards out of your quiver - which 2 would you pick?   :o
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Area 10

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #48 on: January 04, 2017, 09:53:53 AM »
^ interesting that you choose that long narrow gun to surf with. Now I want to try that one even more.
It's a hoot, and surfs better than many boards I've tried in the 11-14ft range. It is indeed basically just a long thin gun. The thickness and shape of the rails is surf sup not raceboard SUP. In pure flat water it's not fast. But in lively DW conditions and surf it is a total blast and is very user-friendly. It's an interesting concept for an ocean board - the shaper has gone for maximum control, surfability and fun in hell conditions rather than compromising the design by also having to worry about speed in general ocean races and flat water. It's a board for surfers IMO, and when surfers see it they tend to gather round it and go "wow, unreal!". The thickness of it is literally half that of some race boards, and it makes the Bullet, M14 etc look like they have eaten far too many McDonalds. It's very tough too - no paint chipping nonsense, and is no heavier than my 14ft Vapor (maybe lighter?) despite being 16ft long. It's got a nice SIC-(or Blue Planet-) style handle too, which makes it easy to carry in high winds. And it cost me less than a premium-brand 14fter would have, and fantastically less than a production UL (eg. SIC, NSP etc) would have. Hmm...makes you think, doesn't it?

Area 10

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #49 on: January 04, 2017, 09:59:41 AM »
^ interesting. I’d have thought a lot less for the Rail. I wonder where the volume is hidden. Not in the nose, nor the tail, nor the middle. Pick either up or just look at on the water and anyone would tell you the same. Hmmmm.
The Rail is thick in the middle. Thicker than the Bullet V2.

Area 10

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #50 on: January 04, 2017, 10:19:08 AM »
Yep - gone over that.  Definitely if single -> the AS23 and Rail 26.5 is very hard to beat.  Very hard.  But in my situation - will have to make do with my 5 boards.  Now what about A10 and all his boards?  A10 if you had to choose only 2-14' boards out of your quiver - which 2 would you pick?   :o
Err... well I hope that never happens because I need a minimum of three: flat water/race, mild downwind and big downwind. I'm looking for a new flat water board (my SIC X14 is feeling too wide these days) so I don't know what that would be. Of the 14ft ocean boards, hmm.. maybe I'd keep the Vapor and the Bullet V1. But the Coreban Dart is very useful when things go totally off-the-scale ballistic too.

Right at this moment I'm pretty much paddling the 16x24 all the time in the ocean and the 14x23 Sideswipe in pure flat water. But I'm wondering about getting something like the 2017 Fanatic Strike2 for flat water maybe. Or a Jav 2017. Perhaps a FX14. Or maybe just go custom again because I'm not sure that the brands are making particularly good flat water boards right now. For instance, I'd have a D2 but I'd like a little more volume, and I'd like a FX14 but think it probably has too much volume. And so on...

It's tricky - I'm very lucky to live somewhere where I can be paddling pure flat water glassy protected waters (or rivers) one day and downwinding in head-high ocean bumps or 50 knots the next. And then there's a variety of surf too. There's a reason I have so many boards!

Eagle

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #51 on: January 04, 2017, 10:43:08 AM »
Haha!  Variety is the spice of life for sure.   ;)
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dk78

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #52 on: January 04, 2017, 11:07:36 AM »
The Rail has the best shape for downwind paddling that I have ever tried. Starting from the nose, it doesn’t pearl for any reason, it cuts like a knife the front swell and pops out without losing any speed. Pealing is very usual on downwinders but with this board you just forget about this problem. The narrow nose also works extremely well with side chop and side swell, I have never been so trouble free with side swell as on this board. It goes like a train on the rail! The board has a big volume but it is so well distributed that you cannot feel it and the tail is stable and safe when you jump back on it. I have tried so many boards all these years and I had a lot fun with all of them. But the Rail is a class on its own.
Last but no least, it goes extremely well on flatwater for a downwind board. Without any hard effort I can paddle at almost 9km/h. Honestly, I can’t find anything that I don’t like about this board.
Note that I have no connection with the company and I paid the board as a normal customer.

yugi

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #53 on: January 04, 2017, 11:47:21 AM »
I'm looking forward to a 16' x 25 Rail! Are you listening Jimmy?

That would be an ultimate all conditions board. It could rule in DWs and be close to a 14' race board on flats. It could turn too. Look how A10 chooses to use his 16’ x 24.5 for surfing.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 11:53:39 AM by yugi »

Larry Allison

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #54 on: January 04, 2017, 12:46:28 PM »
I'd like to try an Aercor but haven't been able to buy one. I've tried several times but either I've got no reply from Larry or Jeremy Riggs or they have been out of stock.

I'm a bit suspicious about its surfing capabilities though. Many of the runs I do end with beach breaks, so you really needs fin that can surf well, not just downwind. Anyway, I enjoy surfing my DW boards in small stuff. In fact last week I surfed my 16ft x14.5" DW board on a sandbank bombora and the GPS showed a total of 4 miles spent actually wave-riding in a 2.5hr session! You couldn't do that on a 7ft short SUP (well, I couldn't, anyway).

But I'm willing to try an Aervor, if only I could actually get my hands on one. Some US sources seem reluctant to deal with overseas customers.

Hi Area10, Can't speak for Jeremy, but I looked thru my emails here on the forum and don't see any requests from you about anything. Where are you based my friend? Mahalo, Larry
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Eagle

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #55 on: January 04, 2017, 12:56:26 PM »
Larry you mentioned to me in your PM - you were getting a carbon Arecor ready to sell.  Do you have that fin available now?  And would it fit in my AS23 fin slot?
Fast is FUN!   8)
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Larry Allison

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #56 on: January 04, 2017, 03:36:12 PM »
Larry you mentioned to me in your PM - you were getting a carbon Arecor ready to sell.  Do you have that fin available now?  And would it fit in my AS23 fin slot?

Eagle, We modified the base of the new Aercor to fit 8" and 10" fin boxes, along with different structure at lower price as you and I talked about. Completion of this will now be mid to late Feb. due the demand and orders of the Allison Probox Race Twins with Ventral are first to come out in Foam/Carbon. Will keep the Zone informed. Mahalo, Larry
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DavidJohn

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #57 on: January 04, 2017, 03:57:19 PM »
"
A Naish Maliko is very low rocker. A x26 in big conditions certainly spanks me. I’ve spent a lot of time getting back on it. It’s tricky because it’s so light and accelerations are so quick that very exact balance and very good sense of what it going to do are necessary. I’m definitely getting a lot better. I don’t like this kind of board for bigger downwiders. It has more to do with its very directional, parallel outline and vertical sidewall rails than low rocker. It’s not very turny, it’s more a move back and pivot kind of board. In strong wind fresh fetch clean conditions like DJ has or the longer fast ocean rollers like Cape Town I can see it working. But, IMO, there are conditions where it just isn’t fun."

It does look like it has very little rocker but looking at the nose is very deceiving because the whole board has a continuous rocker with a lot towards the rear (not tail).. I'll have to take a pick showing how high the nose sits if you were to stand on the tail on flat ground.. I think this type of rocker is necessary to get max water-line and glide out of as short a board possible.. It does take more skill to make it work compared to your typical DW style board..

I call this shape a 'clubby-board' shape.. and they've been at this a lot longer than us..

Check out Ann's M14 [classic downwind board shape] and my seemingly flat rockered Maliko..

Check the difference at the tail [about 4 1/2''] and check the noses [about 4 1/2''].. Anyone else find that interesting..


Eagle

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #58 on: January 04, 2017, 04:20:54 PM »
Larry you mentioned to me in your PM - you were getting a carbon Arecor ready to sell.  Do you have that fin available now?  And would it fit in my AS23 fin slot?

Eagle, We modified the base of the new Aercor to fit 8" and 10" fin boxes, along with different structure at lower price as you and I talked about. Completion of this will now be mid to late Feb. due the demand and orders of the Allison Probox Race Twins with Ventral are first to come out in Foam/Carbon. Will keep the Zone informed. Mahalo, Larry

Graphics look real nice.   :)
Fast is FUN!   8)
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supuk

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Re: Winter Monsoon Downwind Vid - Best conditions of 2016
« Reply #59 on: January 04, 2017, 04:30:50 PM »
"
A Naish Maliko is very low rocker. A x26 in big conditions certainly spanks me. I’ve spent a lot of time getting back on it. It’s tricky because it’s so light and accelerations are so quick that very exact balance and very good sense of what it going to do are necessary. I’m definitely getting a lot better. I don’t like this kind of board for bigger downwiders. It has more to do with its very directional, parallel outline and vertical sidewall rails than low rocker. It’s not very turny, it’s more a move back and pivot kind of board. In strong wind fresh fetch clean conditions like DJ has or the longer fast ocean rollers like Cape Town I can see it working. But, IMO, there are conditions where it just isn’t fun."

It does look like it has very little rocker but looking at the nose is very deceiving because the whole board has a continuous rocker with a lot towards the rear (not tail).. I'll have to take a pick showing how high the nose sits if you were to stand on the tail on flat ground.. I think this type of rocker is necessary to get max water-line and glide out of as short a board possible.. It does take more skill to make it work compared to your typical DW style board..

I call this shape a 'clubby-board' shape.. and they've been at this a lot longer than us..

Check out Ann's M14 [classic downwind board shape] and my seemingly flat rockered Maliko..

Check the difference at the tail [about 4 1/2''] and check the noses [about 4 1/2''].. Anyone else find that interesting..



if you put the naish on a set of stands and do the string line between two posts and take a few measurements i can compare exactly as i think i have the 14' rocker on shape3d, the tail rockers look a lot more similar than the nose.

 


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